Discussion
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-19979380
I didn't actually think this was legal in the EU?
I like the way they're billing the fact that it removes steering feel as one of the advantages.
I didn't actually think this was legal in the EU?
I like the way they're billing the fact that it removes steering feel as one of the advantages.
BBC News said:
Nissan said that users would benefit from an improved driving experience since their intentions would be transmitted to the wheels faster than by using a hydraulic and mechanical system
Sorry, but what!? Surely mechanical has near enough instant reactions? The only real delay, I would have thought, would be twisting and flexing in the materials used, of which I can see very little.Edited by BriC175 on Thursday 18th October 09:30
BBC News said:
Nissan appears to have borne these issues in mind by deciding to install a back-up clutch system in its steer-by-wire vehicles, to link up their steering wheels and tyres in the event of a problem.
However, it signalled it hoped to be able to ditch the safety measure in the long term.
"If we are freed from that, we would be able to place the steering wheel wherever we like," said Masaharu Satou, a Nissan engineer.
"Such as in the back seat, or it would be possible to steer the car with a joystick."
Surely the best place to put the steering wheel would be up front where the driver can see what's going on in front of him/her? However, it signalled it hoped to be able to ditch the safety measure in the long term.
"If we are freed from that, we would be able to place the steering wheel wherever we like," said Masaharu Satou, a Nissan engineer.
"Such as in the back seat, or it would be possible to steer the car with a joystick."
Saab tried the Joystick idea years ago which was ditched for safety fears and quite rightly imo. Do these modern designers actually pay attention to what happens before them? it would only take a day or so of research and they'd find out some interesting ideas that have already been done and scrapped for idiocy.
I don't think they realise how much steering feel affects the ability to place a car on the road accurately. also if its anything like the electric PAS on some cars it can be rather slow to respond.
And how can a bunch of rather high powered electric motors (and the necessary increased Alternator) be lighter than a metal shaft and some UJs?
I can see where this came from. One of the technical designers on a nissan was overheard making a flippant comment that laying out the engine bay would be so much easier if he didn't have to worry about the shaft to the steering wheel. So now they're going to try and make one.
I wonder what would happen if the mech clutch cuts in suddenly - likely to pull the wheel from your grip?
And how can a bunch of rather high powered electric motors (and the necessary increased Alternator) be lighter than a metal shaft and some UJs?
I can see where this came from. One of the technical designers on a nissan was overheard making a flippant comment that laying out the engine bay would be so much easier if he didn't have to worry about the shaft to the steering wheel. So now they're going to try and make one.
I wonder what would happen if the mech clutch cuts in suddenly - likely to pull the wheel from your grip?
nosittap said:
As a driving enthusiast, I think it's a shocking idea, but it'll probably never make it into a 'drivers' car anytime soon if ever.
People were saying the same about electrically assisted power steering a few years ago... I think this is just the next step down that path. kambites said:
renrut said:
I wonder what would happen if the mech clutch cuts in suddenly - likely to pull the wheel from your grip?
I'd be more worried about what will happen if the car's power fails and the clutch doesn't cut in. 
Either way, another way to remove involvement from the drive. Perhaps they'll have super granny mode available that means 0 resistance and totally insulates them from all the kerbs etc that they mow into.
Edited by Krikkit on Thursday 18th October 10:18
Edited by Krikkit on Thursday 18th October 10:19
Didn't everyone say the same about power steering when it was introduced? Have you tried steering a car when the PAS has failed recently?
Performance-wise, there are some very interesting possibilities - once you remove the mechanical link between steering wheel and the wheels themselves you can control them independently.
Performance-wise, there are some very interesting possibilities - once you remove the mechanical link between steering wheel and the wheels themselves you can control them independently.
kambites said:
Captain Muppet said:
Is that a steering column in their diagram?
It's a clutched steering column as an active fail-safe. Which presumably also needs to be activated by the computer that they're worried about failing. This one might not come back to bite them in the form of customers staying away. But what we really do not need is for the white-goods car-buying masses who already have little appreciation of what driving should involve to suddenly have to do even less work and therefore pay even less attention to what's going on..
Anyway, in terms of "improving response" or any other technical advance, for the mechanical backup system to work there needs to be a solid link to the wheels just like now, rather than simply motors actuating each wheel. So surely all this system does is take your steering angle, run it through the computer, then operate the mechanical link itself?
sjg said:
Didn't everyone say the same about power steering when it was introduced? Have you tried steering a car when the PAS has failed recently?
Performance-wise, there are some very interesting possibilities - once you remove the mechanical link between steering wheel and the wheels themselves you can control them independently.
Yes they almost certainly did. PAS going is a big shock but you don't have the same issues, you're still holding the wheel with some grip and applying some force.Performance-wise, there are some very interesting possibilities - once you remove the mechanical link between steering wheel and the wheels themselves you can control them independently.
And to keep a mechanical backup you'll still need the wheels connected to eachother. Independant wheels doesn't really work - why would you need that other than weird parking maneuvers?
sjg said:
Didn't everyone say the same about power steering when it was introduced? Have you tried steering a car when the PAS has failed recently?
Performance-wise, there are some very interesting possibilities - once you remove the mechanical link between steering wheel and the wheels themselves you can control them independently.
Now that is interesting, perfect ackerman, no bumpsteer, more freedom to put the tie rods where you want them meaning more freedom on the layout of the front end. And as they say in the article, you can put the steering wheel anywhere you want.. rear and 4 wheel steer becomes easier...Performance-wise, there are some very interesting possibilities - once you remove the mechanical link between steering wheel and the wheels themselves you can control them independently.
sjg said:
Didn't everyone say the same about power steering when it was introduced? Have you tried steering a car when the PAS has failed recently?
At least if power steering fails it tends to continue going in a straight line and you have dome control. A bug in the firmware in this could make the car go anywhere. 
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