RE: Zenos Project E10 - exclusive

RE: Zenos Project E10 - exclusive

Author
Discussion

wemorgan

3,578 posts

177 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
Are there any more photos available of the tub with suspension?

Interesting concept having the aluminium tunnel section, which will give good bending stiffness but offer little in torsion stiffness. On the face of it I prefer the aluminium design of the Lotus Elise, but let's wait and see how this Zenos evolves.

Konrod

866 posts

227 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
stevenkelby said:
...words....

Why, in the last hundred years, has there only been a single car made with 3 seats? And the F1 is considered by many to be the greatest car ever made.

...more words...
I take the point about central seating, but the F1 was not the first three seater. If we ignore some of the 50s sports cars that had a sideways rear seat, the Matra Murena was the first three abreast sports car - taking your point and the target market for this project, probably a better source of inspiration although the poor guy/gal in the centre would have an aluminium spine in their butt cheeks as it sits now smile

Anyway, pedant mode off

anonymous-user

53 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
wemorgan said:
Interesting concept having the aluminium tunnel section, which will give good bending stiffness but offer little in torsion stiffness. On the face of it I prefer the aluminium design of the Lotus Elise, but let's wait and see how this Zenos evolves.
Not to mention also providing a great deal of side impact protection, something that you do really want on a road car. (having had a unwanted transit van come straight into the door of an Elise i was a passenger in, i can tell you that's a useful side effect of the elise tub......)

TWPC

838 posts

160 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
Hellbound said:
nckr55 said:
This. I often wonder what a modern mid/rear engined light, compact 2+2 would be like. It would for one thing have a genuine niche to differentiate from the ultra-impractical track days only crowd.
You've just described the next gen Renault Twingo (and next gen Smart ForFour iirc)
I think this is a great idea, a modern Hillman Imp, and hope that the new Twingo and Smart can deliver. I would guess that such a concept would be too complex for a small company like Zenos.

TWPC

838 posts

160 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all

PlankWithANailIn

439 posts

148 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
Oh no its happened again, it must be my browser, where there is supposed to a picture of a car all I see is some bits of metal hammered to shape inside a wooden box. Still last time all I saw was a computer painting of a car, so some progress....

KM666

1,757 posts

182 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
Hmm I wonder what else can be done with caterham underpinnings... Is the wheelbase far from a Metro wheelbase?

rubystone

11,252 posts

258 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
KM666 said:
Hmm I wonder what else can be done with caterham underpinnings... Is the wheelbase far from a Metro wheelbase?
You were aware that Ansar isn't connected with Caterham and hasn't been for several years???? I would also add that he cut his teeth on the Elise, juggled finances in a very tight period at Caterham Cars and knows what it takes to deliver to both investors and customers. Some might say that I sold my R500 because I knew this was on its way.... ;-)

PhilJames

234 posts

192 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
Tartan Pixie said:
PhilJames said:
Not sure any significant cost will be saved with recycled carbon, it's not the carbon cloth that is expensive it's the tooling and laminating process that's expensive. Using an inferior cloth (non engineering cloth) would require more carbon material and resin to achieve the same strength; therefore increasing weight and cost.
I don't think this is a case of simply using different cloth with the standard process for carbon fibre, it looks like a different process altogether that happens to have carbon in it.

Would be really interesting to hear more about what they are actually doing with those cut up drinking straws to turn them in to a car, because that shot of the cutaway piece looks like something you'd insulate a house with, not build a car from.
Its the skin they are referring to, the honycombe is a standard structure for building F1 monocoques (since Lotus first created the carbon monocoque)and McLaren built their carbon tubs back in the 80s. without the honeycombe in the middle a carbon skin flexes too much. Also works for Aluminium.

dom9

8,040 posts

208 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
E12 has my interest!

jimroyale

97 posts

173 months

Thursday 5th September 2013
quotequote all
It's just a chassis. It might be 10kgs lighter than an Elise chassis, probably worse side intact than a motorbike but, it's just a chassis. Even if my earlier comments are inaccurate, it's just a chassis. To get me to part with thousands of pounds, especially in this climate, it had better have some pretty incredible atributes other than the reitereated pretty good chassis. I'd suggest you either keep quiet about it till its finished or stop risking your mortgage on it.

A good chassis is a given in this company. What is the USP?

AER

1,142 posts

269 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
Max_Torque said:
wemorgan said:
Interesting concept having the aluminium tunnel section, which will give good bending stiffness but offer little in torsion stiffness. On the face of it I prefer the aluminium design of the Lotus Elise, but let's wait and see how this Zenos evolves.
Not to mention also providing a great deal of side impact protection, something that you do really want on a road car. (having had a unwanted transit van come straight into the door of an Elise i was a passenger in, i can tell you that's a useful side effect of the elise tub......)
Ouch!! Did it hurt? Who was the crazy driver?

RoverP6B

4,338 posts

127 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
Konrod said:
I take the point about central seating, but the F1 was not the first three seater. If we ignore some of the 50s sports cars that had a sideways rear seat, the Matra Murena was the first three abreast sports car - taking your point and the target market for this project, probably a better source of inspiration although the poor guy/gal in the centre would have an aluminium spine in their butt cheeks as it sits now smile

Anyway, pedant mode off
What about the Ferrari 365P? That was a 3-abreast, driver in the middle supercar 15 years before the Matra...

Regarding the Zenos - wake me up when it's hit the road, on the market and beating Caterham, Westfield, Radical, Ariel, Ginetta, Lotus et al. Until then, seriously disinterested. Strikes me as a few blokes, many cups of tea, some basic tools, premises and materials, photos of Colin Chapman and some Playboy Playmates (possibly in the same photos, knowing Chapman) on the walls, a hell of a lot of optimism but rather less money. Not exactly much side impact protection, by the look of things. Frankly, I think this market is crowded enough as it is without having a bunch of wannabes trying to muscle in and get their slice of the pie. Give the brands with real heritage a chance to secure their position first.

lespidaman

17 posts

161 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
Renault Sport Spider Floor panels..... plastic honeycomb sheet skinned with fibre glass or carbon resin




Oddball RS

1,757 posts

217 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
AER said:
Max_Torque said:
wemorgan said:
Interesting concept having the aluminium tunnel section, which will give good bending stiffness but offer little in torsion stiffness. On the face of it I prefer the aluminium design of the Lotus Elise, but let's wait and see how this Zenos evolves.
Not to mention also providing a great deal of side impact protection, something that you do really want on a road car. (having had a unwanted transit van come straight into the door of an Elise i was a passenger in, i can tell you that's a useful side effect of the elise tub......)
Ouch!! Did it hurt? Who was the crazy driver?
I'm glad your ok but I wouldn't have thought the tub saved you, given its height most vehicles never mind a van will ride over it or hit you with all the messy stuff in front of the front wheel. Either way not great.

Craikeybaby

10,369 posts

224 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
I like simple lightweight cars, so this sounds interesting to me!

From the other article it seems like they have done the coatings etc first so sounds feasible.

I have wondered before if it was possible to build a car from off the shelf parts, it sounds like other than the chassis, this is what they are doing.

garycat

4,382 posts

209 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
It is just a pity you would never quite reach your destination.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Dich...

aarondbs

843 posts

145 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
garycat said:
It is just a pity you would never quite reach your destination.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Dich...
well that was a complete waste of half an hour eating at my desk,

parsot

13 posts

135 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
It's great to see a project which is truly engineering led, get the packaging right and then design a body around it - last time a heard that was the McLaren F1.

There is a fantastic opportunity for a pure, simple, low cost sports car with a focus on driving fun over performance. So many have started in that space but then got more and more expensive. Of course there is always space for more performance but I really hope that they can keep a base model that is accessible to many.

Very excited to watch developments closely and more than happy to be a early adopter if the price is right smile

Zenos

14 posts

126 months

Friday 6th September 2013
quotequote all
Hi Parsot,

You have described the ambitions of Zenos Cars very precisely. Now all we have to do is deliver.....easy eh! We know the market we hope to appeal to.......it will be for the market to tell us if we've got it right (or wrong)!

We also appreciate all the comments on this thread. It makes for interesting reading and gives us a better understanding of your perceptions.....