RE: Holy smoke - Jag's 70s diesel flirtations

[big_boz]

E38Ross said:

well it did say they were looking at diesel because petrol was too expensive

OK you can have that one

[Dr Interceptor]

Dan Trent said:

Noted!

Disclaimer: Picture for illustrative purposes only!



Cheers,

Dan

Although fair play for using a photo of the actual SD1 Diesel, and not just a generic SD1

[P2BS]

vdubbin said:

Wasn't there a rash of DIY diesel swaps during the 80s? ISTR Isuzu and Iveco lumps finding their way into a variety of Jags when petrol prices started climbing again?

In Ireland it was the big Toyota & Datsun/Nissan diesel engines & boxes that were transplanted into anything they could fit in - usually BMW E28's and E32's, Toyota Cressida, Datsun Laurel. Smokey old barges that ran forever!
Worth adding that the UK brands were about the last to get into diesels (as mentioned in the article); the rest of Europe was driving the Opel Rekord, Fiat 131/132/Argenta/Croma (first Di diesel in a car, Montego was the 2nd) long beforehand. Not that it's a boast, they had for the most part a dangerous 70-something bhp - but they did sip fuel.

[Upatdawn]

Damned if my Mk3 Mondeo will do better than 50mpg, im gutted, id swap BHP for MPG anyday

[tobinen]

VM diesel motors were shte in Jeeps in the 90s so would've been a disaster in a Jag.

[LewisR]

Upatdawn said:

Damned if my Mk3 Mondeo will do better than 50mpg, im gutted, id swap BHP for MPG anyday

How many mpg do you want? If I had a car that did that many I'd be at a loss driving past all those fuel stations and saving money. I'm perfectly happy with 30mpg.

[Upatdawn]

The fact is we get no more MPG now than 30 years ago, my Montego Td did 50 15 years ago, my Mk3 Cortina did 30mpg

so why?......

In theory (at least) (and apart from any mickey mouse cars) 50mpg should be the LEAST we get, 100mpg would be better, now who WOULDNT want that? I can think of two - HMG and the oil companies

Mr King continued: "A fall of 2.27 billion litres in UK fuel sales over the first six months of this year compared to the same period in 2008 has got to bring some sense of reality to the fuel market and the Government."

http://news.sky.com/story/992542/fuel-sales-slump-...

So sales fall.....lets jack the price up (inc duty and VAT) to compensate! YAYYYYYY!

Edited by Upatdawn on Wednesday 14th November 14:47

[VladD]

chrisemersons98 said:

St John Smythe said:

Another diesel vs petrol argument thread. Great.

Ditto, great! 18 posts though and nobody has mentioned TVRs which is a miracle as some people seem to find any excuse they can to get onto TVRs on here lol.

There's a very good reason for that newbie.

[big_boz]

VladD said:

chrisemersons98 said:

St John Smythe said:

Another diesel vs petrol argument thread. Great.

Ditto, great! 18 posts though and nobody has mentioned TVRs which is a miracle as some people seem to find any excuse they can to get onto TVRs on here lol.

There's a very good reason for that newbie.

That's right, you haven't got 3k posts so your a newbie and your ruining what used to be a good forum with you il-educated views...Oh i remember when this was just a message board...Blah Blah Blah

[Rammy76]

P2BS said:

Not that it's a boast, they had for the most part a dangerous 70-something bhp - but they did sip fuel.

Strange statement to make.

70 BHP would only be classed as dangerous if you allow yourself to get in a situation which allows it to be.

I've driven many low powered cars and yet to find them dangerous.

[VladD]

big_boz said:

VladD said:

chrisemersons98 said:

St John Smythe said:

Another diesel vs petrol argument thread. Great.

Ditto, great! 18 posts though and nobody has mentioned TVRs which is a miracle as some people seem to find any excuse they can to get onto TVRs on here lol.

There's a very good reason for that newbie.

That's right, you haven't got 3k posts so your a newbie and your ruining what used to be a good forum with you il-educated views...Oh i remember when this was just a message board...Blah Blah Blah

Actually he's a newbie because he's new here (hence the term new-bie) and probably doesn't know that PH started as a TVR site. HTH.

[peteA]

Well...just to complicate the petrol vs diesel issue...would it be fair to say that we PHer's would 'generally' all prefer a petrol engine but with the mpg of a diesel?

Reason I ask is I've just spent a day with a 5 Series Hybrid - 3 litre turbo petrol with an electric motor & batteries...loved it!

Used to have a BMW 320D SE and now have a Merc C250 CDi sport auto and whilst they are very good cars I have never got used to the diesel clatter in the morning and the 'thrum' under acceleration.

The hybrid on the other hand...when in Eco-pro mode returned just over 50 mpg and is whisper quiet - the engine cuts in and out and you just cant tell...only the rev counter gives the game away. You even find yourself trying to stay in electric only mode for as long as possible. Put it in sport mode and the the steering, suspension and throttle all 'beef up' and when you put your foot down the engine and electric motor work together and blast you up the road with a glorious turbine like shove...right up to 7500 rpm! Very un Diesel like! When ragged it was averaging about 25 mpg...? Its proper jekyll and hyde stuff.

Only downside is the list price - quite pricey?

My 3 Series M Sport Hybrid arrives in a couple of weeks - can't wait!

Well worth having a shot in one if you get the chance.

Edited by peteA on Wednesday 14th November 16:50

[big_boz]

VladD said:

Actually he's a newbie because he's new here (hence the term new-bie) and probably doesn't know that PH started as a TVR site. HTH.

I was only pulling your leg...And as your previous cars include a TVR well done on the restraint!

[MogulBoy]

In 1992 I wrote what I thought was a brilliant application letter for a graduate entry job at Jaguar. In it, I explained how excited I was at the possibility of joining the company as it fast approached the point whereupon it would surely be compelled to find a way to embrace diesel engine technologies whilst maintaining the alure of the marque or words to that effect...

Needless to say, I never received a reply.

[V8 FOU]

andymadmak said:

Didn't British Leyland also look at doing a diesel version of the Rover (Buick) V8? I seem to remember they had major difficulties with refinement so dropped it after a while. I was told (possibly wrongly) that it was so as to prevent THIS engine being used in a Jaguar(rather than the petrol V8 version) that the XJ40 engine bay was deliberately designed to be too narrow to accept a 90deg V8 - but would accept an in line 6 and a 60deg V12!

The Iceberg.
No, I don't know why it was called that either. They had the usual head sealing problems of dieselising a petrol engine. And it was BL, of course.....

[Prawnboy]

Good old lyons, one of the reasons i would have an XK over a 6 series would be because there isn't a raft of 3 litre diesel ones around......although i have not the money for those fancy machines anyway.

and bless the old boy, but ford saved jaguar, granted they made some strange desisions, (x type) but they are the start of where jag are today.

for full discloser i have a ford jag

[MadmanO/T People]

P2BS said:

In Ireland it was the big Toyota & Datsun/Nissan diesel engines & boxes that were transplanted into anything they could fit in - usually BMW E28's and E32's, Toyota Cressida, Datsun Laurel. Smokey old barges that ran forever!
Worth adding that the UK brands were about the last to get into diesels (as mentioned in the article); the rest of Europe was driving the Opel Rekord, Fiat 131/132/Argenta/Croma (first Di diesel in a car, Montego was the 2nd) long beforehand. Not that it's a boast, they had for the most part a dangerous 70-something bhp - but they did sip fuel.

In America, it was a slightly different story. Back in the '70s and '80s, there was a veritable cottage industry built around dropping Chevy 350 cu.in. (5.7 litre) V8 engines into Jaguars. Not because the smallblock Chevy was easier on fuel but because (according to legend) the six and twelve cylinder Jags of that era were so damn unreliable!

Every now and then, I still come across an old Jag with a Chevy V8 conversion over here.

[fourwheelsteer]

P2BS said:

In Ireland it was the big Toyota & Datsun/Nissan diesel engines & boxes that were transplanted into anything they could fit in - usually BMW E28's and E32's, Toyota Cressida, Datsun Laurel. Smokey old barges that ran forever!
Worth adding that the UK brands were about the last to get into diesels (as mentioned in the article); the rest of Europe was driving the Opel Rekord, Fiat 131/132/Argenta/Croma (first Di diesel in a car, Montego was the 2nd) long beforehand. Not that it's a boast, they had for the most part a dangerous 70-something bhp - but they did sip fuel.

Pity BMC/BL didn't have more success with its diesel offerings. There was a diesel variant of the BMC 'farina saloons (Morris Oxford/Austin Cambridge) in the 1960s. It used a dieselised BMC B-series engine which didn't have much power (IIRC the top speed was about 70mph) but they were probably economical and mechanically un-killable.

I don't know if the same engine was later fitted to the Morris Marina diesel. Yes, if a petrol-powered Marina isn't off-putting enough you could get one with tractor power! Can't imagine why it didn't sell well...

[chrisemersons98]

VladD said:

Actually he's a newbie because he's new here (hence the term new-bie) and probably doesn't know that PH started as a TVR site. HTH.

Actually i didn't know PH started as a TVR site, sadly my memories of TVR's are mostly unpleasant, which is why i find it hard to understand the fascination now.

Sorry chaps i got you off topic.....

[chrisemersons98]

fourwheelsteer said:

Pity BMC/BL didn't have more success with its diesel offerings. There was a diesel variant of the BMC 'farina saloons (Morris Oxford/Austin Cambridge) in the 1960s. It used a dieselised BMC B-series engine which didn't have much power (IIRC the top speed was about 70mph) but they were probably economical and mechanically un-killable.

I don't know if the same engine was later fitted to the Morris Marina diesel. Yes, if a petrol-powered Marina isn't off-putting enough you could get one with tractor power! Can't imagine why it didn't sell well...

Embarrassingly i was given a maestro diesel as a company car many years ago, possibly the worst, slowest, miserable car i have ever driven. I think that must've had a the morris oxford diesel in it. Flat out it would just touch 65mph up one of the hills on the M62 !!