RE: MG to reinvent sports car

[will01]

the uk is crying out for more retro styled cars, come on years ago we got the mini, and the beetle, but now we have another new beetle.
i reckon a new retro styled mgb or midget would be a fantastic way to re-kick MG back into the uk market, after all MG used to be known for sporty cars.
just as long as they keep it simple of course and not add lots of boring electrics to dull down the experience of whatever they make, come on the mx5 was and still is hugely successful

[odyssey2200]

phoenixz said:

if they have decent funding now, then why not buy TVR from that Russian child?

And what would they do with it?

[JDMDrifter]

Simple RWD 1.6-2.0 coupe size of an mx5 , make it around 15k in basic trim. By basic i mean no TCS, small 165x15 steelies , manual 5 speed , no aircon , no satnav , cloth seats. Proper cheap and cheerful sports car

[renrut]

kambites said:

suffolk009 said:

Got to be a new Midget.

Would be nice to see someone try that - something along the lines of the Smart Roadster but cheaper and with a sensible gearbox. The question is, would enough people buy it? I suspect the answer is "no" because it wont have huge blingy wheels and a million horsepower.

I'm not sure about that - make it small, with a small engine, cheeky performance thanks to its size and stylish without being a fashion victim. Crucially make sure its in the lowest tax bands and gets circa 60+mpg which should be possible with a little thought. Plenty of people would like a 'sports car' but not the running costs of a V8 or even a 2l petrol 4 pot. If you made it cheaper or even the same list price as an MX5 you could sell it as the lower costs will tempt people to it. If you could make it palatable as a 2nd car then it becomes even more reasonable.

I'm thinking take a leaf out of the Suzuki Cappuccino book - 3 pot, sub 700cc, low pressure turbo to avoid lag, rwd, nothing fancy, under 700kg, 0-60 in around 7s should be do-able and top speed of 110mph so its not seen as a boy racer car. I'm sure it could be done and profitably.

[El Shafto]

Roadster. An MX-5 beater. RWD, Manual Gearbox, 2.0 NA engine that revs out to 9,000. Light, simple, B-road destroyer.

[kambites]

JDMDrifter said:

Simple RWD 1.6-2.0 coupe size of an mx5 , make it around 15k in basic trim. By basic i mean no TCS, small 165x15 steelies , manual 5 speed , no aircon , no satnav , cloth seats. Proper cheap and cheerful sports car

How on earth are they going to do that for 15k? The GT86 is basically that and starts at about 25k.

[300bhp/ton]

There's 3 areas I'd love to see a company explore:


1. Diesel sports cars. Something MX-5 sized and weighted but with a 170-220hp 2.0-2.5 Turbo diesel engine - the important bit being tuned for performance. Handling should be pretty much on par with the petrol counterpart, only faster and with better economy. And a tuned diesel engine is actually quite a nice motor to enjoy.


2. 4 door RWD sports car. This needs to still be a sports car, so doesn't need massive power and should be a bit impractical and somewhat basic spec and options list. But it should be RWD and offer up just that added bit of extra ability to those that have a family. The reality would be a no less practical car than an Abarth 500 or Cooper S, but in a lighter more focused package that looks like a sports car.

Something like this maybe:



3. A RallyRaid style sports car for the road. Again a basic sort of car just like the MX-5, but taller and designed to handle rougher terrain. It should look chunky without actually being too heavy and should still focus on handling and performance.

[kambites]

300bhp/ton said:

2. 4 door RWD sports car. This needs to still be a sports car, so doesn't need massive power and should be a bit impractical and somewhat basic spec and options list. But it should be RWD and offer up just that added bit of extra ability to those that have a family. The reality would be a no less practical car than an Abarth 500 or Cooper S, but in a lighter more focused package that looks like a sports car.

An RX8 with a more "sensible" engine?

[filski666]

back when I used to work there, I tried to get them to let me and a couple of other "keen" co-workers build a Mid-engined MG3 RWD demo car (Clio V6 style)......but it never happened

That could have been used as the basis of a an interesting sports car...

[kambites]

How viable would it be to rear-mount the MG3's front subframe? Something like a modern MGF but probably smaller. The three engines available in the 3 would make for a good range if they could keep the weight down to around a tonne or 1100kg.

[SMGB]

filski666 said:

back when I used to work there, I tried to get them to let me and a couple of other "keen" co-workers build a Mid-engined MG3 RWD demo car (Clio V6 style)......but it never happened

That could have been used as the basis of a an interesting sports car...

Yes, just te sort of thing special tuning would have built at Abingdon. The key thing is not to throw away the fag packet that the drawings are on the back of in case they are needed for production.
It helps if there is something to do with it that generates column inches.
ps the fag packet is my retro touch for this thread.

[odyssey2200]

JDMDrifter said:

Simple RWD 1.6-2.0 coupe size of an mx5 , make it around 15k in basic trim. By basic i mean no TCS, small 165x15 steelies , manual 5 speed , no aircon , no satnav , cloth seats. Proper cheap and cheerful sports car

for that money , people would still buy the MX5

It would need to be much cheaper than an MX5 to make people consider it.
The last MGTF (or whatever they badged it) was too close to MX5 in price and lost.

IMHO

A 1.0 litre(ish) engine, (similar to the FOrd 3cyl, 130bhp unit), Front engine, RWD, VERY BASIC SPEC with the availbility of customer options.

Nothing fancy, exotic or complicated.
Light weight, skinny steels, tyres with sidewalls, manual roof.

[robinessex]

Something based on the original Lotus Elan ?

[kambites]

odyssey2200 said:

for that money , people would still buy the MX5

It would need to be much cheaper than an MX5 to make people consider it.
The last MGTF (or whatever they badged it) was too close to MX5 in price and lost.

IMHO

A 1.0 litre(ish) engine, (similar to the FOrd 3cyl, 130bhp unit), Front engine, RWD, VERY BASIC SPEC with the availbility of customer options.

Nothing fancy, exotic or complicated.
Light weight, skinny steels, tyres with sidewalls, manual roof.

Why front engined?

[300bhp/ton]

kambites said:

An RX8 with a more "sensible" engine?

Yes. Although maybe even smaller and with less power and weight. I also think rear/mid engined would be good for this. Aim it at current Fiesta, Twingo buyers as an alternative.

[kambites]

300bhp/ton said:

kambites said:

An RX8 with a more "sensible" engine?

Yes. Although maybe even smaller and with less power and weight. I also think rear/mid engined would be good for this. Aim it at current Fiesta, Twingo buyers as an alternative.

I think it would have to be rear if it was going to have four seats; probably under the boot floor if they could sort out the cooling?

[GTEYE]

kambites said:

CTE said:

The key thing is FUN...everyone understands this...

No... they don't. There's a reason that so few manufacturers produce simple, fun cars these days. No-one buys them.

The MX5 sells, but nothing else seems to remain in that market for long.

And if you look at how many pre-reg MX-5 are on the market at any point in time, even they don't sell as well as they used to...

[odyssey2200]

kambites said:

odyssey2200 said:

for that money , people would still buy the MX5

It would need to be much cheaper than an MX5 to make people consider it.
The last MGTF (or whatever they badged it) was too close to MX5 in price and lost.

IMHO

A 1.0 litre(ish) engine, (similar to the FOrd 3cyl, 130bhp unit), Front engine, RWD, VERY BASIC SPEC with the availbility of customer options.

Nothing fancy, exotic or complicated.
Light weight, skinny steels, tyres with sidewalls, manual roof.

Why front engined?

WTH not?

More traditional. easier/cheaper to maintain, better boot space, more "user friendly" or safe handling traits.

[filski666]

SMGB said:

filski666 said:

back when I used to work there, I tried to get them to let me and a couple of other "keen" co-workers build a Mid-engined MG3 RWD demo car (Clio V6 style)......but it never happened

That could have been used as the basis of a an interesting sports car...

Yes, just te sort of thing special tuning would have built at Abingdon. The key thing is not to throw away the fag packet that the drawings are on the back of in case they are needed for production.
It helps if there is something to do with it that generates column inches.
ps the fag packet is my retro touch for this thread.

Well, due to a lack of available fag packets I mocked it up on CAD, which is possibly still on their system somewhere - but I work at Jag now, so no access......

I thought it would have been cool to send it up the hill at Goodwood - that would make a few column inches, as you said.....and then hope they would make a couple for sale .....or do a one make race series or something....assuming the Goodwood car didn't explode or something! ha ha ha ha

[kambites]

odyssey2200 said:

WTH not?

Cost and weight. They'd have to develop most of a new drive-train from scratch and I'd imagine the extra casing and whatnot must weigh a good 50-100kg.

As for the MGTF "losing" to the MX5, well it was an ancient car by then. IIRC, the MGF outsold the MX5 in the UK every year that it was in production. You can also make a transverse mid-engined car smaller and "sleeker" than a front-engined one whilst still passing modern pedestrian impact legislation.

Edited by kambites on Thursday 22 November 12:50