RE: New Golf GTI: too little, too late?
Discussion
GrizzlyBear said:
GTI is just a marketing message, hence why the 115bhp engine MK4 sold well, it provided the GTi name people wanted with all the comfort and toys, wrapped in a nice status symbol VW body.
Yep. We even had the earlier 125hp (20V) version that was dropped quite quickly. We had bought it new RHD in Germany and there it was called Trendline, not GTI, and had therefore the highest saving compared to UK price. Only the 110tdi and 150 turbo were called GTI. Which meant we sold it after 2 years for exactly what we paid for it...va1o said:
Why must people keep ignoring the fact the new MK7 weighs less than both the MK5 and MK6
10 years ago cars were getting heavy and overweight, but that simply is NOT true anymore
I think it is more correct to say they were getting heavier, but now manufacturers are becoming more aware of weight just because mpg sells cars.10 years ago cars were getting heavy and overweight, but that simply is NOT true anymore
My point was a Mk1 Golf was a small nimble 750kg (base model I think), the Mk7 Golf 1050kg (again base model), we all gain weight as we get older but 300Kg! I really like pies, but even I would be ashamed of that!
GrizzlyBear said:
I think it is more correct to say they were getting heavier, but now manufacturers are becoming more aware of weight just because mpg sells cars.
My point was a Mk1 Golf was a small nimble 750kg (base model I think), the Mk7 Golf 1050kg (again base model), we all gain weight as we get older but 300Kg! I really like pies, but even I would be ashamed of that!
Would you prefer to be in a crash in a Mk1 or a Mk7 though?My point was a Mk1 Golf was a small nimble 750kg (base model I think), the Mk7 Golf 1050kg (again base model), we all gain weight as we get older but 300Kg! I really like pies, but even I would be ashamed of that!
Yes, it might be 300kg heavier - but look at the size difference between them! Why is it so hard for some people to understand that buying a hot hatch in the first instance is a compromise - they want practicality combined with a bit of fun. I wouldn't fancy trying to fit all the items that comes with modern day family into a Mk1 Golf, however light, nimble and fun they may be..
GrizzlyBear said:
My point was a Mk1 Golf was a small nimble 750kg (base model I think), the Mk7 Golf 1050kg (again base model), we all gain weight as we get older but 300Kg! I really like pies, but even I would be ashamed of that!
The weight gain is like everything else in its class and cars generally due to increases in size and massive improvements in crash worthiness. In 35 years we've gone from 35mph shunts being possibly survivable to only resulting in minor injuries. A lot of extra steel/aluminium has to be added to achieve current controlled deformations. Mk1 Frontal, "fatal injuries possible"
Mk7 Frontal, cuts and bruises
pycraft said:
I think the key factor here is the rising cost of insurance, not of the cars themselves. The hot hatch is the natural preserve of the young, who now can't afford the insurance costs.
More like the cost of the car itself! Isn't the average wage in the country something like £28k a year? Nobody 'young' can afford to buy it, unless they're on the big bucks.It seems mentality has quite a fair bit to do with it, not trying to start a petrol vs. diesel war. But when you can pick up a second hand BMW 330d or equivalent, give it a quick remap and where on for 284Bhp.. Not only will it pound a Golf GTI into the ground on power and handling, but it will also do 45+ Mpg when it's feeling tight at the end of the month.. They can be picked up second hand in the 234 variant for less than 10K.. That leave's another 4K for insurance and 10K for booze 
..
..Shadows said:
It seems mentality has quite a fair bit to do with it, not trying to start a petrol vs. diesel war. But when you can pick up a second hand BMW 330d or equivalent, give it a quick remap and where on for 284Bhp.. Not only will it pound a Golf GTI into the ground on power and handling, but it will also do 45+ Mpg when it's feeling tight at the end of the month.. They can be picked up second hand in the 234 variant for less than 10K.. That leave's another 4K for insurance and 10K for booze ..
Oh FFS. ..Or you can get a 1994 BMW 740Il instead of the 330 and save even more!
b0rk said:
The weight gain is like everything else in its class and cars generally due to increases in size and massive improvements in crash worthiness. In 35 years we've gone from 35mph shunts being possibly survivable to only resulting in minor injuries. A lot of extra steel/aluminium has to be added to achieve current controlled deformations.
Mk1 Frontal, "fatal injuries possible"
Mk7 Frontal, cuts and bruises
But that is the point, the spirtual successor to a Golf GTi will not be a golf, as a golf is now a fairly large car. If you want a sucessor to a GTi you should be looking for something like an Up gti or similar (if you want to remain in VW); small and not needing a 2L turbo to drag its body shell along. The Golf GTi is a comfortable family car with all the toys and most importantly a VW GTi badge which is the image that some people want to give.Mk1 Frontal, "fatal injuries possible"
Mk7 Frontal, cuts and bruises
By the way in regard of which I would rather have a crash in, obviously the Mk7 as I don't really want to get hurt, however if you ask which I would rather own it would be the MK1, and which I would rather pay for the regular maintenance on I would again say the Mk1.
Edited by GrizzlyBear on Tuesday 5th March 11:19
GrizzlyBear said:
But that is the point, the spirtual successor to a Golf GTi will not be a golf, [/footnote]
If you really believe that then surely no car manufacture can reuse any previous name whilst developing a new model.Would you also argue that you would sooner have a Peugeot 107 rather than a 209GTI because the 209 is so big now? Do you think a Fiesta should not be a Fiesta any more since it is wider plus taller and barely any shorter than a mk1 Focus?
The golf is clearly still a golf, it is a classed as a compact car and is the same size (but not weight!) as it's main competitors the Astra/Focus/Megane/308 which it is outselling.
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