RE: Toyota GT-86 Convertible: Revealed (sort of)
Discussion
hornetrider said:
300bhp/ton said:
I understand that you owned a car with less hp, more weight and likely a different diff and tyres. I also suspect that a) you didn't actively try 0-60mph times in it and b) are misunderstanding or ignoring the physics of the situation.
Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.The US Club is the same mechanical spec as any Special Edition Sport model over here. Same engine, Torsen diff, tyres, the lot. It's just a normal MX5 special edition ie paint job and trim.
Much as I love the MX5 it is not now nor ever will be a 6.1 second car or even close. Ergo I do not believe Motortrends figures for the 5 nor the GT86.
I'm not going to argue with your stupidity any more.
The end.
And lets face it, does this also mean you don't believe the Elise 0-60mph times or even the MGB V8 ones?
All this chat about 0-60 times. Figured I would wade in...
Of the cars I've owned: The Impreza and MX5 definitely need 3rd gear to get to 60 (or 62). The Impreza's diff ratio was shorter than the UK model which meant 0-60 was the same despite it having 40bhp more. I don't know if this was due to emissions or because the UK care more about 0-60 times. The MX5 came with a number of different diff ratios, which changed for 1.6/1.8, 1.8 type 2, 6 speed boxes, auto boxes... etc. I only found out about the Impreza when someone was arguing that it shouldn't be on boost at 60mph - which mine very definitely was.
Admittedly both of these cars are 20 years old, but there is a chance they were running different diff ratios for the Toyota and MX5 numbers.
If they could use 2 gears instead of 3, that would probably give you your missing second. Sticky rubber/ideal launch would contribute to the rest.
ETA: Random thought, but didn't one of the Monaros/VXR8s used to do 70mph in 1st?
Of the cars I've owned: The Impreza and MX5 definitely need 3rd gear to get to 60 (or 62). The Impreza's diff ratio was shorter than the UK model which meant 0-60 was the same despite it having 40bhp more. I don't know if this was due to emissions or because the UK care more about 0-60 times. The MX5 came with a number of different diff ratios, which changed for 1.6/1.8, 1.8 type 2, 6 speed boxes, auto boxes... etc. I only found out about the Impreza when someone was arguing that it shouldn't be on boost at 60mph - which mine very definitely was.
Admittedly both of these cars are 20 years old, but there is a chance they were running different diff ratios for the Toyota and MX5 numbers.
If they could use 2 gears instead of 3, that would probably give you your missing second. Sticky rubber/ideal launch would contribute to the rest.
ETA: Random thought, but didn't one of the Monaros/VXR8s used to do 70mph in 1st?
Edited by bicycleshorts on Friday 1st March 13:40
bicycleshorts said:
All this chat about 0-60 times. Figured I would wade in...
Of the cars I've owned: The Impreza and MX5 definitely need 3 gear changes to get to 60 (or 62). The Impreza's diff ratio was shorter than the UK model which meant 0-60 was the same despite it having 40bhp more. I don't know if this was due to emissions or because the UK care more about 0-60 times. The MX5 came with a number of different diff ratios, which changed for 1.6/1.8, 1.8 type 2, 6 speed boxes, auto boxes... etc. I only found out about the Impreza when someone was arguing that it shouldn't be on boost at 60mph - which mine very definitely was.
Admittedly both of these cars are 20 years old, but there is a chance they were running different diff ratios for the Toyota and MX5 numbers.
If they could use 2 gears instead of 3, that would probably give you your missing second. Sticky rubber/ideal launch would contribute to the rest.
Yep and if you are 0-60mph chasing you might well buzz the engine too up past the red line to the electronic rev limiter. Why change gear and lose half a second if you don't have too.Of the cars I've owned: The Impreza and MX5 definitely need 3 gear changes to get to 60 (or 62). The Impreza's diff ratio was shorter than the UK model which meant 0-60 was the same despite it having 40bhp more. I don't know if this was due to emissions or because the UK care more about 0-60 times. The MX5 came with a number of different diff ratios, which changed for 1.6/1.8, 1.8 type 2, 6 speed boxes, auto boxes... etc. I only found out about the Impreza when someone was arguing that it shouldn't be on boost at 60mph - which mine very definitely was.
Admittedly both of these cars are 20 years old, but there is a chance they were running different diff ratios for the Toyota and MX5 numbers.
If they could use 2 gears instead of 3, that would probably give you your missing second. Sticky rubber/ideal launch would contribute to the rest.
Also 0-60mph times are very misleading. For example I also own an Impreza (UK Turbo 2000 model). I believe Autocar managed something like 5.5sec 0-60mph from it. Which "on paper" makes it look as quick as my Camaro z28. However I can vouch they a miles apart in performance the Camaro will simply romp away from the Scooby as though the Scooby is tied to a wall.
These discussions revolving around arbitrary 0-60mph/62mph/200kmh times are almost irrelevant.
How many 0-60 drag races do people take part in?
In fact how many drag races at all do people take part in in standard road cars, full of luggage and people?
When it comes to it, how many people often do pedal-to-the-metal, cross-country driving with the determination not to be taken alive?
-as opposed to brisk drives that involve some quick cornering, some hard acceleration up to a certain speed (limited by risk from law enforcement / risk to themself / risk to others).
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
Roll-ons and response to the throttle (taking into account any lag) being more relevant, surely?
How many 0-60 drag races do people take part in?
In fact how many drag races at all do people take part in in standard road cars, full of luggage and people?
When it comes to it, how many people often do pedal-to-the-metal, cross-country driving with the determination not to be taken alive?
-as opposed to brisk drives that involve some quick cornering, some hard acceleration up to a certain speed (limited by risk from law enforcement / risk to themself / risk to others).
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
Roll-ons and response to the throttle (taking into account any lag) being more relevant, surely?
Edited by MC Bodge on Friday 1st March 14:06
MC Bodge said:
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
It is a total irrelevance, however when someone argues against test results it's bound to cause a discussion.MC Bodge said:
These discussions revolving around arbitrary 0-60mph/62mph/200kmh times are almost irrelevant.
How many 0-60 drag races do people take part in?
In fact how many drag races at all do people take part in in standard road cars, full of luggage and people?
When it comes to it, how many people often do pedal-to-the-metal, cross-country driving with the determination not to be taken alive?
-as opposed to brisk drives that involve some quick cornering, some hard acceleration up to a certain speed (limited by risk from law enforcement / risk to themself / risk to others).
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
They are all points of interest though. And yes I often do do 0-60mph or 5-60mph types of things at WOT (when clear, safe and legal to do so).How many 0-60 drag races do people take part in?
In fact how many drag races at all do people take part in in standard road cars, full of luggage and people?
When it comes to it, how many people often do pedal-to-the-metal, cross-country driving with the determination not to be taken alive?
-as opposed to brisk drives that involve some quick cornering, some hard acceleration up to a certain speed (limited by risk from law enforcement / risk to themself / risk to others).
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
Edited by MC Bodge on Friday 1st March 14:01
But I think the point is, someone has gone to the effort to use pucker timing gear and spend time getting the best results from the car. This makes it a proven statistic. Then you get someone who owned a different car, with less power in a different country, and not likely used any timing gear at all (maybe never even tried 0-60mph runs) claiming the proven recorded stats are a wrong and lies.
Kozy said:
anything fast said:
Looks very nice, but when will Toyota learn? They seem to be shifting very few of the hardtop and I think I know the reason. Its too slow, too cheap and not great on the inside.
For the love of god, please can they bolt on a Turbo, get it up to 250 HP, add £5000 to the price and have a range of models... They should have made it like that in the 1st place and order books would be fatter.. then they should have introduced the N/A version after for those on a tighter budget. A quick Turbo version would have cast a halo round the model.
Ah, there it is, I thought it was missing. Are you in the market for a new car? Could you afford one of these anyway? If so, why not slap a supercharger on it yourself. That's kind of the point of it.For the love of god, please can they bolt on a Turbo, get it up to 250 HP, add £5000 to the price and have a range of models... They should have made it like that in the 1st place and order books would be fatter.. then they should have introduced the N/A version after for those on a tighter budget. A quick Turbo version would have cast a halo round the model.
anything fast said:
Instead this is the car everyone likes and agrees its a good car, but why are they not buying? Well for the same money you have great choice of much faster hot hatchbacks and there is just not a big enough market for RWD purists who will sacrifice power just for a little bit of tail out fun!
Definitely a troll. All I am doing is expressing my opinion about the car, and for me and many other its a dissapointment. If I was in the market for a new sporty car, I would not buy one as I would want something faster and It is simpy not worth buying one and then spending a bucket load of cash making it faster.
if you want to resort to childish insults, please go to facebook. PH is about free opinions on cars not about the size of your wallet, or in your case willy! See what I did there? Childish insult... and with that I wish you a good day sir!
MC Bodge said:
These discussions revolving around arbitrary 0-60mph/62mph/200kmh times are almost irrelevant.
How many 0-60 drag races do people take part in?
In fact how many drag races at all do people take part in in standard road cars, full of luggage and people?
When it comes to it, how many people often do pedal-to-the-metal, cross-country driving with the determination not to be taken alive?
-as opposed to brisk drives that involve some quick cornering, some hard acceleration up to a certain speed (limited by risk from law enforcement / risk to themself / risk to others).
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
Roll-ons and response to the throttle (taking into account any lag) being more relevant, surely?
I see what you're getting at, and IMO 30-70 is more important (sliproad-to-motorway speed - the ability to reach 70mph once you get to the end of the sliproad is very important for safety as much as anything).How many 0-60 drag races do people take part in?
In fact how many drag races at all do people take part in in standard road cars, full of luggage and people?
When it comes to it, how many people often do pedal-to-the-metal, cross-country driving with the determination not to be taken alive?
-as opposed to brisk drives that involve some quick cornering, some hard acceleration up to a certain speed (limited by risk from law enforcement / risk to themself / risk to others).
Who cares, and does it matter at all, whether one reasonably brisk, good handling car will accelerate from 0-60/62 0.5-1 second quicker/slower than another and how many gear changes it might take?
Roll-ons and response to the throttle (taking into account any lag) being more relevant, surely?
Edited by MC Bodge on Friday 1st March 14:06
However, I still think it's fairly important for an 'enthusiast car', because there's every chance you might take it sprint-racing (one of the few types of racing you don't need a competition licence to do), and the ability to get off the line when the flag falls and get up to speed for the first corners is quite important. It is wildly overrated, true, but for a car like the GT86 it's quite a useful thing to know.
Same goes for track days I suppose. Getting up to track-speed from a virtual standstill at the end of the pitlane is useful if you're joining the fray.
Twincam16 said:
However, I still think it's fairly important for an 'enthusiast car', because there's every chance you might take it sprint-racing.....Same goes for track days I suppose. Getting up to track-speed from a virtual standstill at the end of the pitlane is useful if you're joining the fray.
That's not what these folk are arguing about it for though and there are going to be fairly minor differences in ground covered over a few seconds by various 2.0 n/a petrol sports cars in a 0-60 or 1/4 mile dash.Edited by MC Bodge on Friday 1st March 14:30
Timbola said:
Nowhere is there a mention of whether the roof on this rather attractive car is folding tin-top or rag-top ... ?
It's only a concept car. Who knows if it even has a roof.If it does make it into production, surely it will have a fabric roof. Metal roof would add too much weight and make the car too ugly.
excel monkey said:
Timbola said:
Nowhere is there a mention of whether the roof on this rather attractive car is folding tin-top or rag-top ... ?
It's only a concept car. Who knows if it even has a roof.If it does make it into production, surely it will have a fabric roof. Metal roof would add too much weight and make the car too ugly.
anything fast said:
All I am doing is expressing my opinion about the car, and for me and many other its a dissapointment.
You must read the almost universal praise that is lauded upon it quite differently to me then. Have you actually driven one?anything fast said:
If I was in the market for a new sporty car, I would not buy one as I would want something faster and It is simpy not worth buying one and then spending a bucket load of cash making it faster.
So let me get this right, it's not worth say, £5k adding aftermarket forced induction, but asking the manufacturer to do it and add £5k on somehow is worth it? I can only assume you're worried about the warranty?Here's a video....it's rather...erm...well lets just say the music sets the scene.
http://youtu.be/FUNvXVsoxHI
http://youtu.be/FUNvXVsoxHI
Hah, probably the most relaxed drift ever;
http://youtu.be/FUNvXVsoxHI?t=1m49s
Bizarrely, I want this more than the coupe. Must be the inner hairdresser trying to get out.
http://youtu.be/FUNvXVsoxHI?t=1m49s
Bizarrely, I want this more than the coupe. Must be the inner hairdresser trying to get out.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff