RE: Jaguar F-Type V6 S: Driven
Discussion
unrepentant said:
Having driven both cars on the track and through a slalom course and various other handling courses and sat next to a pro racing driver while he drives them and having listened to several pro racing drivers talk about them I would disagree.
But then this is PH so your not having driven any of the cars would make you more qualified to comment.
With respect, in my experience of car launches, instructors/racers are obviously briefed to tell the billys that the car being launched is far better than the competition.But then this is PH so your not having driven any of the cars would make you more qualified to comment.
As for the 911, I am not sure you have much experience of them but they require a very different set of skills. You can't just jump in and expect it to flow. It takes a while to learn them. Turning in on the brakes is kind of not within everyone's ability, maybe for the better actually !
50/50 is not necessarily the ideal weight distribution. F1s certainly don't have it. A slight rear bias in the case of the mid-engined Boxster is a small price to pay when you rip the benefits of it's added traction but more crucially of its lower polar moment of inertia.
The Autocar article is really in-depth and interesting stuff. From a consumer POV they definitely praise the Jag, I am just not sure they think it's as good a driver's car as the Boxster.
The actual price difference between a Type-F V6S and a PDK Boxster S with equalised spec is still £13,500 it would seem.
Edited by nickfrog on Friday 26th April 14:01
nickfrog said:
As for the 911, I am not sure you have much experience of them but they require a very different set of skills. You can't just jump in and expect it to flow. It takes a while to learn them. Turning in on the brakes is kind of not within everyone's ability, maybe for the better actually !
I've driven quite a number of them and have owned enough sports cars to be able to make a judgement. We also have a Porsche dealership in the group and there were several people at the event who sell both Porsche and Jaguar and who had some interesting comments... I guess what you're saying is that a 911 is not a driver friendly vehicle?
nickfrog said:
Or maybe it's just a bit more challenging for your average prestige car salesman... but more rewarding when you (eventually) get it right.
Having spent six years owning and driving lightweight plastic cars with no driver aids and 400 BHP on tap I'm used to being challenged by a car. Your car list shows 2 Boxters, have you owned 911's as well?
unrepentant said:
Having spent six years owning and driving lightweight plastic cars with no driver aids and 400 BHP on tap I'm used to being challenged by a car.
Your car list shows 2 Boxters, have you owned 911's as well?
Sorry I wasn't referring to you but to the colleagues you quoted.Your car list shows 2 Boxters, have you owned 911's as well?
I really don't get on with the 911 dynamics. I can't live with the floaty front end. I appreciate the huge traction but by the time that's delivered, for me it's too late. I really don't have the bottle to turn in on the brakes, at least on the open road. I do admire those who can drive it properly though.
The only time I enjoyed a 911 was one of Palmer's pseudo GT3s as they set it with a very bity front end.
Copied from my review of the car on the F Type blog. Sorry it is not about the V6.....
Had my drive this morning courtesy of Hatfields in Wakefield. V8S in Firesand with Black Pack, Black wheels, Performance Seats / Premium Leather Dash with Orange Contrast Stitch, Loud button for the exhaust and Meridian Hi Fi. Pretty much the same spec as our own as it happens!
In 1 1/2 hours, I drove up the M1 to Aberford, over to Tadcaster, on to Bramham and then onto one of my favourite roads - Bramham to Thorner. Back to Bramham, down to Stutton and back, via Garforth, into Wakefield. A great mix of roads. John, from Hatfield's in the passenger seat, was safely strapped in, and given strict instructions not to whimper like a baby.
I will not give an in depth review of the looks as they are a personal thing, I for one love the look, the rear, especially from a 3/4 view, is lovely. The front, to my eyes, is a bit Ferrari California looking, no bad thing, but IMO all very well resolved.
Build quality looks very good, the paint finish excellent, panel gaps nice and even, and the roof is of very high quality. The interior is very nicely finished, again, well constructed from good materials, but certainly not bespoke in the Aston mould. The driving position, for me, was excellent. Plenty of seat adjustment, the sports seats are very supportive. The dash is nice and clutter free, instruments clear and easy to read quickly. I did not bother messing about with the Dynamic i system, straight into Dynamic mode, track DSC, exhaust loud button pressed, and off we go onto Denby Dale road.
OMG, the NOISE! Within 30 seconds, the grin stretched from ear to ear, John was gripping the centre grab handle, the exhaust emitted multiple staccato pops, bags and explosions, the rear tyres left two black lines on the asphalt, and we made rapid "progress" to the first roundabout. I reminded myself that we were on a public road, with a 40 limit, and that the BIB often hide further along behind the Nissan dealer. Holding back was a struggle.
The motorway section was a little boring, but even roof down ,the amount of buffeting inside (no wind deflector) was bearable. Stability is excellent, and the ride is firm but smooth. The steering is very direct, but, on the motorway, is not too sensitive and allows a nice straight line to be ploughed. After what seemed an age, we finally reached the Aberford turning, up the slip road, off the roundabout, and POWWWWEEERRRRR.
Power delivery is perfect, not so much that the rears lose grip too easily, and throw it away. The throttle is nicely weighted, with a great linearity, so that each input, large or small, is transmitted as intended. The gearbox, described as Quickshift, is exactly what it say on the tin. Again, the bellowing roar of the V8 on a surge is intoxicating, and the pop, bang, explosion of lift off has you diving to avoid the non existing bullets from the imaginary nearby firing range.
Turn in to the first corner, easy does it to get a feel for the loading of the tyres, and the impression is of near perfect neutrality. No understeer, front end dives into the corner and the rear faithfully follows. After a few more tight corners, we come across some lovely long sweepers. A chance to push the car a little more and explore a bit of oversteer. This car is so easy to play with. Power, slide, correct, shoot forwards on a crescendo of instant torquey traction. Again and again, I repeated the technique. Very effortless, but the chassis has a lovely balance, and leaves you feeling the hero.
Travelling from Bramham to Thorner, one of my favourite roads. Long straights with a few kinks and plenty of undulations, a couple of sharp corners and a great downhill left - right with an off camber right turn before a sharp left between two tight walls, followed by a gentle right, off camber uphill, before easing off until the road comes into view again. Back on the power, look left to see the the road further downhill is clear, sharp left and downhill again.
Whatever the surface, however difficult, this car just copes, without fuss, and with enormous grace and pace. The steering, though light, gives lovely feedback, is linear in turn in, and confident on the straight ahead. The suspension is always unflustered, very little roll, plenty of seat of the pants feedback, and firm but forgiving. Oversteer is easy to provoke, but also controllable, understeer virtually non existent.
Rarely have I driven a car that immediately feels at one with you, flatters you but also leaves you grinning, laughing, and searching out the next challenge just for the sheer hell of it. And the noise just gets better and better, intoxicating you and egging you to keep trying harder and harder.
Now I am a Jag fan, but also have to - purely for the purposes of my business - drive a great range of exotica. The F Type would, in any context, hold it's own no matter what the competition. This is a truly great car, maybe not bespoke like an Aston, focussed like a 458, exemplary like an MP4 or unhinged like the SLS. It is distillation of all of these, Extremely fast, wonderful noisy, brutish in a British tradition, but more importantly, full of sporting intent, just how a Jaguar should be.
Great car, great fun. Thank you John for not crying, or complaining that I used a full tank of fuel. And a set of rears!
Had my drive this morning courtesy of Hatfields in Wakefield. V8S in Firesand with Black Pack, Black wheels, Performance Seats / Premium Leather Dash with Orange Contrast Stitch, Loud button for the exhaust and Meridian Hi Fi. Pretty much the same spec as our own as it happens!
In 1 1/2 hours, I drove up the M1 to Aberford, over to Tadcaster, on to Bramham and then onto one of my favourite roads - Bramham to Thorner. Back to Bramham, down to Stutton and back, via Garforth, into Wakefield. A great mix of roads. John, from Hatfield's in the passenger seat, was safely strapped in, and given strict instructions not to whimper like a baby.
I will not give an in depth review of the looks as they are a personal thing, I for one love the look, the rear, especially from a 3/4 view, is lovely. The front, to my eyes, is a bit Ferrari California looking, no bad thing, but IMO all very well resolved.
Build quality looks very good, the paint finish excellent, panel gaps nice and even, and the roof is of very high quality. The interior is very nicely finished, again, well constructed from good materials, but certainly not bespoke in the Aston mould. The driving position, for me, was excellent. Plenty of seat adjustment, the sports seats are very supportive. The dash is nice and clutter free, instruments clear and easy to read quickly. I did not bother messing about with the Dynamic i system, straight into Dynamic mode, track DSC, exhaust loud button pressed, and off we go onto Denby Dale road.
OMG, the NOISE! Within 30 seconds, the grin stretched from ear to ear, John was gripping the centre grab handle, the exhaust emitted multiple staccato pops, bags and explosions, the rear tyres left two black lines on the asphalt, and we made rapid "progress" to the first roundabout. I reminded myself that we were on a public road, with a 40 limit, and that the BIB often hide further along behind the Nissan dealer. Holding back was a struggle.
The motorway section was a little boring, but even roof down ,the amount of buffeting inside (no wind deflector) was bearable. Stability is excellent, and the ride is firm but smooth. The steering is very direct, but, on the motorway, is not too sensitive and allows a nice straight line to be ploughed. After what seemed an age, we finally reached the Aberford turning, up the slip road, off the roundabout, and POWWWWEEERRRRR.
Power delivery is perfect, not so much that the rears lose grip too easily, and throw it away. The throttle is nicely weighted, with a great linearity, so that each input, large or small, is transmitted as intended. The gearbox, described as Quickshift, is exactly what it say on the tin. Again, the bellowing roar of the V8 on a surge is intoxicating, and the pop, bang, explosion of lift off has you diving to avoid the non existing bullets from the imaginary nearby firing range.
Turn in to the first corner, easy does it to get a feel for the loading of the tyres, and the impression is of near perfect neutrality. No understeer, front end dives into the corner and the rear faithfully follows. After a few more tight corners, we come across some lovely long sweepers. A chance to push the car a little more and explore a bit of oversteer. This car is so easy to play with. Power, slide, correct, shoot forwards on a crescendo of instant torquey traction. Again and again, I repeated the technique. Very effortless, but the chassis has a lovely balance, and leaves you feeling the hero.
Travelling from Bramham to Thorner, one of my favourite roads. Long straights with a few kinks and plenty of undulations, a couple of sharp corners and a great downhill left - right with an off camber right turn before a sharp left between two tight walls, followed by a gentle right, off camber uphill, before easing off until the road comes into view again. Back on the power, look left to see the the road further downhill is clear, sharp left and downhill again.
Whatever the surface, however difficult, this car just copes, without fuss, and with enormous grace and pace. The steering, though light, gives lovely feedback, is linear in turn in, and confident on the straight ahead. The suspension is always unflustered, very little roll, plenty of seat of the pants feedback, and firm but forgiving. Oversteer is easy to provoke, but also controllable, understeer virtually non existent.
Rarely have I driven a car that immediately feels at one with you, flatters you but also leaves you grinning, laughing, and searching out the next challenge just for the sheer hell of it. And the noise just gets better and better, intoxicating you and egging you to keep trying harder and harder.
Now I am a Jag fan, but also have to - purely for the purposes of my business - drive a great range of exotica. The F Type would, in any context, hold it's own no matter what the competition. This is a truly great car, maybe not bespoke like an Aston, focussed like a 458, exemplary like an MP4 or unhinged like the SLS. It is distillation of all of these, Extremely fast, wonderful noisy, brutish in a British tradition, but more importantly, full of sporting intent, just how a Jaguar should be.
Great car, great fun. Thank you John for not crying, or complaining that I used a full tank of fuel. And a set of rears!
Have they posted ring times for the F-type?
Would be interesting to see how the V8S compares to the 7m 37sec lap of the 991 C2S, (which is faster than the out going GT3.2 so lets hold those thoughts about the V8S blowing the C2S into the weeds) interested in seeing the times. Yes it's irrelevant but interesting to me none the less.
Putting that to one side, the more I see and read of the F-type the more I like it.
Would be interesting to see how the V8S compares to the 7m 37sec lap of the 991 C2S, (which is faster than the out going GT3.2 so lets hold those thoughts about the V8S blowing the C2S into the weeds) interested in seeing the times. Yes it's irrelevant but interesting to me none the less.
Putting that to one side, the more I see and read of the F-type the more I like it.
pb1695 said:
Copied from my review of the car on the F Type blog. Sorry it is not about the V6.....
Had my drive this morning courtesy of Hatfields in Wakefield. V8S in Firesand with Black Pack, Black wheels, Performance Seats / Premium Leather Dash with Orange Contrast Stitch, Loud button for the exhaust and Meridian Hi Fi. Pretty much the same spec as our own as it happens!
In 1 1/2 hours, I drove up the M1 to Aberford, over to Tadcaster, on to Bramham and then onto one of my favourite roads - Bramham to Thorner. Back to Bramham, down to Stutton and back, via Garforth, into Wakefield. A great mix of roads. John, from Hatfield's in the passenger seat, was safely strapped in, and given strict instructions not to whimper like a baby.
I will not give an in depth review of the looks as they are a personal thing, I for one love the look, the rear, especially from a 3/4 view, is lovely. The front, to my eyes, is a bit Ferrari California looking, no bad thing, but IMO all very well resolved.
Build quality looks very good, the paint finish excellent, panel gaps nice and even, and the roof is of very high quality. The interior is very nicely finished, again, well constructed from good materials, but certainly not bespoke in the Aston mould. The driving position, for me, was excellent. Plenty of seat adjustment, the sports seats are very supportive. The dash is nice and clutter free, instruments clear and easy to read quickly. I did not bother messing about with the Dynamic i system, straight into Dynamic mode, track DSC, exhaust loud button pressed, and off we go onto Denby Dale road.
OMG, the NOISE! Within 30 seconds, the grin stretched from ear to ear, John was gripping the centre grab handle, the exhaust emitted multiple staccato pops, bags and explosions, the rear tyres left two black lines on the asphalt, and we made rapid "progress" to the first roundabout. I reminded myself that we were on a public road, with a 40 limit, and that the BIB often hide further along behind the Nissan dealer. Holding back was a struggle.
The motorway section was a little boring, but even roof down ,the amount of buffeting inside (no wind deflector) was bearable. Stability is excellent, and the ride is firm but smooth. The steering is very direct, but, on the motorway, is not too sensitive and allows a nice straight line to be ploughed. After what seemed an age, we finally reached the Aberford turning, up the slip road, off the roundabout, and POWWWWEEERRRRR.
Power delivery is perfect, not so much that the rears lose grip too easily, and throw it away. The throttle is nicely weighted, with a great linearity, so that each input, large or small, is transmitted as intended. The gearbox, described as Quickshift, is exactly what it say on the tin. Again, the bellowing roar of the V8 on a surge is intoxicating, and the pop, bang, explosion of lift off has you diving to avoid the non existing bullets from the imaginary nearby firing range.
Turn in to the first corner, easy does it to get a feel for the loading of the tyres, and the impression is of near perfect neutrality. No understeer, front end dives into the corner and the rear faithfully follows. After a few more tight corners, we come across some lovely long sweepers. A chance to push the car a little more and explore a bit of oversteer. This car is so easy to play with. Power, slide, correct, shoot forwards on a crescendo of instant torquey traction. Again and again, I repeated the technique. Very effortless, but the chassis has a lovely balance, and leaves you feeling the hero.
Travelling from Bramham to Thorner, one of my favourite roads. Long straights with a few kinks and plenty of undulations, a couple of sharp corners and a great downhill left - right with an off camber right turn before a sharp left between two tight walls, followed by a gentle right, off camber uphill, before easing off until the road comes into view again. Back on the power, look left to see the the road further downhill is clear, sharp left and downhill again.
Whatever the surface, however difficult, this car just copes, without fuss, and with enormous grace and pace. The steering, though light, gives lovely feedback, is linear in turn in, and confident on the straight ahead. The suspension is always unflustered, very little roll, plenty of seat of the pants feedback, and firm but forgiving. Oversteer is easy to provoke, but also controllable, understeer virtually non existent.
Rarely have I driven a car that immediately feels at one with you, flatters you but also leaves you grinning, laughing, and searching out the next challenge just for the sheer hell of it. And the noise just gets better and better, intoxicating you and egging you to keep trying harder and harder.
Now I am a Jag fan, but also have to - purely for the purposes of my business - drive a great range of exotica. The F Type would, in any context, hold it's own no matter what the competition. This is a truly great car, maybe not bespoke like an Aston, focussed like a 458, exemplary like an MP4 or unhinged like the SLS. It is distillation of all of these, Extremely fast, wonderful noisy, brutish in a British tradition, but more importantly, full of sporting intent, just how a Jaguar should be.
Great car, great fun. Thank you John for not crying, or complaining that I used a full tank of fuel. And a set of rears!
Brilliant review, thanks Paul!Had my drive this morning courtesy of Hatfields in Wakefield. V8S in Firesand with Black Pack, Black wheels, Performance Seats / Premium Leather Dash with Orange Contrast Stitch, Loud button for the exhaust and Meridian Hi Fi. Pretty much the same spec as our own as it happens!
In 1 1/2 hours, I drove up the M1 to Aberford, over to Tadcaster, on to Bramham and then onto one of my favourite roads - Bramham to Thorner. Back to Bramham, down to Stutton and back, via Garforth, into Wakefield. A great mix of roads. John, from Hatfield's in the passenger seat, was safely strapped in, and given strict instructions not to whimper like a baby.
I will not give an in depth review of the looks as they are a personal thing, I for one love the look, the rear, especially from a 3/4 view, is lovely. The front, to my eyes, is a bit Ferrari California looking, no bad thing, but IMO all very well resolved.
Build quality looks very good, the paint finish excellent, panel gaps nice and even, and the roof is of very high quality. The interior is very nicely finished, again, well constructed from good materials, but certainly not bespoke in the Aston mould. The driving position, for me, was excellent. Plenty of seat adjustment, the sports seats are very supportive. The dash is nice and clutter free, instruments clear and easy to read quickly. I did not bother messing about with the Dynamic i system, straight into Dynamic mode, track DSC, exhaust loud button pressed, and off we go onto Denby Dale road.
OMG, the NOISE! Within 30 seconds, the grin stretched from ear to ear, John was gripping the centre grab handle, the exhaust emitted multiple staccato pops, bags and explosions, the rear tyres left two black lines on the asphalt, and we made rapid "progress" to the first roundabout. I reminded myself that we were on a public road, with a 40 limit, and that the BIB often hide further along behind the Nissan dealer. Holding back was a struggle.
The motorway section was a little boring, but even roof down ,the amount of buffeting inside (no wind deflector) was bearable. Stability is excellent, and the ride is firm but smooth. The steering is very direct, but, on the motorway, is not too sensitive and allows a nice straight line to be ploughed. After what seemed an age, we finally reached the Aberford turning, up the slip road, off the roundabout, and POWWWWEEERRRRR.
Power delivery is perfect, not so much that the rears lose grip too easily, and throw it away. The throttle is nicely weighted, with a great linearity, so that each input, large or small, is transmitted as intended. The gearbox, described as Quickshift, is exactly what it say on the tin. Again, the bellowing roar of the V8 on a surge is intoxicating, and the pop, bang, explosion of lift off has you diving to avoid the non existing bullets from the imaginary nearby firing range.
Turn in to the first corner, easy does it to get a feel for the loading of the tyres, and the impression is of near perfect neutrality. No understeer, front end dives into the corner and the rear faithfully follows. After a few more tight corners, we come across some lovely long sweepers. A chance to push the car a little more and explore a bit of oversteer. This car is so easy to play with. Power, slide, correct, shoot forwards on a crescendo of instant torquey traction. Again and again, I repeated the technique. Very effortless, but the chassis has a lovely balance, and leaves you feeling the hero.
Travelling from Bramham to Thorner, one of my favourite roads. Long straights with a few kinks and plenty of undulations, a couple of sharp corners and a great downhill left - right with an off camber right turn before a sharp left between two tight walls, followed by a gentle right, off camber uphill, before easing off until the road comes into view again. Back on the power, look left to see the the road further downhill is clear, sharp left and downhill again.
Whatever the surface, however difficult, this car just copes, without fuss, and with enormous grace and pace. The steering, though light, gives lovely feedback, is linear in turn in, and confident on the straight ahead. The suspension is always unflustered, very little roll, plenty of seat of the pants feedback, and firm but forgiving. Oversteer is easy to provoke, but also controllable, understeer virtually non existent.
Rarely have I driven a car that immediately feels at one with you, flatters you but also leaves you grinning, laughing, and searching out the next challenge just for the sheer hell of it. And the noise just gets better and better, intoxicating you and egging you to keep trying harder and harder.
Now I am a Jag fan, but also have to - purely for the purposes of my business - drive a great range of exotica. The F Type would, in any context, hold it's own no matter what the competition. This is a truly great car, maybe not bespoke like an Aston, focussed like a 458, exemplary like an MP4 or unhinged like the SLS. It is distillation of all of these, Extremely fast, wonderful noisy, brutish in a British tradition, but more importantly, full of sporting intent, just how a Jaguar should be.
Great car, great fun. Thank you John for not crying, or complaining that I used a full tank of fuel. And a set of rears!
Jaguar F-Type V8S v Aston V8 Vantage Roadster v 911S
http://www.ridelust.com/jaguar-f-type-v8s-v-aston-...
http://www.ridelust.com/jaguar-f-type-v8s-v-aston-...
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