Mk1 Focus RS vs EP3
Discussion
Hey, ive been browsing the forums for a while but never actually posted anything, but here i am!
Anyway, the time has come for me to be able to get a nice car thanks to cheaper insurance (and a nice scratch card win!)
Im 19 and have been driving for just over 2 years, but ive sold my sold my aweful little saxo vtr (nothing against saxos, mine was just especially bad, for example the rear lights filling up with water whenever it rained and half of the time the lights refused to turn on at all, along with the exhaust falling off! was a standard one so nothing i did to it either) But back to the matter in hand, ive been looking for a new car for a while now and ive narrowed it down to two choices:
A) Civic type r ep3, test driven a few and love them!
B) MK1 Focus RS, havent had the chance to test drive one as there arnt any near me at the moment
But i was really just interested in the details, for example i know that the ep3 isnt too bad in running costs ect, but a little bit more to insure, but does anyone know the general running costs of an RS? mainly parts ect as i know there getting rarer and harder to find parts, and the general MPG of a modified one as i cant really find this anywhere! Also if anyone is interested Admiral want £2004 for the year for the ep3 as standard, and £1493 for the RS with a cat-back miltek, remap and coilovers declared!
Cheers again and look foward to the replies!
Dan
Anyway, the time has come for me to be able to get a nice car thanks to cheaper insurance (and a nice scratch card win!)
Im 19 and have been driving for just over 2 years, but ive sold my sold my aweful little saxo vtr (nothing against saxos, mine was just especially bad, for example the rear lights filling up with water whenever it rained and half of the time the lights refused to turn on at all, along with the exhaust falling off! was a standard one so nothing i did to it either) But back to the matter in hand, ive been looking for a new car for a while now and ive narrowed it down to two choices:
A) Civic type r ep3, test driven a few and love them!
B) MK1 Focus RS, havent had the chance to test drive one as there arnt any near me at the moment
But i was really just interested in the details, for example i know that the ep3 isnt too bad in running costs ect, but a little bit more to insure, but does anyone know the general running costs of an RS? mainly parts ect as i know there getting rarer and harder to find parts, and the general MPG of a modified one as i cant really find this anywhere! Also if anyone is interested Admiral want £2004 for the year for the ep3 as standard, and £1493 for the RS with a cat-back miltek, remap and coilovers declared!
Cheers again and look foward to the replies!
Dan
AshCos said:
Not again!?! Focus RS better car, EP3 Chavist choice
What an awesome input. And people say the standards on here a dropping.....Simple fact is standard vs standard there's nothing in them, in the fifth gear head to head test the Civic was actually quicker round a lap. The focus though isn't worth an extra £3k over the price of the EP3. And the Civic has the better interior.
AshCos said:
Not again!?! Focus RS better car, EP3 Chavist choice
The kind of high quality, in depth analysis that keeps new visitors flooding into PH.Two cars that often get compared, in reality they are a pretty different ownership proposition. Screaming NA vs grunty turbo, and don't forget that a good EP3 will be half the price of a decent RS. The RS has Fast Ford tax and good ones are becoming rarer and rarer, so values are affected accordingly. An ST170 is probably a better comparison for the EP3, both are NA 2.0L cars, and their values are more in line too.
I'd go for the Civic. It's just a better car, IMO. And I would say I am a far bigger Ford fan than I am a Honda fan. I love the RS stuff but I can't deny that the EP3 is the better car, the one that would excite me far more. Calling one or the other a 'chav' car is silly. They're both great cars, both are loved by chavs. But nothing attracts chavs more than an RS badge, like flies on a turd! It pains me to say that as a dyed-in-the-wool fast Ford fan!
As mentioned above, it really comes down to whether or not you like precision and a screaming N/A engine, or fantastic outer styling with a gutsy turbo. There isn't much in it when you just look at the cars themselves, but when you consider the buy-in price of the Focus RS, the Civic looks like the better buy. More bang:buck.
The thing that lets the Focus down most is this:
Styled by Halfords. Looked s
te when it came out, looks even worse now!
EDIT: just found a photo of some lads who really like the Focus RS interior:
I've been thinking of buying a Civic Type R recently, but a good mate of mine has an EP3 already and I think we should cover more ground by having different cars with different things to enjoy. That said, I'd be the one driving it every day!
As mentioned above, it really comes down to whether or not you like precision and a screaming N/A engine, or fantastic outer styling with a gutsy turbo. There isn't much in it when you just look at the cars themselves, but when you consider the buy-in price of the Focus RS, the Civic looks like the better buy. More bang:buck.
The thing that lets the Focus down most is this:
Styled by Halfords. Looked s
te when it came out, looks even worse now!EDIT: just found a photo of some lads who really like the Focus RS interior:
I've been thinking of buying a Civic Type R recently, but a good mate of mine has an EP3 already and I think we should cover more ground by having different cars with different things to enjoy. That said, I'd be the one driving it every day!
Edited by Baryonyx on Thursday 6th December 21:55
AshCos said:
Not again!?! Focus RS better car, EP3 Chavist choice
Bizarre. Are you suggesting no chavs drive a Focus RS? Or are we going to move onto more chavs drive EP3's than RS's or some other such nonsense?
Anyway back to posting something that's actually useful.
They are completely different cars although fairly equal in most scenario's. I like both for different reasons.
Personally if money is tight, I'd go for the CTR given the availability of parts and how reliable they are.
Cheers for the advice guys, not really too fussed if anything is classed as a chavs car, if i like it, il drive it 
probably steering more towards the EP3, it did give me that happpy feeling with i test drove them 
plus i love Honda anyway, hoping to import an ek9 when i leave uni, il still try and get my hands on an RS to test drive before i make any final decisions anyway!
probably steering more towards the EP3, it did give me that happpy feeling with i test drove them plus i love Honda anyway, hoping to import an ek9 when i leave uni, il still try and get my hands on an RS to test drive before i make any final decisions anyway!Blimey no one slating him for his age, insurance etc.....is PH Ok ?
Focus RS is a step up from an ep3 in both driving dynamics aswell as price.
For cheap rev tastic fun choose a pre facelift Ep3, although a nice facelift example can be had for 5k ish.
For a decent RS you're looking at 9k+ I've been looking into similar things as I have an urge for an Astra Vxr.
Focus RS is a step up from an ep3 in both driving dynamics aswell as price.
For cheap rev tastic fun choose a pre facelift Ep3, although a nice facelift example can be had for 5k ish.
For a decent RS you're looking at 9k+ I've been looking into similar things as I have an urge for an Astra Vxr.
Looked at the VXR too, but insurance is about £2300 on one of those, plus my friend has one and i wanna be a bit diffrent i think Admiral just use a random number generator for my quotes, 2k for an ep3, or £900 for a 200sx s14 or supra, also only wanted £1200 for a boxter! Got about 10k to spend including insurance, but i would prefer to keep some tucked away for a rainy day *cough student loans cough*
i think Admiral just use a random number generator for my quotes, 2k for an ep3, or £900 for a 200sx s14 or supra, also only wanted £1200 for a boxter! Got about 10k to spend including insurance, but i would prefer to keep some tucked away for a rainy day *cough student loans cough*wackojacko said:
Blimey no one slating him for his age, insurance etc.....is PH Ok ?
Sounds sensible enough, has had a little windfall, appears to be paying his way rather than being a Little Lord Fauntleroy funded by the bank of mam and dad. Why not, if he can afford it? Though £10K is a serious budget, I'd still advise on the EP3. A great car, insurance and £5000 in the bank. Can't beat that!The Astra VXR wouldn't even get a look in for me. Great straight line performance but unwieldy in the corners. And no matter which angles you view it from, you can't escape those Astra lines. Inside it's even worse. Clubby gear stick and piano black trim aside, it has more than a whiff of Astra 1.3CDTi about it. Yuck. It's not a match for either the Focus or the Civic other than in straight line, sliproad bombing runs.
The RS doesn`t just hold a premium because it has an RS badge though. It has rarity added in as only 5000 were built, it has wide arches, brembo brakes and oz alloys, a quaife diff as well as sparco seats and the car actually lost ford money as it cost so much to produce.
The focus interior is a love or hate thing but in reality I personally like it although it does not look great in pictures.
It is more expensive for many reasons and will hold that value when you come to time to sell.
You will have great fun in either car but one is rather special and turns heads and the other a much more common sight.
The focus interior is a love or hate thing but in reality I personally like it although it does not look great in pictures.
It is more expensive for many reasons and will hold that value when you come to time to sell.
You will have great fun in either car but one is rather special and turns heads and the other a much more common sight.
I'd like to think that I am fairly good value to comment on this topic. I have perviously owned three EP3 Civic Type-R's and two MK1 Focus RS's the second of which is still in my ownership tucked away for the winter.
As it has already been pointed out both cars are very different ownership propositions, the Honda boasts one of the best normally aspirated engines ever and this without question it's single best feature although it isn't favoured by everybody particularly those who lust for torque.
I also agree that the Honda has the Ford licked when it comes to the driving position, in the Focus you sit too high and the seats are not quiet as supportive as the Honda's in standard form. Further comparing the Fords Sparco's to the Recarro's found in either the 30th Anniversary and Premier editions of the Civic is like comparing chalk with cheese.
The Type-R also has another trump card which is that is has one of the very sweetest gearboxes I've ever used, even if you spent 6 times the price of the Honda I'd doubt you find a better gearbox. It has a precise bolt action feel and is located perfectly, ready to stir that wonderful engine.
Marry all of the above with the fact that a decent low milage Type-R Premier will cost you on avarage £3,000 less than a equivalent MK1 Focus RS must mean that the Honda has this in the bag? Right!
Errm No! For all of its flaws the RS is a much better handling car thanks to its propper Hydraulic Power Steering which inspires so much convenience and provides an unrivalled amount of feel through the steering wheel, something of which Honda can only dream of. Then there is the torque baising differential which helps tuck the nose of the RS into every corner, once it has done this it then allows the driver to exploit all available power much earlier with out spinning it all away which is what happens in the EP3.
Both cars have a huge place in my heart, and if I could I'd own both but this isn't a viable option. For me the Ford edges it as it is a slightly more driver focused tool, I like the fact you have to be on you gard if you pressing on or it will fight back. Include this with the european limited production run of just 4501 cars then you have something rather special.
Nick
As it has already been pointed out both cars are very different ownership propositions, the Honda boasts one of the best normally aspirated engines ever and this without question it's single best feature although it isn't favoured by everybody particularly those who lust for torque.
I also agree that the Honda has the Ford licked when it comes to the driving position, in the Focus you sit too high and the seats are not quiet as supportive as the Honda's in standard form. Further comparing the Fords Sparco's to the Recarro's found in either the 30th Anniversary and Premier editions of the Civic is like comparing chalk with cheese.
The Type-R also has another trump card which is that is has one of the very sweetest gearboxes I've ever used, even if you spent 6 times the price of the Honda I'd doubt you find a better gearbox. It has a precise bolt action feel and is located perfectly, ready to stir that wonderful engine.
Marry all of the above with the fact that a decent low milage Type-R Premier will cost you on avarage £3,000 less than a equivalent MK1 Focus RS must mean that the Honda has this in the bag? Right!
Errm No! For all of its flaws the RS is a much better handling car thanks to its propper Hydraulic Power Steering which inspires so much convenience and provides an unrivalled amount of feel through the steering wheel, something of which Honda can only dream of. Then there is the torque baising differential which helps tuck the nose of the RS into every corner, once it has done this it then allows the driver to exploit all available power much earlier with out spinning it all away which is what happens in the EP3.
Both cars have a huge place in my heart, and if I could I'd own both but this isn't a viable option. For me the Ford edges it as it is a slightly more driver focused tool, I like the fact you have to be on you gard if you pressing on or it will fight back. Include this with the european limited production run of just 4501 cars then you have something rather special.
Nick
Nick_Johnson said:
For me the Ford edges it as it is a slightly more driver focused tool, I like the fact you have to be on you gard if you pressing on or it will fight back.
How will the Ford fight back? I know some were reputed to be a right dog to drive on some roads (and rumours abound that some of the front LSD's were set up incorrectly on some of the cars leaving the factory). Aside from the RS's oft-described tendency to tight the cornering line under throttle as opposed to widening out, how will it fight back? I would have thought the Civic would have been the more tenacious car on the road, saying as keeping the front wheels gripping is left to the driver, and the driver is tasked with keeping the engine in the high reaches of the rev range, rather than just relying on a bootful of torque for the turbo?Not picking fault here, just genuinely interested as I love both cars and I find them fascinating. I could probably even just live with the interior in the Focus. Just.
In a completely non biased view, if you can get a decent insurance quote, and being 19 it'll be fking difficult, go for a DC5. All the perks of both cars combined - Recaro's, LSD, best handling fwd chassis you could ever hope to come across, more powerful (220bhp) more responsive and higher rev limit than either car. And it just looks better
king difficult, go for a DC5. All the perks of both cars combined - Recaro's, LSD, best handling fwd chassis you could ever hope to come across, more powerful (220bhp) more responsive and higher rev limit than either car. And it just looks better I would kill for a DC5, but I can't even get quoted on one till I'm 21, same with a jdm DC2, would still consider a ukdm DC2 if one came up that is decent and has had the rear arches treated, but also worry about the protection as I hear they arnt great in accidents, I got hit by a foreign lorry on the motorway that spun me around at 70, shunted me foward, leaving me facing the wrong way on the motorway, only to hit me head on again, happened years ago and the claim is still going on, they admitted full liability though! My mums brand new corsa wasent lucky enough to survive though!
I would kill for a DC5, but I can't even get quoted on one till I'm 21, same with a jdm DC2, would still consider a ukdm DC2 if one came up that is decent and has had the rear arches treated, but also worry about the protection as I hear they arnt great in accidents, I got hit by a foreign lorry on the motorway that spun me around at 70, shunted me foward, leaving me facing the wrong way on the motorway, only to hit me head on again, happened years ago and the claim is still going on, they admitted full liability though! My mums brand new corsa wasent lucky enough to survive though!
A ukdm DC2 is a good choice. For the sort of money you're looking at spending you'll get a tidy one wih arches that are still made of metal. Just get it wax oiled and you'll be worry free for the duration you have the car. Pace wise they're just ever so slightly behind an EP3 in a straight line but steering feel is better and the car is a bit more chuckable.
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