"Pedestrians in the road" on the motorway, does anyone care?
Discussion
Richspec said:
Are the weather station cameras viewable in the same control room? and if so do you monitor them as well?
We do have weather sensors, there are some that monitor wind speed, these are usually placed on bridges and open areas, obvious really.........We also have Fog sensors, these tend to be placed in valleys or on the top of hills, ie, J22,M62
Both types of sensors set/clear signals automatically.
Edited by Gafferjim on Monday 9th September 15:18
CommanderJameson said:
If anyone wants gory technical details, I work with the software that makes GafferJim's operator terminal go, so ask away and I'll answer to the best of my ability.
Why can't you use an RSS feed of football results and latest goals to fill up the matrices when they're not displaying fog warnings 
Maybe the odd joke, nothing too blue, you could do limericks on successive gantries...Paul O said:
This sign seems to be incresingly common recently, on motorway travels and as yet I have never seen a pedestrian in the road.
.....
When you see the sign, what do you do? Heightened awareness perhaps? But at what point do you disregard the message as being erroneous?
Unless its already been said........
When you see the sign, what do you do? Heightened awareness perhaps? But at what point do you disregard the message as being erroneous?
Has anyone else seen 'Workforce in Road'
Having checked there was no workforce and not in the road, the closest guess was at the next junction parked up on the hard shoulder, a wagon of cones with 3 guys in the front probably waiting for the signs on their carriageway to say 'workforce in road'
saaby93 said:
nless its already been said...
Has anyone else seen 'Workforce in Road'
Having checked there was no workforce and not in the road, the closest guess was at the next junction parked up on the hard shoulder, a wagon of cones with 3 guys in the front probably waiting for the signs on their carriageway to say 'workforce in road'
Did you see if they were waiting to put them out or had just finished bringing them in. Has anyone else seen 'Workforce in Road'
Having checked there was no workforce and not in the road, the closest guess was at the next junction parked up on the hard shoulder, a wagon of cones with 3 guys in the front probably waiting for the signs on their carriageway to say 'workforce in road'
Your post is like the info that goes into control rooms, usually half a story at best ortherwise a guess.
1.I have had been sent to 'just hit central res, sat nav says Bham 70 odds miles but there's a slip rd with traffic lights (jnc 19 knutsford)
2.Don't know where I am but I'm going from Wales to Manchester and i can see there's lots of lights (stanlow)
3. Car gone off rd at 'jnc 11) A search by fire, hato, police, Ambo found them 10 miles away at jnc 14 trapped, upside down in a field.
I wouldn't like to blow GJims trumpet but he can generally locate and narrow debris to within a 100m or so and which lane it may be in using midas if it cannot be picked up on camera.
Even if you had put the day or more specifically the time we could guess what the road workers were up to, also it takes a while to put out hard signs go round put up other hard signs go round to set out tapers but people lay in bed or driving past don't see that bit like they don't see tarmac or concrete curing
markmullen said:
CommanderJameson said:
If anyone wants gory technical details, I work with the software that makes GafferJim's operator terminal go, so ask away and I'll answer to the best of my ability.
Why can't you use an RSS feed of football results and latest goals to fill up the matrices when they're not displaying fog warnings Maybe the odd joke, nothing too blue, you could do limericks on successive gantries..."I SAY I SAY I SAY"
"KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING"
"DON'T HOG THE MIDDLE LANE"
"CHECK YOUR FUEL LEVEL"
"DON'T DRIVE TIRED"
And other things that are hilariously obvious, but which apparently escape a great many drivers.
5000 drivers a year run out of fuel on the motorway. Mind-boggling.
speedyguy said:
saaby93 said:
Unless its already been said...
Has anyone else seen 'Workforce in Road'
Having checked there was no workforce and not in the road, the closest guess was at the next junction parked up on the hard shoulder, a wagon of cones with 3 guys in the front probably waiting for the signs on their carriageway to say 'workforce in road'
Did you see if they were waiting to put them out or had just finished bringing them in. Has anyone else seen 'Workforce in Road'
Having checked there was no workforce and not in the road, the closest guess was at the next junction parked up on the hard shoulder, a wagon of cones with 3 guys in the front probably waiting for the signs on their carriageway to say 'workforce in road'
Your post is like the info that goes into control rooms, usually half a story at best ortherwise a guess.
1.I have had been sent to 'just hit central res, sat nav says Bham 70 odds miles but there's a slip rd with traffic lights (jnc 19 knutsford)
2.Don't know where I am but I'm going from Wales to Manchester and i can see there's lots of lights (stanlow)
3. Car gone off rd at 'jnc 11) A search by fire, hato, police, Ambo found them 10 miles away at jnc 14 trapped, upside down in a field.
I wouldn't like to blow GJims trumpet but he can generally locate and narrow debris to within a 100m or so and which lane it may be in using midas if it cannot be picked up on camera.
Even if you had put the day or more specifically the time we could guess what the road workers were up to, also it takes a while to put out hard signs go round put up other hard signs go round to set out tapers but people lay in bed or driving past don't see that bit like they don't see tarmac or concrete curing
If theyre not yet out setting out the road, put up a sign saying something like 'setting out begins at 10pm'
Once they really are in the road and don't leave it till 10:30
'workforce in road'
Does what it says, says what it means
Gafferjim said:
We do have weather sensors, there are some that monitor wind speed, these are usually placed on bridges and open areas, obvious really.........
We also have Fog sensors, these tend to be placed in valleys or on the top of hills, ie, J22,M62
Both types of sensors set/clear signals automatically.
Yep, I know about the wind and fog sensors that are linked to nerts? as I've installed them in your area..You mentioned earlier that you want more cameras, hence the question about the weather station cams. There was a couple of sites that had the capability to transmit live images but that never got taken on and have been ripped out. We also have Fog sensors, these tend to be placed in valleys or on the top of hills, ie, J22,M62
Both types of sensors set/clear signals automatically.
Edited by Gafferjim on Monday 9th September 15:18
I've once seen live images from the weather station camera, but it goes to the Mac, not to us as it's on a different feed or something ( not into the technical stuff) also they weren't PZT either. I know that there is CCTV at some of the junctions in Cumbria, but it's local authority stuff, and we can't get a feed.
If you put the weather stations in, can you nip down and re-site the one J16-J17, M60. It's too near the river and we do get false settings from it.
If you put the weather stations in, can you nip down and re-site the one J16-J17, M60. It's too near the river and we do get false settings from it.
k-ink said:
All the time in my experience. Telling us to slow down, speed up, slow down again, incident here, yada yada. Never seen anything! I ignore them now. Total waste of time.
Read the thread from the start, and you'll see why sometimes you don't see anything.mcdjl said:
Which control room are you based in, and is this the one that the visit is likely to be around?
yes.Roadworks are a particularly problematic job to set for.
We have in our region two distinctly different contractor area's, one does the Northern part, and the other does the Southern part.
The Foreman calls in with the details of the closure. He works with the gang who's job it is to put out the cones & signs (Note, they may / may not be there for the actual work, but often move around on to put out/ take in other closures)
the details that we take from him are;...............
Name, Telephone number, company (very often sub contractors to the HA contractor) and roadworks authorisation number SRW.
The SRW is then checked to see if that work has been authorised for that night and the expected time of finishing, i.e. 5am.
Then we record exactly where the roadworks are going on, using marker-post numbers.
First sign, Start of taper, end of work.
What lanes are being closed?
Are there any slip-roads being closed? (If so, is there access for emergency vehicles?)
Are there any mandatory temp speeds being posted?
And the reason for these roadworks.
WE THEN ASK IF THEY ARE IN POSITION AND READY TO PUT THE CLOSURE ON.
99.9% of the time they will confirm that they are ready for the signals.
We ask the foreman if he requires a call back to confirm the signal settings, or will he be able to see them.
We now set up the roadworks in the system by...............
Changing the HDS (highest displayable speed) that the signals within the roadworks can show, to 10mph less than any mandatory speed limit, or to 50mph if no mandatory limit in force. This means that if there were to be an incident within the roadworks, the HDS setting would be the maximum speed that could be shown)
We disable MIDAS throughout the whole length of the roadworks (if there is MIDAS present) this stops any signals being triggered by any roadworks vehicles parked up inside the closure as work goes on)
We now set the signal for the lane closures, this will also set secondary signals prior to it for speeds.
The generic message will be " WORKFORCE IN ROAD" although that can be changed to "WORKFORCE ON SLIPROAD"
Once the signals are set, and either we've informed the foreman, or he's seen them, his gang will start putting out the hard signage, ie 800,600,400,200 yd countdown markers, then they'll start putting out the cones & lights of the closure.
Once the closure is fully installed, the foreman recalls us to say so, and the matrix is turned off. His gang will probably go elsewhere to put another one on somewhere else.
When the work is completed, the foreman calls us to get the signals reset, he will then remove the closure in reverse direction until all the cones & lights are in, he then has to go all the way around back to the first signage that he put out and start to remove those. Once everything is cleared, he then recalls us and we cancel the signals and put all the HDS & midas settings back to normal.
We are trying to get the foremen to call us once the cones are cleared, and we'll then just set 50's whilst they collect their signage, but it's hard work, not to mention that these sub contractors come & go.
We have in our region two distinctly different contractor area's, one does the Northern part, and the other does the Southern part.
The Foreman calls in with the details of the closure. He works with the gang who's job it is to put out the cones & signs (Note, they may / may not be there for the actual work, but often move around on to put out/ take in other closures)
the details that we take from him are;...............
Name, Telephone number, company (very often sub contractors to the HA contractor) and roadworks authorisation number SRW.
The SRW is then checked to see if that work has been authorised for that night and the expected time of finishing, i.e. 5am.
Then we record exactly where the roadworks are going on, using marker-post numbers.
First sign, Start of taper, end of work.
What lanes are being closed?
Are there any slip-roads being closed? (If so, is there access for emergency vehicles?)
Are there any mandatory temp speeds being posted?
And the reason for these roadworks.
WE THEN ASK IF THEY ARE IN POSITION AND READY TO PUT THE CLOSURE ON.
99.9% of the time they will confirm that they are ready for the signals.
We ask the foreman if he requires a call back to confirm the signal settings, or will he be able to see them.
We now set up the roadworks in the system by...............
Changing the HDS (highest displayable speed) that the signals within the roadworks can show, to 10mph less than any mandatory speed limit, or to 50mph if no mandatory limit in force. This means that if there were to be an incident within the roadworks, the HDS setting would be the maximum speed that could be shown)
We disable MIDAS throughout the whole length of the roadworks (if there is MIDAS present) this stops any signals being triggered by any roadworks vehicles parked up inside the closure as work goes on)
We now set the signal for the lane closures, this will also set secondary signals prior to it for speeds.
The generic message will be " WORKFORCE IN ROAD" although that can be changed to "WORKFORCE ON SLIPROAD"
Once the signals are set, and either we've informed the foreman, or he's seen them, his gang will start putting out the hard signage, ie 800,600,400,200 yd countdown markers, then they'll start putting out the cones & lights of the closure.
Once the closure is fully installed, the foreman recalls us to say so, and the matrix is turned off. His gang will probably go elsewhere to put another one on somewhere else.
When the work is completed, the foreman calls us to get the signals reset, he will then remove the closure in reverse direction until all the cones & lights are in, he then has to go all the way around back to the first signage that he put out and start to remove those. Once everything is cleared, he then recalls us and we cancel the signals and put all the HDS & midas settings back to normal.
We are trying to get the foremen to call us once the cones are cleared, and we'll then just set 50's whilst they collect their signage, but it's hard work, not to mention that these sub contractors come & go.
Edited by Gafferjim on Wednesday 11th September 09:15
Gafferjim said:
I've once seen live images from the weather station camera, but it goes to the Mac, not to us as it's on a different feed or something ( not into the technical stuff) also they weren't PZT either. I know that there is CCTV at some of the junctions in Cumbria, but it's local authority stuff, and we can't get a feed.
If you put the weather stations in, can you nip down and re-site the one J16-J17, M60. It's too near the river and we do get false settings from it.
Note for readers:If you put the weather stations in, can you nip down and re-site the one J16-J17, M60. It's too near the river and we do get false settings from it.
The "Mac" is the Maintaining Agent Contractor, not a fancy computer. They do verge works, drainage, resurfacing, etc.
LondonSW7 said:
Seriously? More than a dozen people a day??
Sorry London, but I saw your question there and had to laugh........................The number of people who simply run out of fuel is staggering, often they'll run out in a live lane and don't have the sense to pull onto the H/S. We get them all. HGV's, coaches, taxis everything as well as cars.
There's one or two however that stick in my memory.
Christmas morning 2 years ago, temp approx -6ºC, our patrol comes across a car on the H/S. driver has run out of fuel, 3 children under 5 yrs old on board in their pyjamas, no coats, no sweaters, obviously no heat in the car because the engine won't run, female driver doesn't have a coat either, and no mobile. She also didn't have any money, and wasn't a member of any recovery service.
We got a 2nd patrol there and took the mother & children home (only lived just off motorway) then took the father (+can) back to the car to sort it out.
Guy runs out of fuel at J20.M6 s/bound, right under the bridge, when I ask him if he knew that he was short of fuel, he said that he was trying to get to the next services at Knutsford, I then pointed out to him that there was a services right above his head (signed for over 1 mile) Just like k-ink, ignores all signs!
Trust me, common sense is not that common.
On that point, winter is coming, so before you set off in the car have you got;....................
Your recovery details. (They're no good at home with the car documents)
Also read the small print, see what you're covered for, and what you're not covered for.
- fully charged* mobile phone. (so many people have no battery life left on their phone)
Warm clothing for all persons in the vehicle. (I have a couple of body warmers & waterproof padded coats in my boot, I learnt a long time ago just how bloody cold it can be stood on a motorway verge waiting for the recovery.)
A fully inflated spare wheel. (If you've previously had a puncture, get it sorted straight away, you never know when the next one will be)
The jack, wheel brace and the adaptor for the locking nuts.(If fitted)
Edited by Gafferjim on Wednesday 11th September 11:08
LondonSW7 said:
CommanderJameson said:
5000 drivers a year run out of fuel on the motorway. Mind-boggling.
Seriously? More than a dozen people a day??Actually, it might even be worse than that.
http://www.whatcar.com/car-news/drivers-running-fu...
That's 3x the number I said.
43 a day!
CommanderJameson said:
Gafferjim said:
I've once seen live images from the weather station camera, but it goes to the Mac, not to us as it's on a different feed or something ( not into the technical stuff) also they weren't PZT either. I know that there is CCTV at some of the junctions in Cumbria, but it's local authority stuff, and we can't get a feed.
If you put the weather stations in, can you nip down and re-site the one J16-J17, M60. It's too near the river and we do get false settings from it.
Note for readers:If you put the weather stations in, can you nip down and re-site the one J16-J17, M60. It's too near the river and we do get false settings from it.
The "Mac" is the Maintaining Agent Contractor, not a fancy computer. They do verge works, drainage, resurfacing, etc.
Its only when you've actually worked on the road networks (HA and Local) that you stop getting pissed off at 'empty' roadworks etc!
Rich
TheTurbonator said:
A while back someone posted a very disturbing video after he travelled down the motorway with the same message. Blinked and you missed it. He was travelling down the outside lane and as you watched, you caught a glimpse of a curled up black figure laying between the tiny bit of road between the central reservation and the line markings for the lane.
It wasn't the same message at all, it was something like "incident", and I'd been passing the signs for miles and miles and miles, on a bright sunny day, on a relatively quiet motorway, I'd given up looking for whatever the "incident" was !Edited by TheTurbonator on Wednesday 4th September 13:19
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdm883T4VjU
Hi all,
We've got an overview scheduled for the control room visit tomorrow evening to see how it all works. The event list is currently full, but there may be a few drop out. If anyone would like adding to the reserve list, please let me know.
Click my name, then "Email me" button and I'll add you to the list.
We've got an overview scheduled for the control room visit tomorrow evening to see how it all works. The event list is currently full, but there may be a few drop out. If anyone would like adding to the reserve list, please let me know.
Click my name, then "Email me" button and I'll add you to the list.
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