Driving to the letter of the highway code.....

[mikal83]

After being here on PH for a while, its getting rather annoying to the rather childish nit picking to an OP"s post. Your spelling's wrong/bad english/oh you didnt use a colon when you should have/do you mean this,that etc). The very first reply says it all and then several others followed.
No wonder aussies call us whinging poms.
If you really cant answer the OP's ?, then just why do you feel you just have to post a childish stupid little boy answer. Grow up FFS.
(No doubt I'll get incoming on this too)!

[GreatGranny]

I drive like this nearly all the time, maunly to conserve fuel and also because I don't want to get into some willy waving overtaking/speed competition.

I drive at 65-70 on the A1, 60-65 on the A17/A57 and have been for the last 4 weeks.
Not once have I been subjected to aggressive behaviour or road rage. Not even an evil stare.

More chilled out up north (lincolnshire/Notts) I think.

We will see what happens next week when I tow the caravan from Lincolnshire to Brighton :-) Cruise set to 60 so I'm creeping past the artics on the M1/M25 :-)

[Ozzie Osmond]

AJI said:

My experiment was over a 7 day period and took in a variety of roads, from small villages, to London streets and also various motorways and 'A' roads. Most of them at some point resulted in a driver displaying some sort of 'aggression'

If you're deliberately driving in a way which annoys other road users then you're driving like an idiot - it's as simple as that. Just keep off the roads, please, and let normal humans get on with their lives.

[CraigyMc]

Eski1991 said:

I'm always surprised how few people, police included, have no idea that a bicycle can use one way roads in either direction.

Best of luck with that.

http://road.cc/content/news/73530-%C2%A31000-bill-...

"Salmoning" is dangerous.

C

[Dr Jekyll]

Eski1991 said:

I'm always surprised how few people, police included, have no idea that a bicycle can use one way roads in either direction.

ALL one way roads?

[tigger1]

Eski1991 said:

I'm always surprised how few people, police included, have no idea that a bicycle can use one way roads in either direction.

Evidence?

[Coldfuse]

Ozzie Osmond said:

AJI said:

My experiment was over a 7 day period and took in a variety of roads, from small villages, to London streets and also various motorways and 'A' roads. Most of them at some point resulted in a driver displaying some sort of 'aggression'

If you're deliberately driving in a way which annoys other road users then you're driving like an idiot - it's as simple as that. Just keep off the roads, please, and let normal humans get on with their lives.

Arguably, if you get annoyed at someone who is doing 59 in a 60 or 29 in a 30 then you have larger problems!

[AJI]

g3org3y said:

AJI said:

To satisfy your 'poking' read 'below' as 68-69 on motorways or about 59 on 'A' roads or 29 on city roads where the relevant speed limits apply.

Speedo indicated I assume (rather than on the sat nav)?

Sat-nav indicated.
As we were on holiday and covering a lot of miles touring England it was also an economy style drive hence why I selected speed and just slapped cruise control on.


Does this also set me up for an eco-drive attack?

[AJI]

Ozzie Osmond said:

AJI said:

My experiment was over a 7 day period and took in a variety of roads, from small villages, to London streets and also various motorways and 'A' roads. Most of them at some point resulted in a driver displaying some sort of 'aggression'

If you're deliberately driving in a way which annoys other road users then you're driving like an idiot - it's as simple as that. Just keep off the roads, please, and let normal humans get on with their lives.

If you're deliberately posting to to climb up on to some sort of moral high horse then you're not doing a good job

But if you read my original post, I was driving to my interpretation of the highway code, and attempting to drive in a manner that was as close as possible to the letter/meaning of that code.
So what you are attempting to state in your reply here is that you view the highway code as being annoying and idiotic to other road users, which from my experiment does actually back that up.
Which makes your reply a bit confusing as you seem to be stating that 'normal humans' "should" not be following the highway code.. ?? .. ?

[S. Gonzales Esq.]

My 2p on this subject:

It's entirely possible to drive strictly according to the HC if that floats your boat, but only if you bear in mind that no other road user will be expecting you to behave that way.

In any situation, you'd need to be aware of potential for conflict and make it easier for other road users to tell what you're going to do by appropriate signals and clear 'chassis language'. Watching how they react will give you feedback on how well you've managed this.

If you're regularly encountering road rage, you're not doing it right.

[mikal83]

AJI said:

If you're deliberately posting to to climb up on to some sort of moral high horse then you're not doing a good job

But if you read my original post, I was driving to my interpretation of the highway code, and attempting to drive in a manner that was as close as possible to the letter/meaning of that code.
So what you are attempting to state in your reply here is that you view the highway code as being annoying and idiotic to other road users, which from my experiment does actually back that up.
Which makes your reply a bit confusing as you seem to be stating that 'normal humans' "should" not be following the highway code.. ?? .. ?

Re my post mate............ozzie osmond..gosh how original.

[Riley Blue]

Captain Muppet said:

Riley Blue said:

OP - the make and model of car might have a bearing on other motorists' attitude towards your 'by the book' driving. What was it?

Either he needs to update his garage or he was conducting his experiment in a Ferrari 458...

Which is the reason I asked. It must be squashed in there with four-up.

[AJI]

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

My 2p on this subject:

It's entirely possible to drive strictly according to the HC if that floats your boat, but only if you bear in mind that no other road user will be expecting you to behave that way.

That is a very strange thing don't you think?
That nobody these days expects one to drive to the highway code.
Part of my reason why I chose to do a little write up on this (hence this post).

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

In any situation, you'd need to be aware of potential for conflict and make it easier for other road users to tell what you're going to do by appropriate signals and clear 'chassis language'. Watching how they react will give you feedback on how well you've managed this.

Driving to the highway code is supposed to demonstrate this yes?

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

If you're regularly encountering road rage, you're not doing it right.

This part I do contest. I consider myself an experience driver in both senses of the meaning, that being car control and ability to demonstratably follow the highway code.
I've been teaching motorsport track driving on and off since 2006 and also recently teaching a few newcomers to road driving in my spare time, so I've recently been reading up on the highway code. OK, there will be some who instantly state that this doesn't make you an expert on anything, indeed it doesn't. But, I would say that I am definitely not below standard in any respect and if I were causing road rage from inapproriate actions on my behalf then I would not be attempting to gloat about it on PH nor anywhere else.

I think the main issue is what you've already stated previously... that being that many road users these days do not expect vehicles to fully act within the tight boundaries of the highway code, and that as so many vehicles demonstrate bending of the rules, that when an impatient driver expects the vehicle infront to bend them and they don't, it irritates them.


I will expand on one of the road rage incidents I encountered within 15mins of my holiday.
The road is a 2-lane dual carriageway with national speed limit. I'm travelling along at gps stated 69mph. I approach two HGVs elephant-racing with the overtaking HGV slowly creeping past the other. I take off cruise control and engine brake down to about 50mph as the HGVs were overtaking on an incline.
I mirror, indicate and maneouvre in to lane two and keep the "2 second rule" gap distance as lane 2 traffic slowly edges past the HGV in lane 1.
Checking my mirrors regularly I notice white van man approaching at....lets call it 70mph to reduce any potential arguments or pre-judging.
White van man has to slow as both lanes infront of him have traffic.
But as I keep a 2 second gap he pulls in to lane 1 and attemps to "undertake" (or passing on the left as people will like to point out). But the car following the HGV in lane 1 slows and prevents him passing on the left.
White van man pulls back in to lane 2 and starts to tail-gate.

Meanwhile the overtaking HGV starts to slow a little meaning that both lane 1 and 2 traffic is travelling at the same speed.
Still maintaining the 2 second gap I slow in accordance with the HGV in front of me.
This seemed to be the 'tipping point' for white van man as he now flashes lights and gives hand signals.
Car in lane 1 is now about half a car's length infront to the nearside and the HGV in front of me is still at 2 second gap.

White van man now closes gap so that I can only see the mercedes badge on the front of his bonnet grill in the rear view mirror.
I decide that this gap is not safe and the 45(ish) mph speed we were travelling at meant that any hazzard ahead that could result in braking would have a high change of him running in to the back of me, maybe spinning me off the road and injury etc. etc. (possibilities are endless some would say).
So, due to the close proximity of the following white van man I did not want to use the brake pedal to slow my speed, so instead I placed on my hazzard lights for a few seconds and lifted off the accelerator.
When I had a 2 second gap space in lane 1 I then indicated left for a few seconds and pulled in to lane 1.

This was the second 'tipping point' for white van man in which he pulled up beside me with window down shouting all sorts of abuse and even swerving his van close to my car with us both travelling at about 45mph.

I did not react, although if the inlaws were not in the car it would have been a very different story!
Anyways, the missus noted the reg plate and it was reported to the police.

If you can find fault with my actions then I would really appreciate how I could have done it 'better'. Also if you notice any points of my actions above which do not follow the meaning of the highway code.

[AJI]

Riley Blue said:

Captain Muppet said:

Riley Blue said:

OP - the make and model of car might have a bearing on other motorists' attitude towards your 'by the book' driving. What was it?

Either he needs to update his garage or he was conducting his experiment in a Ferrari 458...

Which is the reason I asked. It must be squashed in there with four-up.

haha not in the Ferrari!
Saab 9-3. A car that doesn't usually attract negative attention.

[CraigyMc]

AJI said:

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

If you're regularly encountering road rage, you're not doing it right.

This part I do contest. <snip>

I have no doubt that Sheldon also thinks everyone else has a problem with his OCD.

It doesn't make it the case.

C

[TangerinePool]

Complex issue.

On one hand the Highway Code may be overly safe and not in the best interests of efficient driving.

Then you could say that driving standards have worsened, due to things like increase in traffic, pace of life in general with unsuitable roads and layouts to cater for this etc.

Then you could say that people just need to relax more, stick to the rules as much as possible and don't involve themselves in 'fights' to be quickest or suffer the most indignation.

I personally would love to retest everyone to a strict set of rules that prove the driver is not only competent with their car but understands and can 'feel' what is required - gear changes, speed increases etc. I'd also update the highway code to reflect this.

Drones that follow signs and procedures without any though or feeling as to why they are doing so are not conducive to good, competent driving IMHO

[SOL111]

AJI

I would agree with this. Not so long ago I was caught speeding. Despite observing the speed limit in a village I was clocked doing 35mph as I passed an NSL sign coming out of a 30mph zone (a bit harsh IMHO). I went to the speed awareness course and have since been driving to the limit everywhere to save points/fine.

Apart from about 10% of the driving population, this seems to cheese everybody off. Often quite unecessarily too. My conclusion is that there are a lot of simple (in the head) drivers about.

For instance, my commute involves a 10 mile B road drive through a range of 30/40/60mph limits with a guaranteed hold up at the end of the road. Logically there is absolutely no need to break the law just to sit in a queue for longer. Surely it's better to do 30mph (or lower) past two schools and various villages. Despite this I see the same commuters every day busting a gut to overtake me, gesturing in the process. Why exactly?

[swisstoni]

This thread is delicious.

[S. Gonzales Esq.]

AJI said:

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

My 2p on this subject:

It's entirely possible to drive strictly according to the HC if that floats your boat, but only if you bear in mind that no other road user will be expecting you to behave that way.

That is a very strange thing don't you think?
That nobody these days expects one to drive to the highway code.
Part of my reason why I chose to do a little write up on this (hence this post).

Agreed - it's strange that 'playing by the rules' should be unusual behaviour, but I think we'll all concede that strict compliance is rare, and outright flouting of the rules is quite common.

It's also entirely possible that many drivers are aware of the rules and that they're not following them, and don't take kindly to being reminded of it.

AJI said:

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

In any situation, you'd need to be aware of potential for conflict and make it easier for other road users to tell what you're going to do by appropriate signals and clear 'chassis language'. Watching how they react will give you feedback on how well you've managed this.

Driving to the highway code is supposed to demonstrate this yes?

No, can't agree with you there. There's nothing in the code about seeking out feedback from other road users and altering your plans in the light of it, but I'd argue it's actually an essential part of good road driving.

AJI said:

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

If you're regularly encountering road rage, you're not doing it right.

This part I do contest. I consider myself an experience driver in both senses of the meaning, that being car control and ability to demonstratably follow the highway code...

By 'not doing it right', I was referring to what I wrote about 'being aware of potential for conflict..' and so on, not that you weren't following the HC correctly.

AJI said:

If you can find fault with my actions then I would really appreciate how I could have done it 'better'. Also if you notice any points of my actions above which do not follow the meaning of the highway code.

As I said, I wasn't implying that you weren't driving to the HC. I'm also not really trying to find fault with what you did - the question in these situations should always be 'what could I have done better?'. The thing to avoid is 'I don't care why it happened just so long as it was the other guy's fault' (cf. lots of threads in General Gassing.)


How does this sound for next time: You're aware that many people are impatient and are prepared to tailgate. Given the elephant racing situation you describe, the alternative option might have been to hold position in L1 until you're able to make progress in L2.

There's not much progress benefit in moving out when you can't pass, and you're aware that maintaining a sensible but unusual following distance while in L2 might be misconstrued by other road users - impatient men in white vans in particular.

In the case you describe the fault was undoubtedly 100% with the van driver, but that doesn't mean that you couldn't have avoided the situation by making different decisions.

Edited by S. Gonzales Esq. on Tuesday 30th July 13:03

[CraigyMc]

SOL111 said:

My conclusion is that there are a lot of simple (in the head) drivers about

You realise that this includes you, up until you had your NIP?

C