RE: Chris Harris Video: Hot Hatch Showdown
Discussion
345 bhp (from a remap I presume) a LSD and better brakes and suspension would shave off 4 seconds I think. Pointless comparing modded to standard though.
The RS is a better track car (both standard) but the Golf is a better daily driver IMO and better ownership proposition (lower depreciation etc).
The RS is a better track car (both standard) but the Golf is a better daily driver IMO and better ownership proposition (lower depreciation etc).
Edited by the stigs dad on Sunday 25th November 13:45
the stigs dad said:
But considerably faster than a civic type S.
It really has no right to be named with these hot hatches. 6 seconds slower in the above post? Thats massive.
Golf GTi's are boring and slow, and those tartan seats are the most awful crap ive ever seen in a car.
Agoogy said:
Yet when reviewed by the motoring press, the Mk5 was widely regarded as the best of the bunch, and having re-found it's mojo...
So subjectively you don't like, it.
Objectively it still counts as one of the best.
Yeah i remember the top gear round up, the CTR and all the other hatches were faster than the golf, yet clarksons stupid bias towards golf gti's made it the best?So subjectively you don't like, it.
Objectively it still counts as one of the best.
Stop talking about golf's im bored already. These 3 cars would piss over a golf, hell my 10 year old DC5 was faster.
Grovsie26 said:
Yeah i remember the top gear round up, the CTR and all the other hatches were faster than the golf, yet clarksons stupid bias towards golf gti's made it the best?
Stop talking about golf's im bored already. These 3 cars would piss over a golf, hell my 10 year old DC5 was faster.
Ahh you're a top trumps player... fair enough I'll leave you to Top Gear and comparing stats Stop talking about golf's im bored already. These 3 cars would piss over a golf, hell my 10 year old DC5 was faster.
Golfs are so crap and slow they continue to sell well and vw go from strenght to strenght buying other marques and returning good profits.
It's funny that a civic type S driver says that golf gti's are so crap and slow!
Yes they are not the fastest hot hatch around a track but as a daily driver they are the most complete package, being good at everything not a one trick pony.
Go away and drive your honda tractor and stfu.
It's funny that a civic type S driver says that golf gti's are so crap and slow!
Yes they are not the fastest hot hatch around a track but as a daily driver they are the most complete package, being good at everything not a one trick pony.
Go away and drive your honda tractor and stfu.
TameRacingDriver said:
El Shafto said:
The thing I am struggling to overcome is that I would still rather have the previous models of all three....based solely on looks as well. The last ST just looked so much lairier (not to mention the attraction of the bigger engine and 3 door formula). The last Astra VXR looked aggressive.
I like my cars to look angry. A good car should look like it's about to eat your children (see the latest Evo for perfect example). And unfortunately these 3 models all look far too sedated. This is the modern gentrification of the hot hatch...and I don't like it. Hot hatches should be absolute hooligans!
That's odd, because really, the old 3 didn't look that aggressive either. The Focus in particular was quite bland looking.I like my cars to look angry. A good car should look like it's about to eat your children (see the latest Evo for perfect example). And unfortunately these 3 models all look far too sedated. This is the modern gentrification of the hot hatch...and I don't like it. Hot hatches should be absolute hooligans!
Compare that with an old Escort Cosworth, Astra GTE 16v, etc and they all look very tame.
The old VXR was pretty aggressive too. Megane was pretty s
te though. Had an odd bum too.That shape Focus does ride far too high though, which Ford kind of recognised as it sold a lowering kit as an accessory.
Good video, but not seen anything that would make me trade mine (or a previous gen VXR) in for one. The Focus does look much better in the flesh though. Probably because its too big to take in the horror at once.
Really not sure why people are championing the M135i. Dab of oppo is not worth compromising the rear passenger comfort and boot space when you consider these vehicles are supposed to be sensible hatchbacks made a bit warm.
Golfs are bland-o-matics these days, and I say that as a massive fan of their previous work. They're not 'bad' just a bit 'meh'. Very capable though if thats what you want.
Edited by KarlMac on Monday 26th November 11:44
Edited by KarlMac on Monday 26th November 11:46
the stigs dad said:
Golfs are so crap and slow they continue to sell well and vw go from strenght to strenght buying other marques and returning good profits.
Well there you have it. That means the golf GTI is better because VW are a big company.LOL i guess lotus and noble are s
te because there small companies?The golf would get owned by these 3 hatches, it was slow when it came out, it would get pillaged now.
Grovsie26 said:
Well there you have it. That means the golf GTI is better because VW are a big company.
LOL i guess lotus and noble are ste because there small companies?
The golf would get owned by these 3 hatches, it was slow when it came out, it would get pillaged now.
Da Grove, he be onnit man I'm tellin' ya, off dem lights doze tree will be crazee fast and murder dat bLOL i guess lotus and noble are s
te because there small companies?The golf would get owned by these 3 hatches, it was slow when it came out, it would get pillaged now.
h Golf ya get me....it would be like totally engine raped...yeeeeah.Grovsie26 said:
Well there you have it. That means the golf GTI is better because VW are a big company.
LOL i guess lotus and noble are ste because there small companies?
The golf would get owned by these 3 hatches, it was slow when it came out, it would get pillaged now.
You sound like a giant mental.LOL i guess lotus and noble are s
te because there small companies?The golf would get owned by these 3 hatches, it was slow when it came out, it would get pillaged now.
KarlMac said:
Really not sure why people are championing the M135i. Dab of oppo is not worth compromising the rear passenger comfort and boot space when you consider these vehicles are supposed to be sensible hatchbacks made a bit warm.
The BMW has a longer wheelbase (2690mm vs 2648mm) and a bigger boot (360L vs 316L) than the Focus, so if anything the Ford is compromised, despite being front wheel drive. nickfrog said:
KarlMac said:
Really not sure why people are championing the M135i. Dab of oppo is not worth compromising the rear passenger comfort and boot space when you consider these vehicles are supposed to be sensible hatchbacks made a bit warm.
The BMW has a longer wheelbase (2690mm vs 2648mm) and a bigger boot (360L vs 316L) than the Focus, so if anything the Ford is compromised, despite being front wheel drive. Again, not sure the M135 is a fair comparison for these cars. For me it falls into the gt86/370z market.
- edit*
Still looks like s
t on a stick though, but so do the other three.Edited by KarlMac on Monday 26th November 13:23
What's interesting about the video is that the ST isn't the hottest version of the Focus and the Megane has been out for a good few years. It basically means Vauxhall have shown their hand already and have shown they are not up to scratch in the hot hatch battle. Considering the ST and 265 produced similar lap times (in the video) might hint at the performance of the Focus RS and the next gen Megane. Could it be possible that the 8 minute lap time barrier at the ring is broken? The Renault was only around 7-8 seconds off the pace i think....
I also agree with the sentiment that Golfs don't belong in this battle. Their target market is completely different and i think Golf's tend to strive for all round ability when actually they don't really excel at anything (for enthusiasts anyway).
I also agree with the sentiment that Golfs don't belong in this battle. Their target market is completely different and i think Golf's tend to strive for all round ability when actually they don't really excel at anything (for enthusiasts anyway).
KarlMac said:
nickfrog said:
KarlMac said:
Really not sure why people are championing the M135i. Dab of oppo is not worth compromising the rear passenger comfort and boot space when you consider these vehicles are supposed to be sensible hatchbacks made a bit warm.
The BMW has a longer wheelbase (2690mm vs 2648mm) and a bigger boot (360L vs 316L) than the Focus, so if anything the Ford is compromised, despite being front wheel drive. Again, not sure the M135 is a fair comparison for these cars. For me it falls into the gt86/370z market.
- edit*
Still looks like s
t on a stick though, but so do the other three.Edited by KarlMac on Monday 26th November 13:23
MidnightRunner said:
What's interesting about the video is that the ST isn't the hottest version of the Focus and the Megane has been out for a good few years. It basically means Vauxhall have shown their hand already and have shown they are not up to scratch in the hot hatch battle. Considering the ST and 265 produced similar lap times (in the video) might hint at the performance of the Focus RS and the next gen Megane. Could it be possible that the 8 minute lap time barrier at the ring is broken? The Renault was only around 7-8 seconds off the pace i think....
I also agree with the sentiment that Golfs don't belong in this battle. Their target market is completely different and i think Golf's tend to strive for all round ability when actually they don't really excel at anything (for enthusiasts anyway).
Trouble is the Golf GTI was the bench when launched (MK1)a good few years back and as time moved on to the current crop companies like Renault went hardcore putting diffs and the like into their hottest versions.I also agree with the sentiment that Golfs don't belong in this battle. Their target market is completely different and i think Golf's tend to strive for all round ability when actually they don't really excel at anything (for enthusiasts anyway).
VW never went down this road which was a shame....the Haldex system is a great marketing incentive but is useless for track work.They should have gone down the RS or Megane route with a proper diff.
The Megane is no doubt a great package and perhaps VW should take stock and make a similar hardcore GTI. They seem to cater for the mass market but provide a rounded capable package for most.
My point with the Edition 30 and 35 models is that they can be a great track package on a smaller budget with some additional track orientated items such as the aforementioned parts. I went APR Stage 2 mapping with their HPFP fuel pump exhaist system a quaiffe and AP brakes together with KW Clubsports. All in all much cheaper than the asking price of these new models.I couldn't justify 30k on a hatch ....that's a nice E92 M3 money.
For me I use an old school 2 litre 16V Golf pushing over 200bhp in a light weight shell and diff. It looks OE and gives me the craving I need for track and in it's current spec is very quick for the money....and for my daily / family drive I have a derv Audi which does what is says on the tin.
I sure all three of these hatches are very good in their own ways but the price of them is balooning to even higher unaffordable levels for most!! They will make great buys on the second hand market in a few years.
Edited by Msportman on Monday 26th November 18:30
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