Saw a bad crash on the M40 today

[C.A.R.]

I saw a pretty nasty crash in my home town months ago; a van which was overtaking something on a dual carriageway basically veered all the way back over lane 1, clipped the curb, went up a verge and cork-screwed into a wooded area. Must've been going faster than the 40mph limit!

I never saw anything about it afterwards, mind. I couldn't stop as I was travelling in the opposite direction.

[StottyZr]

I was in a similar crash earlier this year, I was passenger and the driver moved out infront of an Evo doing about 120 in a NSL. She swereved back out of its way and got into a tank slapper and stuffed it into the central reservation. Cue a broken hand and a panic attack and me walking around a bit bewildered.

I came to realise that the driving test teaches you how to drive in perfect conditions, but if something out of the ordinary happens 99% of drivers don't have a fking clue. She had no idea that swerving so aggressively (especially in a short wheel base car) would do what it did and had no idea how to correct the car once grip was broke.

[OMNIO]

mmm-five said:

Because of the posters bad grammar.

It's poster's not posters. Now go away.

I hope all were ok and the Audi driver is found.

[buggalugs]

I'm in two minds about Audi man, he may not have even realised exactly what happened, and thought the Ka was just some randomer who he saw spinning in his mirror. Anyway it wasn't much to do with him from what the OP says happened.

[squeezebm]

mmm-five said:

The reason I posted the comment, was because I genuinely thought he was claiming there were 7 occupants in Ford Ka, and would have meant the Ka was well overloaded.

If I've read it incorrectly due to the poster's bad grammar, then it's hardly my fault!

You absolute net nerding dhead now do as you are told and go away.

Hope the occupants were all ok. Too many avoidable accidents nowadays

[Super Slo Mo]

buggalugs said:

I'm in two minds about Audi man, he may not have even realised exactly what happened, and thought the Ka was just some randomer who he saw spinning in his mirror. Anyway it wasn't much to do with him from what the OP says happened.

Me too. It's quite a common thing for two cars to simultaneously change from lanes 1 and 3 into 2, with the car in L1 not seeing the one in L3 due to it being in the blind spot.

It's happened to me a couple of times in the past (both ways), now I tend not to go from L3 to L2 if there's a vehicle in L1 that looks like it might pull out, and vice versa, although lane changes to the right necessitate a biker style 'lifesaver' glance over my right shoulder.

My view is that both drivers are partially to blame for not anticipating the other's possible move. Each was moving into a clear lane, they just happened to do it at the same time and into the same space. Sadly in this case, it resulted in an accident.

[AH33]

Glad noone was hurt!

A ka with 5 women in it? Id have given that a WIDE berth. As in, id drive in the next county.

[jon-]

Assuming it was a MK1 KA, they only have 4 seatbelts, so the car was overloaded.

Glad everyone was ok though, and fair play to you both for stopping.

[Trtj]

This is just one more reason to have some sort of adverse car control in the driving test. It is ridiculous that nothings included, cost should not compromise safety. Cars are lethal weapons! Im gonna stop here before i get too irate

[PaulyDuk]

Super Slo Mo said:

Me too. It's quite a common thing for two cars to simultaneously change from lanes 1 and 3 into 2, with the car in L1 not seeing the one in L3 due to it being in the blind spot.

It's happened to me a couple of times in the past (both ways), now I tend not to go from L3 to L2 if there's a vehicle in L1 that looks like it might pull out, and vice versa, although lane changes to the right necessitate a biker style 'lifesaver' glance over my right shoulder.

This was the first thing I worked out on my first proper motorway journey (had only been driving a month) and will only move over to lane 2 if no one is over in lane 1 or certainly doesn't give the impression they will be moving over.

[RJP001]

And this is why the EU demands manufacturers fit ESP and dumming down of cars.

[lufbramatt]

It is scary how unstable little cars like that are at motorway speeds. I was nearly involved in a very similar accident when the guy in front of me aborted a lane change in a Peugeot 106. Braking +heavy steering input resulted in 3-4 over corrections, thought he was going to lose it and collect me in the process. Short wheelbase, possibly worn out dampers and small cars more likely to be driven by inexperienced "town" drivers?

[anonymous-user]

lufbramatt said:

It is scary how unstable little all cars like that are at motorway speeds.

EFA. Size has nothing to do with it.

[Super Slo Mo]

lufbramatt said:

It is scary how unstable little cars like that are at motorway speeds. I was nearly involved in a very similar accident when the guy in front of me aborted a lane change in a Peugeot 106. Braking +heavy steering input resulted in 3-4 over corrections, thought he was going to lose it and collect me in the process. Short wheelbase, possibly worn out dampers and small cars more likely to be driven by inexperienced "town" drivers?

I suspect it has more to do with the driver simply panicking and yanking on the steering wheel without having a clue as to what they're about to do.

It only takes a small movement of the steering wheel to induce a fairly sharp lane change at motorway speeds, so if the driver makes a very large, sudden movement, the car is going to react violently, and the driver will then make an even bigger steering wheel input the other way, which just compounds the problem.

[lufbramatt]

Max_Torque said:

lufbramatt said:

It is scary how unstable little all cars like that are at motorway speeds.

EFA. Size has nothing to do with it.

Long wheelbase saloons and estate type cars are definitely more stable than "square" hatchbacks. Obviously it's possible to lose control in any car given the right circumstances. I take your point that it's a very fine line in any car between being in and out of control as speeds increase.

Edited by lufbramatt on Wednesday 31st July 11:40

[Upatdawn]

have you seen a KA after a bump? a coke tin does better

[///Mike]

I agree with other comments here about Audi man to be honest in that he has not been involved in an accident so not sure a witch hunt is required. His involvement may have been that he saw a car full of gilrs having an accident at the same as the OP. He pulled over to make a call for help but could see the OP was already doing it so drove off. Some of us might have been more interested and made more of an effort to find out how the girls were but in his defence he may have called the police from his car as soon as he got on his way. Far safer than doing it from the hard shoulder etc and he wouldnt have been in a position to go back to the scene on a busy motorway.

[chris182]

Max_Torque said:

lufbramatt said:

It is scary how unstable little all cars like that are at motorway speeds.

EFA. Size has nothing to do with it.

That's not really true. The relationship between track and wheelbase does notably affect high speed stability, along with a host of other factors.

I saw a guy lose it and smash into the central reservation in front of me a few months back. I was astonished at the number of people who saw it happen that just drove straight past round both sides of the wreck, crunching over glass and bits of his smashed car. None of them thought to stop and check if everyone was ok and call the police etc.

[anonymous-user]

lufbramatt said:

Max_Torque said:

lufbramatt said:

It is scary how unstable little all cars like that are at motorway speeds.

EFA. Size has nothing to do with it.

Long wheelbase saloons and estate type cars are definitely more stable than "square" hatchbacks. Obviously it's possible to lose control in any car given the right circumstances.

If you do the maths, you'll see that the vehicles wheelbase only affects how much handwheel angle is required to meet a certain turn radius, whereas "stability" is much more a function of chassis tuning, suspension kinematics and aero characteristic (especially lift vs yaw profile - early audi tt anyone? ;-)

[chrisw666]

mmm-five said:

Because of the posters bad grammar.

If I have 5 apples, 1 large apple and 1 small apple, how many apples have I got? 5, 6, or 7?



5 passengers would indicate there must be at least 6 people in the car as there would have to have been a driver. A little girl couldn't have been the driver so that makes 7.

If the grammar had been correct then I'd have know it was 5 female OCCUPANTS, INCLUDING 1 teenager and 1 little girl.

Imagine reporting the accident and saying "There were 5 passengers, 1 child and 1 teenager" - you'd probably have the emergency services looking for a missing driver, child & teenager!

To be honest you probably need to relax, read things and interpret them a bit less literally.

You can apply something that exists called common sense, or you could polite and ask for clarification instead of being an utter idiot and having a pop at someone for some very minor grammatical errors.

It's very sad to see.