RE: Chris Harris video: Porsche 911 GT3
Discussion
It appears supremely capable and no doubt a phenomenal car in its own right. Also I would wager it's the most 'flattering' 911 for good but not exceptional drivers.
However, It still comes across as more a 911 3 GT (GT being grand tourer) rather than a GT3. Too polished and dare I say too friendly.
The marketplace will love it but it's not pandering to my fancy.
However, It still comes across as more a 911 3 GT (GT being grand tourer) rather than a GT3. Too polished and dare I say too friendly.
The marketplace will love it but it's not pandering to my fancy.
Mutema said:
My dilemma is that unless you go on track or risk your licence, you're never going to be able to enjoy this to full potential. I can understand why there are quite a few low mileage GT3-ilk cars on classifieds, you need to make trips to places where you can enjoy them otherwise it's very hard to justify the spend.
Hence why I suspect that in the real world the new Cayman S will be the better buy for 99% of people.Seany88 said:
RocketRabbit said:
Terminator X said:
It is a "performance" engine though that revs to 9k, surely any similar engine will require a rebuild somewhat sooner than a 1.2 Corsa?
TX.
Honda's F20C revs to 9000 puts out 125bhp/litre and comfotably does over 100k miles and that was released 14 years ago.TX.
Thinking about it, Electric PS, 4WS, high revving engines, surely this car is an overpriced Honda that is a decade and a half late?
The classic S2000 criticism of no torque is distinctly overblown, but in a car so good they all have to have foibles!
gofasterrosssco said:
fbrs said:
mollytherocker said:
flashygee said:
I can understand why harris miss a manual.
But my question is-can Porsche not develop
a simulated manual with a fake 6 or
seven gearshift controlled over the software!?
The gearbox would be the same with paddles and so on
but with a optional feeling for the normal Driver to shift a
Manual (and i mean not the optional up-down thing
with the shifter).And with a Option of Calibration the shifttimes of the 997 unit.
It would be a fake,but more customerfriendly for all Types of Buyers.
Just a little play with the idea,but would resolve
the problem for customers with the preference "I need a Manual
only and dont like the shift paddles".
That would be pointless. Would you have a fake clutch too? It just wouldnt work.But my question is-can Porsche not develop
a simulated manual with a fake 6 or
seven gearshift controlled over the software!?
The gearbox would be the same with paddles and so on
but with a optional feeling for the normal Driver to shift a
Manual (and i mean not the optional up-down thing
with the shifter).And with a Option of Calibration the shifttimes of the 997 unit.
It would be a fake,but more customerfriendly for all Types of Buyers.
Just a little play with the idea,but would resolve
the problem for customers with the preference "I need a Manual
only and dont like the shift paddles".
nice video. i look forward to the 'proper' pretty one! what a car, love it but at 1435kg it begs the question when is porsche going to get serious about shedding some lard?
Perhaps in years to come, when the manual g/box has finally had its day, some aftermarket companies or low-volume manufacturers will produce a add-on gear stick and clutch pedal to simulate what cars used to be like "back in the day"...
In a way its no more ludicrous than a system that plays fake engine noises into the cabin..
We dont go back from the Otto Engine to the Steammachine,and Porsche dont go back from pdk to manual.
But a simulated manual is a useful toy for the purists and need no change of the technical config. of the pdk.
Its like a refrigerator in the dashboard,no one need it really but it is cool to have the option for a
cold Drink
.And what is with the Electric Steering Rack of the new Cars of the Porsche line-its in the end effect a
simulated steering with no mechanical connection for the Driver from the steering wheel to the wheels.
But it is easier to maintain.
The same like a simulated shifting or Simulated Engine sound in the Cockpit.
Thats our reality.
And dont forget the another aspect-the 458 and the SLS have the same gearbox,but the fezzas pdk shifts
with softwaresupport faster as the sls.
Damages came to the 458 gearbox,with shorter maintenance service times for the owner with expensive bills.
To resolve this problem of Damages was the shifttime of the sls slower.(not in the Black Series!)
To make it more bulletproof.
But few owners of the sls dont like the slow reaction of the paddles and use the fullautomatic option or short said the shifttime with
paddles is pointless in the SLS but had the sls a manual it would be the worldbest.
Its the Brain of the Driver,with paddles he awaits a F1/Computergame style of working with fast shifting like a drive on a Racetrack or
empty B-Roads.
But the reality in the city is the Trainlike fullautomatic Mode like a Caddilac-in a Sportscar like the GT3.
But a Manual is more a selfcontrolled thing,slower sure,but it is "what we know " Fun Factor for the normal Driver.
And Harris said "Im not David Coulthard",and the most Drivers too.
To shift with the hands give a more sporty pure feeling with maybe forcefeedback style feeling like a real manual
with mechanical feel.
And when you shift with simulated gearshift is it better for the long living of the gearbox,the handcoordination
to the stick is slower as with the finger to the paddles and gives you the "i control the Car" Illusion.
And that would be a good option.
Edited by flashygee on Friday 14th June 16:13
Mermaid said:
jon- said:
Much like I can't really be too mad at Porsche for dropping the manual. .
Most, maybe all, E92 M3's are DCT amazing gearbox mated to a great engine. Would I like a manual in that car? I don't think so.You can't beat three pedals & a gearstick for involvement & no poxy paddle can replace that imo
But I am old fashioned & believe a drivers car should have RWD a N/A engine a LSD & a manual gearbox but appreciate I am in the minority in the current playstation generation, but it's good that we all like different things though.
i'm a huge fan of changing gears myself but have to admit the only time i drove flappy paddle (mp4-12c) i didn't miss that stick one bit... i wonder if enthusistic drivers of the 30's (?) got upset about mechanical timing distributors replacing their throttle pedal and advance/retard levers ?
fbrs said:
i'm a huge fan of changing gears myself but have to admit the only time i drove flappy paddle (mp4-12c) i didn't miss that stick one bit... i wonder if enthusistic drivers of the 30's (?) got upset about mechanical timing distributors replacing their throttle pedal and advance/retard levers ?
I bet they probably did.I remember having auto choke on a mk2 escort which used to piss me off. It was too extreme and stayed on longer than I wanted.
I put a manual choke on it and it was much better! You could adjust it down exactly how you wanted.
Seany88 said:
RocketRabbit said:
Terminator X said:
It is a "performance" engine though that revs to 9k, surely any similar engine will require a rebuild somewhat sooner than a 1.2 Corsa?
TX.
Honda's F20C revs to 9000 puts out 125bhp/litre and comfotably does over 100k miles and that was released 14 years ago.TX.
Thinking about it, Electric PS, 4WS, high revving engines, surely this car is an overpriced Honda that is a decade and a half late?
In any case the car looks fantastic, sounds divine and really makes me want one. I'll be eagerly waiting for a test drive, though like others have touched on I really do prefer a manual even if I do fluff my heel and toe changes occasionally, as it does break up the monotony of traffic and motorway journeys.
Sounds bloody good though on full bore!
Fire99 said:
It appears supremely capable and no doubt a phenomenal car in its own right. Also I would wager it's the most 'flattering' 911 for good but not exceptional drivers.
A car like this should challenge you to be better than you are, not flatter you to allow you to remain average.For me the GT3 was all about being a car you bought to challenge yourself. Like taming a wild animal.
It feels like the GT3 is now just buying a sheep in wolves clothing. It won't try kill you but it'll look and sound like it might.
So surely after a drive out you'll feel a bit cheated? Will you get out and think wow, but deep down know that it wasn't you making that possible, but the car?
Is that what these cars are all about?
It's called a GT3, but I think that is where the relationship to past GT3's ends in my view.
I still think things peaked with the 996.2, though the 996.1 looked the best. After that they became a bit 'obvious' for my tastes.
Dave
caraddict said:
What we need now is a 996 vs 997 vs 991 GT3 comparisons review!
In my head the 996 Mk1 GT3 and this 991 is just so far apart... as he mentioned - philosophically!
My favourite is still the 997 Mk1 GT3.
That's funny, I was only thinking yesterday that the 997.1 is my favourite too!In my head the 996 Mk1 GT3 and this 991 is just so far apart... as he mentioned - philosophically!
My favourite is still the 997 Mk1 GT3.
...but I really love this new car. Porsche have wiped out the weaknesses of the old model and tbh, the market demands a PDK type gearbox these days. Its only a tiny percentage of enthusiasts who want a manual and many of the people who actually buy these cars, rather than road test them or lust after them, want flappy paddles....
mollytherocker said:
cheddar said:
Aside from Chris looking like he's just done 6 months in Belsen concentration camp that video was brilliant.
His analysis, thoughtful, contrasting perspectives and ability to relay information so clearly to us enthusiasts is refreshing and inspiring.
Absolute top notch journalism allied with extraordinary skill behind the wheel.
Well done Chris and thankyou.
I couldn't agree more. His analysis, thoughtful, contrasting perspectives and ability to relay information so clearly to us enthusiasts is refreshing and inspiring.
Absolute top notch journalism allied with extraordinary skill behind the wheel.
Well done Chris and thankyou.
What a noise!!
I really didn't think I'd like this car due to the paddles and electric steering but seeing it flat out was fantastic. The power output and the way it just charges after 6k rpm is really impressive as well.
Still really wished it had a manual option
And what on earth was the GTR style dashboard stuff about 
Your better than them Porsche no need to go down that road I suppose we should just all be thankful its not a hybrid. If that happens I will find a local bridge and throw myself off it!
Edited by leeson660 on Saturday 15th June 09:47
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