RE: Mercedes A45 AMG: Review
Discussion
My concerns about not being able to intervene manually and then pull the up-lever to drop back into Drive afterwards, as mentioned in the story are, I'm told, unfounded. Apparently if you hold the the right paddle down and wait, the 'box will return to full auto mode.
Of course I need to check this is the case, so will book an A45 for another week....
Of course I need to check this is the case, so will book an A45 for another week....
Chris Harris said:
My concerns about not being able to intervene manually and then pull the up-lever to drop back into Drive afterwards, as mentioned in the story are, I'm told, unfounded. Apparently if you hold the the right paddle down and wait, the 'box will return to full auto mode.
Of course I need to check this is the case, so will book an A45 for another week....
Just out of pure curiosity, could you weigh it?Of course I need to check this is the case, so will book an A45 for another week....
With regard to the 'who's going to buy an A45?' question, here's an example: my neighbour's booked a test drive. He's a rural-based freelance TV/film camera bod that works across the length and breadth of the UK.
He needs a hatchback with folding rear seats for his kit (and he doesn't like "lardy estates"); he needs 4WD so that his jobs aren't hobbled by snow, etc; he needs 0-60 in 4.1secs cos he's a petrol head; and he needs mid-30s MPG and low-ish CO2/car tax cos he's a Scot. He says, "I've a feeling you're going to see quite a few A45s in the car parks at Pinewood, Shepperton, etc..."
He needs a hatchback with folding rear seats for his kit (and he doesn't like "lardy estates"); he needs 4WD so that his jobs aren't hobbled by snow, etc; he needs 0-60 in 4.1secs cos he's a petrol head; and he needs mid-30s MPG and low-ish CO2/car tax cos he's a Scot. He says, "I've a feeling you're going to see quite a few A45s in the car parks at Pinewood, Shepperton, etc..."
EdM said:
...because its a valid discussion about the Merc A45 AMG and inevitably people will as there are on this thread making these sorts of comparisons . It is evidently a genuine alternative for some - it is after all a forum where discussion and viewpoint are welcomed and not shot down simply because other's perfectly valid input is not agreed with ..
It isn't valid at all. The sort of person SERIOUSLY considering a new A45 will not be looking at a seven year old 911. The fact that they may be same price is irrelevant. They are completely different cars designed to do completely different things. Yes, people will look at the classifieds and see how far their money will go, but if they're serious about a new A45 their head will quickly tell them a 7 year old 911 is not right for them. Incidentally, keep that 911 for three years and it'll be ten years old. Do Porsche offer warranties on cars older than 10 years? That'll make a big difference to resale value.This is not about shooting people down who have different views. It's about stopping every new car thread being hijacked by the 'Anyone who buys new is an idiot' brigade.
SonicHedgeHog said:
EdM said:
...because its a valid discussion about the Merc A45 AMG and inevitably people will as there are on this thread making these sorts of comparisons . It is evidently a genuine alternative for some - it is after all a forum where discussion and viewpoint are welcomed and not shot down simply because other's perfectly valid input is not agreed with ..
It isn't valid at all. The sort of person SERIOUSLY considering a new A45 will not be looking at a seven year old 911. The fact that they may be same price is irrelevant. They are completely different cars designed to do completely different things. Yes, people will look at the classifieds and see how far their money will go, but if they're serious about a new A45 their head will quickly tell them a 7 year old 911 is not right for them. Incidentally, keep that 911 for three years and it'll be ten years old. Do Porsche offer warranties on cars older than 10 years? That'll make a big difference to resale value.This is not about shooting people down who have different views. It's about stopping every new car thread being hijacked by the 'Anyone who buys new is an idiot' brigade.
I'm equally happy to buy new or old - its the cost that matters to me. I want rear seats for occasional use by small children, so anything but another 2 seater is practical enough.
Sigh, it really doesnt. It introduces too many variables - there is a big disparity in used car prices (miles, condition etc) so its not the same as comparing new cars with fairly fixed pricing or known discounts. Plus the condition of the used car could mean flawless reliability or big bills. Warranties, financing and company car policies might mean they are unavailable to a lot of consumers.
To extrapolate, its the same reason they dont include pre-registered cars in new car tests. Just because a magazine finds *one dealer* with a pre-reg'd A45 AMG for less than the cost of a new M135i it doesnt make it a cheaper car.
Furthermore, used cars suffer supply and demand. If Evo declared their "car of the year" was a five year old BMW for 15 grand, and we all rushed out to buy one, we wouldnt be able to. There's a finite supply. We cant go on a waiting list or pre-order.
Its why cars are generally compared stock vs stock, new vs new, or used vs used (e.g. $10k used car shootout) by the press. Any new vs used comparisons tend to be heavily caveated that your mileage / ownership experience may vary.
To extrapolate, its the same reason they dont include pre-registered cars in new car tests. Just because a magazine finds *one dealer* with a pre-reg'd A45 AMG for less than the cost of a new M135i it doesnt make it a cheaper car.
Furthermore, used cars suffer supply and demand. If Evo declared their "car of the year" was a five year old BMW for 15 grand, and we all rushed out to buy one, we wouldnt be able to. There's a finite supply. We cant go on a waiting list or pre-order.
Its why cars are generally compared stock vs stock, new vs new, or used vs used (e.g. $10k used car shootout) by the press. Any new vs used comparisons tend to be heavily caveated that your mileage / ownership experience may vary.
Wadeski said:
Sigh, it really doesnt. It introduces too many variables - there is a big disparity in used car prices (miles, condition etc) so its not the same as comparing new cars with fairly fixed pricing or known discounts. Plus the condition of the used car could mean flawless reliability or big bills. Warranties, financing and company car policies might mean they are unavailable to a lot of consumers.
To extrapolate, its the same reason they dont include pre-registered cars in new car tests. Just because a magazine finds *one dealer* with a pre-reg'd A45 AMG for less than the cost of a new M135i it doesnt make it a cheaper car.
Furthermore, used cars suffer supply and demand. If Evo declared their "car of the year" was a five year old BMW for 15 grand, and we all rushed out to buy one, we wouldnt be able to. There's a finite supply. We cant go on a waiting list or pre-order.
Its why cars are generally compared stock vs stock, new vs new, or used vs used (e.g. $10k used car shootout) by the press. Any new vs used comparisons tend to be heavily caveated that your mileage / ownership experience may vary.
I'm more interested in real choices that real people make, rather than artificial contrived comparisons the press choose to make.To extrapolate, its the same reason they dont include pre-registered cars in new car tests. Just because a magazine finds *one dealer* with a pre-reg'd A45 AMG for less than the cost of a new M135i it doesnt make it a cheaper car.
Furthermore, used cars suffer supply and demand. If Evo declared their "car of the year" was a five year old BMW for 15 grand, and we all rushed out to buy one, we wouldnt be able to. There's a finite supply. We cant go on a waiting list or pre-order.
Its why cars are generally compared stock vs stock, new vs new, or used vs used (e.g. $10k used car shootout) by the press. Any new vs used comparisons tend to be heavily caveated that your mileage / ownership experience may vary.
As I said, all of the old-car-maintainance costs are real, but are offset against the new-car-depreciation costs. If 2 cars have the same purchase cost, and similar annual costs and these costs fit my budget, then they might find themselves on my shortlist. Just because you dont read about it in Evo doesnt mean that someone isnt making a real choice
SonicHedgeHog said:
EdM said:
...because its a valid discussion about the Merc A45 AMG and inevitably people will as there are on this thread making these sorts of comparisons . It is evidently a genuine alternative for some - it is after all a forum where discussion and viewpoint are welcomed and not shot down simply because other's perfectly valid input is not agreed with ..
It isn't valid at all. The sort of person SERIOUSLY considering a new A45 will not be looking at a seven year old 911. The fact that they may be same price is irrelevant. They are completely different cars designed to do completely different things. Yes, people will look at the classifieds and see how far their money will go, but if they're serious about a new A45 their head will quickly tell them a 7 year old 911 is not right for them. Incidentally, keep that 911 for three years and it'll be ten years old. Do Porsche offer warranties on cars older than 10 years? That'll make a big difference to resale value.This is not about shooting people down who have different views. It's about stopping every new car thread being hijacked by the 'Anyone who buys new is an idiot' brigade.
I personally fell out of love with Mercs of late - having owned four in succession over a few years and grew increasingly underwhelmed with poor build quality and a fundamental lack of character - even a dealer friend of mine who frequently trades and subsequently champions AMG's - letting me drive a couple of examples in the hope I'd be a convert still hasn't changed my view - Having said that to tarnish a new car such as the A45 with the same brush would be wrong - it is a wholly new car and first reviews positive - it appears it is a move by Merc toward engineering genuinely 'exciting cars' again - my view though remains that however good it may be and irrespective of the argument for buying any car new or second hand it will never offer the 'opportunity' of cherishing a piece of proper automotive history on offer when you are fortunate enough to have £40k burning a hole in your pocket..
Merc lease deals are particularly strong at the moment as well, which is a big plus point in "buying new" favour. You can get into a car like this and out again in 2-3 years having spent less (bearing in mind the maintenance costs are rolled in) than you would lose in depreciation. C63 AMG deals in particular are very tempting.
As much as I like 997TTs it's a completely different ownership proposition and there's more to consider than just "it costs the same as this new car ipso facto it's equivalent".
As much as I like 997TTs it's a completely different ownership proposition and there's more to consider than just "it costs the same as this new car ipso facto it's equivalent".
said:
I want rear seats for occasional use by small children, so anything but another 2 seater is practical enough.
Therefore you are not this car's target market. Mercedes knows there are a lot of people who want performance, practicality and luxury in a car smaller than a Tiger Tank. That is who this car is aimed at. You just need performance with the merest hint of practicality. It's a different thing. As you say, anything with more than two seats is on your radar.In the A45 golf clubs go in the boot. So does a mountain bike and a big supermarket shop. It's a doddle to park and people will let you out at busy junctions. When it's chucking it down outside you can open the back door throw everything in and jump into the easy access driver's seat. You can take four adult passengers in comfort on a longish journey. You can take loads of junk to the tip without having to pile it up on your leather seats. You can't do any of this in a 911. Comparing the two is pointless.
Edited by SonicHedgeHog on Wednesday 10th July 21:33
SonicHedgeHog said:
said:
I want rear seats for occasional use by small children, so anything but another 2 seater is practical enough.
Therefore you are not this car's target market. Mercedes knows there are a lot of people who want performance, practicality and luxury in a car smaller than a Tiger Tank. That is who this car is aimed at. You just need performance with the merest hint of practicality. It's a different thing. As you say, anything with more than two seats is on your radar.In the A45 golf clubs go in the boot. So does a mountain bike and a big supermarket shop. It's a doddle to park and people will let you out at busy junctions. When it's chucking it down outside you can open the back door throw everything in and jump into the easy access driver's seat. You can take four adult passengers in comfort on a longish journey. You can take loads of junk to the tip without having to pile it up on your leather seats. You can't do any of this in a 911. Comparing the two is pointless.
Edited by SonicHedgeHog on Wednesday 10th July 21:33
Thanks for clearing that up
pilchardthecat said:
Ah ok, so because i'm "not this car's target market" i'm not permitted to consider buying one
Thanks for clearing that up
No, you can consider buying one as much as you like. Just don't critically compare it to another car which it was never in a million years intended to compete against. Thanks for clearing that up
SonicHedgeHog said:
pilchardthecat said:
Ah ok, so because i'm "not this car's target market" i'm not permitted to consider buying one
Thanks for clearing that up
No, you can consider buying one as much as you like. Just don't critically compare it to another car which it was never in a million years intended to compete against. Thanks for clearing that up
CJP80 said:
Just out of pure curiosity, could you weigh it?
AMG had one on their stand at the nurburgring last weekend & it quoted 1550 something kg iirc. I asked the attendant if they'd tested it it round the north loop yet & he said no, though when I asked if it would get close to 8 mins he laughed & said no-way too heavy.Have to say in the flesh it just looked a little uninspiring even blinged up in white with black alloys & red spoilers/highlights. This may have had something to do with the yellow sls black series it was parked next to however.
pilchardthecat said:
I'll compare it to all the other cars i'm thinking about buying, and which fall inside my budget - that's what rational people do when they are in the process of buying a car
Quite so, but you're not being rational. You're completely biased in favour of the Porsche. Both cars have strong suits but the only thing that draws your attention to the A45 is performance. If it was a Golf GTI with a Mercedes badge you'd never consider it. So you dismiss the massive every-day usability advantage that the Mercedes has and compare it to a car whose overriding design brief is to be massively fast. Of course the Merc will be lacking because you've tied both arms behind its back. I could be equally critical of the 911 turbo by comparing it to a supercharged Range Rover. They're both 4wd and yet the 911 is crap offroad. Therefore anyone who buys the 911 when they could have had a Range Rover is stupid.
I'm actually leaning towards the Merc at the moment, not at all biased towards the Porsche. The problem with the 911 is that it is quite conspicuous, i would worry about leaving it in certain places, and the limited practicality does mean i would still be using the family bus for weekends away etc
But the pork is an aspiration i've had for some time. Overall i'm 50/50 at the moment - since i'm planning on buying around October time it will probably boil down to the dealer discounts when the fizz of the new model has worn off a bit
But the pork is an aspiration i've had for some time. Overall i'm 50/50 at the moment - since i'm planning on buying around October time it will probably boil down to the dealer discounts when the fizz of the new model has worn off a bit
Guffy said:
I test drove one a couple of weeks ago and put a deposit down on the back of it. Harris nails the review for me and the car is exactly what I’m looking for, so Mercedes have found their target consumer here.
Hopefully be delivered at the end of September.
ETA. My local dealer had 20 slots and they've all been snapped up.
Guffy , who is your dealer ? I am looking for a test drive however Epsom don't have one available yet.Hopefully be delivered at the end of September.
ETA. My local dealer had 20 slots and they've all been snapped up.
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