RE: Spotted: Porsche 944
Discussion
Fat Albert said:
and my 9 year-old can change the brakes
Good work sir ^I have driven the RPM 944 "Clubsport" mentioned in the article at a recent trackday. There's a lot more to it than meets the eye as it is running a tuned 968 engine and the RPM boys have worked some magic on the set up, including new or upgraded parts throughout. I didn't drive the car on the road but I think it makes a very compelling case as a road/track car as not only is it very capable on track, but also one can easily transport a spare set of wheels/tyres, jack and tools in the rear. A thinking man's 944 IMO.
Gary C said:
RUST !
Sills corrode from the inside out, so its not unusual for people to buy a car that looks good, only to find it needs a few K spending on welding.
Could be true- but from experience of fixing 944's that failed the Mot on rusty sills it can be done quite cheaply. If buying one you should be able to check for rust with just 2'minutes poking around underneath ( unless you are blind or stupid). Don't buy a rotten one, a good bodyshop could replace both sills for £800 plus paint - but a so called specialist might charge you double that for the same job.Sills corrode from the inside out, so its not unusual for people to buy a car that looks good, only to find it needs a few K spending on welding.
Brought my 1986' 944 turbo two years ago for £1300 with 106k no mot no elec windows,heating on full, rack pissing oil, sills needing tlc and was cat d stolen years ago. The good bits fully resprayed orig black,very healthy eng and box,plus private plate 944 gsu, 911 clubsport alloys on spacers, and mint grey porsche logo interior. Absolute brill shed! Weekend fun all the way. Love it.
Bladedancer said:
I always liked these but unless you get top of the range model (or even then possibly) in the day and age you'll struggle to keep up with a family hatchback...
Only in a drag maybe ..my dearly missed 2.7 944 could still hit 60mph in a little over 7sec
in the twisties and on the 'bahn I think not!
Oh yes and the engine roar above 4krpm was
jimfrance said:
The first car is not a Turbo S, they were all MY 88 with the M758 Option and do not have a sunroof, there are only 48 left in the UK, check the DVLA website …
Yep. We know that’s correct Jim, but there’s confusion because a lot of people get the naming wrong. Technically only the ’88 special edition cars were called the Turbo S, but the later-model cars which followed almost the same spec are what most non-experts mean when they talk about a ‘Turbo S’.Basically the MY758 Option cars were so good that Porsche eventually decided to make that the base spec for final years of production. The main discrepancy being that those runout cars (like mine) did have sunroofs. The very last Turbos also got the bridge spoiler from the S2 … but I’ve never liked that shape as much.
Fat Albert said:
Mine had bad sills and they were fixed and resparayed for £600
My white car has gone in exactly the same place due to somebody doing a poor repair in the past. As far as I can tell with my investigations by poking holes in it with a screwdriver the rest of the sills are fine. This fills me with hope!Now I just need an engine with all the components willing to stay INSIDE!
Used my turbo coupe almost daily (always had a spare vehicle but only needed it twice) from 90k to 180k. They are generally easy to work on - the workshop manuals are very good and widely available on cd or free download. They can be rusty now, my coupe has a bit in the sills, my cab has rust free, wax filled ones. It's easy to check, the vent in the b pillar comes out and a camera phone fits in.
Love driving them and have done Inverness to the south coast in one hit.
My lux whilst fun always felt like it could handle another 100bhp, that's why I bought a turbo, unfortunately that was so improved it also felt like it could handle another 100bhp. Fortunately its easier to come by in the turbo and with just under 350 it was superb.
Ref comments earlier in the thread, my 20yo Speedo was very accurate, but no way I could get near 60 in first, with a slightly raised rev limit it does do nearly 70 in second though.
Given how much a Capri or escort costs these days, the vastly superior 944 is a bargain!
Tony
Love driving them and have done Inverness to the south coast in one hit.
My lux whilst fun always felt like it could handle another 100bhp, that's why I bought a turbo, unfortunately that was so improved it also felt like it could handle another 100bhp. Fortunately its easier to come by in the turbo and with just under 350 it was superb.
Ref comments earlier in the thread, my 20yo Speedo was very accurate, but no way I could get near 60 in first, with a slightly raised rev limit it does do nearly 70 in second though.
Given how much a Capri or escort costs these days, the vastly superior 944 is a bargain!
Tony
poprock said:
jimfrance said:
The first car is not a Turbo S, they were all MY 88 with the M758 Option and do not have a sunroof, there are only 48 left in the UK, check the DVLA website …
Yep. We know that’s correct Jim, but there’s confusion because a lot of people get the naming wrong. Technically only the ’88 special edition cars were called the Turbo S, but the later-model cars which followed almost the same spec are what most non-experts mean when they talk about a ‘Turbo S’.Basically the MY758 Option cars were so good that Porsche eventually decided to make that the base spec for final years of production. The main discrepancy being that those runout cars (like mine) did have sunroofs. The very last Turbos also got the bridge spoiler from the S2 … but I’ve never liked that shape as much.
Fantastic cars though
This black cab looks very special to my eyes - would love to send mine there for an interior freshen up.
http://www.vilner.eu/en/gallery/57
Some pretty serious development went into the turbos.
However somebody will be along shortly to tell you a modern diesel hatchback or a ropey old fiat coupe turbo is quicker. I can not recall either of those being developed at Le Mans though.
http://www.vilner.eu/en/gallery/57
Some pretty serious development went into the turbos.
However somebody will be along shortly to tell you a modern diesel hatchback or a ropey old fiat coupe turbo is quicker. I can not recall either of those being developed at Le Mans though.
Edited by CharlieB on Thursday 11th October 14:25
I've had three. I bought an '88 S model in 2002 as my first Porsche. Along with the 911, it's a car that featured on my bedroom wall as a teenager; I've always liked the look of them. Having just moved on from a series of Astra GTEs it was a huge step-change in both driving experience and running costs. I used it all year round for 6 years and it proved to be a solid, reliable and very entertaining companion. The S has the reputation of having a fragile/complex cylinder head with not much (any?) extra power. And so it proved to be. Shortly after a belt-change service the cam chain tensioner mount failed causing devastation. The bottom end was OK but a replacement head was required.
While I still owned the S, I spotted an unloved, slightly rotten '88 Turbo S (a proper M758 / Silver Rose) that I reasoned could be a fun project and bought it sight unseen. This car was quite different in feel to the S, noticeably heavier to hussle around corners, lower and stiffer, with a very entertaining power delivery!
I then bought a 964 and the (still incomplete) Turbo was sold to someone who gave it a very interesting second life (perhaps he'll chime in). After a while I missed 944 ownership and purchased an S2. The S2 had the same solid build quality and secure handling balance as my previous models but something was missing. Yes, it had more power than my first S but did not have either the very revvy nature of that car nor the laugh-out-loud power delivery of the turbo. It was also heavier and appeared softly sprung and fairly inert. None of the 944s have an appealing sound track but have other charms. Except the S2, which sadly I found to be too boring. Yes, it's well built, reliable, performs well, and doesn't cost a fortune to run.....but I just never got the same feeling.
So, I sold it and bought a 2.7 Boxster to complement the 964. The Boxster reminds me more of my first 944 (the S) but with a nice induction sound and modern interior. I like it a lot.
But back to 944s with some general points:-
1) Earlier LUX/S models have 2-piece sliding brake calipers, which are not has strong (just about adequate) as the later brembos but do not require costly rebuilds.
2) I had less sill rot with my early car. Many attribute this to the fact that they do not have the plastic aero sill trims that can trap moisture.
3) All need to have their timing belts changed every 3 years to be safe. I changed the belt on my S after 3.5 years and although still running well it was missing a few teeth on the rubber belt.
4) As well as the sills, also look out for rust around the rear suspension mounts, rear wheel arch and rear number plate panel.
I quite agree with the conclusion in the article at the top of this thread. If I were going to return to 944 ownership it would be with the mintiest Lux model that I could find. I prefer the pre Turbo/S2 bumpers. But, it would have to be a 85.5 onward, not sure I could handle that early interior! A nice turbo would be my second choice.
While I still owned the S, I spotted an unloved, slightly rotten '88 Turbo S (a proper M758 / Silver Rose) that I reasoned could be a fun project and bought it sight unseen. This car was quite different in feel to the S, noticeably heavier to hussle around corners, lower and stiffer, with a very entertaining power delivery!
I then bought a 964 and the (still incomplete) Turbo was sold to someone who gave it a very interesting second life (perhaps he'll chime in). After a while I missed 944 ownership and purchased an S2. The S2 had the same solid build quality and secure handling balance as my previous models but something was missing. Yes, it had more power than my first S but did not have either the very revvy nature of that car nor the laugh-out-loud power delivery of the turbo. It was also heavier and appeared softly sprung and fairly inert. None of the 944s have an appealing sound track but have other charms. Except the S2, which sadly I found to be too boring. Yes, it's well built, reliable, performs well, and doesn't cost a fortune to run.....but I just never got the same feeling.
So, I sold it and bought a 2.7 Boxster to complement the 964. The Boxster reminds me more of my first 944 (the S) but with a nice induction sound and modern interior. I like it a lot.
But back to 944s with some general points:-
1) Earlier LUX/S models have 2-piece sliding brake calipers, which are not has strong (just about adequate) as the later brembos but do not require costly rebuilds.
2) I had less sill rot with my early car. Many attribute this to the fact that they do not have the plastic aero sill trims that can trap moisture.
3) All need to have their timing belts changed every 3 years to be safe. I changed the belt on my S after 3.5 years and although still running well it was missing a few teeth on the rubber belt.
4) As well as the sills, also look out for rust around the rear suspension mounts, rear wheel arch and rear number plate panel.
I quite agree with the conclusion in the article at the top of this thread. If I were going to return to 944 ownership it would be with the mintiest Lux model that I could find. I prefer the pre Turbo/S2 bumpers. But, it would have to be a 85.5 onward, not sure I could handle that early interior! A nice turbo would be my second choice.
UK952 said:
Given how much a Capri or escort costs these days, the vastly superior 944 is a bargain!
Tony
Amen to that, I really dont get the mental prices being asked for Capri's, much as I have a fondness for them they are nowhere near any 944 in terms of quality, handling or anything, think it must be nostalgia, 2.8 Capri or a 944 is a no brainer, suppose you can get 4 in a Capri which might swing it.Tony
As for struggling to dispatch a family hatchback, hmm, a poorly 2.5 Auto will never be fast but I had an Audi newish A3 diesel try it, he got his arse handed to him, I expected better from it to be honest as on the move they seem to punch above their weight but from a standstill the 944 was quite a bit faster, think the in gear torque thing doesnt work from a standstill and with being FWD, short geared, similar weight but 60-70 bhp down means it was not as quick, there is 7 or 8 seconds in it 0-100 between an Audi A3 140 tdi (assume it was) and an 944 S2, performance wise you need more of the R32/3.2 A3 to be on par in a straight line. A new Focus RS with many stickers was faster but strangely took until higher speeds to pull any significant distance, perhaps traction was an issue ?
That said, if I wanted to buy an A3 diesel, I could get one, if I wanted to "beat" all other cars I could get something faster, its about being fast enough to keep you interested and about being a package rather than a powerful engine strapped to something rubbish to go fast, I have had loads of Swedish turbo barges with more power but to be honest, though good cars they are a one trick Pony, 250 plus bhp throigh the front wheels, they accelerate well but not much else.
J4CKO said:
UK952 said:
Given how much a Capri or escort costs these days, the vastly superior 944 is a bargain!
Tony
Amen to that, I really dont get the mental prices being asked for Capri's, much as I have a fondness for them they are nowhere near any 944 in terms of quality, handling or anything, think it must be nostalgia, 2.8 Capri or a 944 is a no brainer, suppose you can get 4 in a Capri which might swing it.Tony
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