RE: Renault and Caterham join forces

[Civpilot]

Spooky timing as yesterday I saw a lovely condition Alpine A110 on the road just outside Fleet, Hampshire and was going to post a spotted on hear today.
Seen them loads at car shows and meets, but I think it was the first one i have actually seen 'in the wild' surrounded by normal cars. Utterly stunning and so very very small. Sounded fantastic too

[rudecherub]

So a French Company is using French government money to buy British RWD sports car expertise and brand-name, to build a car in France?


As great as the product maybe I feel kind of cold inside.

[ewenm]

rudecherub said:

So a French Company is using French government money to buy British RWD sports car expertise and brand-name, to build a car in France?


As great as the product maybe I feel kind of cold inside.

Does it matter where the cash comes from? After all, most of the cash for the British expertise and brand currently comes from a wealthy Malaysian...

Hopefully this is good news for Caterham employees and for the car company's future.

[rudecherub]

ewenm said:

rudecherub said:

So a French Company is using French government money to buy British RWD sports car expertise and brand-name, to build a car in France?


As great as the product maybe I feel kind of cold inside.

Does it matter where the cash comes from? After all, most of the cash for the British expertise and brand currently comes from a wealthy Malaysian...

Hopefully this is good news for Caterham employees and for the car company's future.

Yes it matters. I have no problem with a Wealth from any where in the world doing business in the UK

But they aren't. It's manufacturing in France.

My concern is about Governments distorting the Market by subsidising their own manufacturers.

[ewenm]

Some of that French Government money will make it across the Channel. That's better than none of it doing so. The manufacturing site is not the only consideration (although it may well be the major one).

[nosittap]

I've managed to go all day without finding out the F1 results, I was intending to watch it on iplayer tonight and have avoided any news source, I then think to myself 'oh a cheekey PH article wont do any harm, ooo, RS and Caterham joining forces, this should be interesting'. Bugger.

[Dave Hedgehog]

fantastic news

surprised they didn't use lotus as they share an F1 car

[otolith]

nosittap said:

I've managed to go all day without finding out the F1 results, I was intending to watch it on iplayer tonight and have avoided any news source, I then think to myself 'oh a cheekey PH article wont do any harm, ooo, RS and Caterham joining forces, this should be interesting'. Bugger.

Same here.

[marshalla]

Dave Hedgehog said:

fantastic news

surprised they didn't use lotus as they share an F1 car

They don't.

Neither Renault nor Lotus has any direct input to the car from Enstone (except for the engine).

Historically, Alpine & Lotus were rivals anyway.

[GhepardoGTS]

Will Caterham finally take over Lotus' Elise/Exige lineup and redesign them as both Caterham and Alpine cars? That may be the most cost effective solution, and Renault could benefit in volume by supplying their superb Renaultsport 4 cylinder engines. Redesigned frp body panels for each brand will cost next to nothing from their perspective.

[kambites]

GhepardoGTS said:

Will Caterham finally take over Lotus' Elise/Exige lineup and redesign them as both Caterham and Alpine cars? That may be the most cost effective solution, and Renault could benefit in volume by supplying their superb Renaultsport 4 cylinder engines. Redesigned frp body panels for each brand will cost next to nothing from their perspective.

I don't think Lotus would sell the platform; certainly not while they're still using it!

I also don't think Renault would want to be associated with anything quite so hard to get in and out of - everything else that keeps the Elise from the mass market could be worked around (albeit by adding weight) but the width and height of the sills is a fundamental part of the tub design.

[tommy vercetti]

Maldini35 said:

Can't help but feel excited by this story.

+1

[ludoZ3]

[quote=rudecherub]So a French Company is using French government money to buy British RWD sports car expertise and brand-name, to build a car in France?
[quote]
So you're saying that renault sport brand name is not as strong as caterham? you may argue this point but please, the RWD expertise, caterham, really?! The design of the Renault spyder was more advanced than any product ever designed by Caterham to date...

[kambites]

ludoZ3]udecherub said:

So a French Company is using French government money to buy British RWD sports car expertise and brand-name, to build a car in France?
[quote/]
So you're saying that renault sport brand name is not as strong as caterham? you may argue this point but please, the RWD expertise, caterham, really?! The design of the Renault spyder was more advanced than any product ever designed by Caterham to date...

More advanced yes but the car was a flop, at least partly because it didn't drive anywhere near as well as the Elise.

You can have all the modern technology you want, but in that market if your car is poor to drive, it wont sell. I strongly suspect that Alfa will have the same problem with the 4C.

Edited by kambites on Monday 5th November 18:55

[BlueMR2]

Looks very much like a Lotus elise/exige with a bodykit.

Who did you say the designer used to work for .

[otolith]

ludoZ3 said:

you may argue this point but please, the RWD expertise, caterham, really?! The design of the Renault spyder was more advanced than any product ever designed by Caterham to date...

And how much RWD work have Renault done in the last six months - the last year - the last decade? How many engineers who worked on the spyder are still there, in hands-on jobs? Compared to Caterham which does nothing else but build rear drive sports cars?

[DonkeyApple]

Dave Hedgehog said:

fantastic news

surprised they didn't use lotus as they share an F1 car

Does kind of tell you what they think of Lotus as an actual car business rather than one which exists to hurl other people's money about.

Or it's simply that the partner needed to bring money to the table along with expertise.

Regardless, I bet it's easier to do business with one man like TF than with a committee of people too scared of losing their job to make real Descisions and having to get going to the toilet approved by their boss in Asia?

[GTRene]

otolith said:

ludoZ3 said:

you may argue this point but please, the RWD expertise, caterham, really?! The design of the Renault spyder was more advanced than any product ever designed by Caterham to date...

And how much RWD work have Renault done in the last six months - the last year - the last decade? How many engineers who worked on the spyder are still there, in hands-on jobs? Compared to Caterham which does nothing else but build rear drive sports cars?

you can also ask when was the last time Caterham made a coupe or tin-top ? car...

Caterham does the 7 but the & is almost 7-up ;-)
together you can do more, so I don't see the problem as long we as customers get some nice cars.

oh...and Renault also do trucks those have RWD

and ow...the last decade? they made the Renaults V6 Clio...
and they still do F1 those have rwd too ;-)

Edited by GTRene on Monday 5th November 19:27

[jbi]

Bye Bye caterham...

couldn't have picked a worse partner

[BertBert]

otolith said:

And how much RWD work have Renault done in the last six months - the last year - the last decade? How many engineers who worked on the spyder are still there, in hands-on jobs? Compared to Caterham which does nothing else but build rear drive sports cars?

And how much RWD R&D have caterham done in that time? Well there was the CSR. Not been a huge success that one and er, well, er. Let's not forget the time they got rid of a radius arm and replaced it with a watt linkage. So bugger all really. Silly me, forgot the huge RWD R&D that went into the SV. So really extensive experience then. Oh and a lot of bodged bracing to stop the diff jumping out.