RE: The end of M

Author
Discussion

Guvernator

13,164 posts

166 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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This isn't new though is it? As other posters have pointed this has been happening for a long time. The proper M car ended with the E30 when they stopped having to homologate cars for racing. Every M since then has been a badge exercise. Don't get me wrong, they have still produced some cracking M cars but they stopped being hardcore over 20 years ago.

The E36 M3 was derided for being too big and heavy by many when it came out, it's only now with hindsight compared to the bloated cars we have today that we can see it in a better light, the same thing happened for the E46. The M5 has never been about hardcore thrills either, it was always designed to be the ultimate GT car so again I'm not sure what we have lost as you could argue the new M5 is even better at filling this design brief than ever before. You could in fact say the CSL and the E60 M5 are the anomalies for the M car, something out of the norm, the 2 designs from the furtive minds of some mad engineers which somehow got given the green light but they are certainly not the norm.

Me thinks there is definitely a touch of rose tinted specs going on here, the M moniker stopped standing for "Motorsport" a long long time ago.

RemarkLima

2,375 posts

213 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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See, I would be keen if there was another version of M, without the firebreathing 500bhp + engines, just a decent range of engines but with all the trick parts, big floating brakes, decent ARB's, mechanical LSD's - basically a proper track pack with your choice of power (not like the stiffened up M Sport).

The current range of M cars are just too frustrating to drive on the road as you can't ever get near to any of the cars potential - so it really is about braging rights.

Still, people do love to say that they drive a M Sport...

Cyrus1971

855 posts

240 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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That was a really sad bit of ranty and pitying "journalism". Single point pieces (like single issue political parties) rarely satisfy because they don't take in the bigger picture and skip inconvenient facts in the rush to push out opinion.

As a recent E92 M3 convert from Porsche I think they are an awesome brand and have complete faith in them continuing that. M135i and M1 are a case in point and as an all rounder my M3 can't be beaten IMHO. If the gap grows too big between soft comfortable M series and the raw feel the article's author wishes for then I am equally sure BMW will bring out a stripped out lighter version to satisfy their minority interests.

Amanitin

423 posts

138 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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gforceg said:
He looks like Tony Blair. Through and through.
fake teeth?

original guvnor

128 posts

150 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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There is nothing wrong with getting misty-eyed over the passing of the old school M's that many of us own.

I don't necessarily buy the argument that it's the nasty politicians forcing BMW's hand either. Their competitors are still selling high-revving NA engines that are getting increasingly clean. Take the Boxster/Cayman/991 Carreras or the SLK AMG or the RS4/RS5/R8 as examples. Within BMW, these cars sell in such pifflingly small volumes compared to their mainstream brothers/sisters to have any meaningful impact on their overall CO2 emissions average.

I think BMW have just taken the cheap route to protect margins. Who can blame them for that I suppose. They are fighting a battle everyday to stay independent and not get swallowed up into a vast conglomerate such as VAG. The other thing we need to remember is that these days Munich is increasingly looking to Moscow, Shanghai, Mumbai and not to Frankfurt, Paris, London. There is no "tradition" of M in these newer emerging markets to speak of, so some of the models we recoil in horror over (X5&6M's) have sold well over there.


RevolveR

227 posts

141 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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This piece has been so badly written I found it a real struggle to make sense of what was being said. Stop trying to sound entertaining and just say what you're trying to say.

original guvnor

128 posts

150 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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Oh and if BMW really are concerned about their CO2 maybe the new M5 shouldn't weigh nearly 2000kg.

gforceg

3,524 posts

180 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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Amanitin said:
gforceg said:
He looks like Tony Blair. Through and through.
fake teeth?
Really?!

I meant more along the lines of "dead behind the eyes".

swanny71

2,860 posts

210 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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That article reads like any number of pissed up rants posted on the forums. 3/10.
I doubt we have to worry about BMW making interesting drivers cars in the future, just get over the M badge snobbery.

Froomee

1,424 posts

170 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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I have to say coming from a Focus ST Mountune (Turbo, 5 pot) to the N/A six in my Z4M it really does prove how great the engine is. Compared to the rivals my Focus had lots of character and sound and the engine in the Z4M even more so.

After driving many cars i have to say the large N/A engines in the following cars Z4M, E46, E92 and RS4 are definitely my favourite i haven't driven anything american only a Monaro 500 (but it had a supercharger). I also happen to find flappy paddles or any automatic gearbox removes a sense of involvement.

The new breed of cars that are designed around EU laws (saftey and emissions targets) seem to be more and more compromised rather than something for personal enjoyment. Obviously there are exceptions to the rule but they are fewer and fewer of these around and a lot of the cars that are desirable are also becoming even more costly.

y2blade

56,127 posts

216 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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I wondered where he'd gone.


BalhamBadger

1,161 posts

174 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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gforceg said:
Really?!

I meant more along the lines of "dead behind the eyes".
I don't think there's any need for personal attacks on the man.

Aizle

12,429 posts

176 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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RevolveR said:
This piece has been so badly written I found it a real struggle to make sense of what was being said. Stop trying to sound entertaining and just say what you're trying to say.
What he said.

General Fluff

478 posts

138 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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Nobody can deny that cars are getting safer, which follows a world wide trend for all consumer products. Yes it means our cars lose a lot of the raw feel and dynamics that they once had but looked at in context it is for the greater good.

MajorProblem

4,700 posts

165 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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jeremy_spoke_in

25 posts

203 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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M badge has always been a marketing tool, but up to maybe 5-10 years ago they had the cars to back it up. Great driving, understated looks... nowadays they will make very minor changes to bog standard BMWs and cover it in M badge bling. BMW is on a slippery slope in terms of their performance cars, i hope one day they remeber what M means to true drivers.

Pugsey

5,813 posts

215 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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As long as they make a car that's great to own and drive (from a driving enthusiast's view point - eg a PHer) I don't care WHAT badge they put on it. None of us need our choice of car to be 'confirmed' by a badge............do we? Not knocking the M3 line or M brand in general btw.

Edited by Pugsey on Monday 10th December 10:51

Cotic

469 posts

153 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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So - future M cars are probably rubbish, the new Audi RS's seem to be rubbish, and the Mercedes AMG cars are being diluted with 'engineered by' and 'AMG-lite' marketing drivel.

How much is that XFR-S again?

dibblecorse

6,883 posts

193 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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Since when has the M3 been the be al and end all of the M cars, it wasn't the firts, won't be the last and as good as it is, it is just another sports coupe / saloon ....

DodoRacing

539 posts

208 months

Monday 10th December 2012
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Implying aside, have they actually said they will stop the M3?
Even then, apart from a badge change, as its' been said above, they would effectively stop the 4 door M3 as the 4 series is nothing but a 3 series coupe.

I'm more frustrated about the lack of a new Z4M in the presence of X5M and X6M?