ST220,328i, 330i, 330d or T5?

[a_bread]

Rumple said:

Id go for the ST, the E46 Is ok, the boot floor wouldn't concern me, but rust would, these cars rust like its 1979, I would buy on condition not millage as well, they can do the miles, the ST was a pretty special car and a different animal to the ST diesel.

I had no rust on my e46 and never saw it on any e46s so I don't know where you get that from...but I do agree with you that the st220 is pretty special. It's what I have now. They are enhanced relative to the normal mondeos almost as much as an m3 is enhanced over a regular 3 series. Amazing handling for a front drive, and great engine which I find more sporty, responsive, revvy and characterful than the 330's (e46), and than equivalent engines from Audi or merc at that time.

http://fastestlaps.com/comparisons/bmw_330i-vs-for...

Note the advantage between 100 to 200kmh: could be useful on autoroutes...

[stevesuk]

a_bread said:

I had no rust on my e46 and never saw it on any e46s so I don't know where you get that from...

When did you have one? I've had two now. One was showing signs of bubbling on one of the rear arches before I traded it (at the time, it was about 7 years old).

On my current one, the driver's side front wing is a scabby mess around the wheel arch. Frightening how quick it developed from a small, almost invisible patch of paint bubbling, to a scabby mess too. On the plus side, its OK elsewhere, and the front wings are fairly cheap and just bolt on. I'm waiting for mine to actually develop a hole, then I'll bite the bullet and get it replaced.

But, as you say, you see plenty without any visible signs of rust (I tend to have a look if I see one parked up now!). So there may be a certain amount of luck involved.

[Rollcage]

Certainly many earlier E46s can and often do rust on the front arches. My old S reg 328i SE auto was no exception in that respect, but easily sortable.

I'd probably have the Mondeo to be honest, though the Jag is a decent shout. Or either of the BMWs. Or a Saab.......

[a_bread]

For a few years between about 07 and 10. It was nearly 8 years old when I sold.

[Patrick Bateman]

a_bread said:

I had no rust on my e46 and never saw it on any e46s so I don't know where you get that from

I can't remember the last time I saw one that didn't have rust.

Believe me, from experience, they rust.

[a_bread]

Patrick Bateman said:

I can't remember the last time I saw one that didn't have rust.

Believe me, from experience, they rust.

I can't remember the last time I saw one that did have rust.

Believe me, from experience, they don't rust.

Different experience, different conclusion. The internet is strewn with "facts" that are really anecdotes and thoroughly inconclusive.

[a_bread]

But this is probably distracting from the main purpose of the original poster's question. Apologies

[Patrick Bateman]

a_bread said:

I can't remember the last time I saw one that did have rust.

Believe me, from experience, they don't rust.

Different experience, different conclusion. The internet is strewn with "facts" that are really anecdotes and thoroughly inconclusive.

It's not inconclusive at all.

Mine had rust in ever arch, both sills and between the bumper and bootlid. 2 others at my work also have rusty sills and front wings.

It's most definitely something to thoroughly check.

[Matt UK]

If you are looking at the BMW e46 range, may I suggest the e39 5 series. Your budget will get you a nice 530i as the older 5ers tend to now be worth less than the 3er due to a smaller market.

Although the 5 will be slightly more barge like, having owned both e46 and e39, the 5 build quality is just in a different league.

In terms of 'comfy cruiser with a bit of poke', the e39 pretty much wrote the book. Just food for thought.

[Rollcage]

a_bread said:

Patrick Bateman said:

I can't remember the last time I saw one that didn't have rust.

Believe me, from experience, they rust.

I can't remember the last time I saw one that did have rust.

Believe me, from experience, they don't rust.

Different experience, different conclusion. The internet is strewn with "facts" that are really anecdotes and thoroughly inconclusive.

Believe me, they do. Yours might not have, maybe the ones you have seen haven't, but you are in a minority of about one if you think the E46 doesn't rust at all.

Trust me, I've seen hundreds of these go through the ring at various ages, and a good proportion of them have rust issues, some major, some minor, and yes - some not at all.

[cslwannabe]

My silver 2001 330Ci rusted badly - main reason I got rid...

[Japveesix]

Sorry OP this thread is now solely about e46 rust issues.

Admins, please move to BMW section, thanks.

[SlowV6]

As a cruiser is required, how about a last of the line LS400 and keep at least half your budget in your pocket?

Too juicy?

[Sparkzz]

I paid £1700 for a 150k 330i sport.
Aside from a few small issues - new alternator and rocker cover gasket (cost me less than£100 inc labour)

its been fine, its got some rust that I need to sort out, they do rust but for £3k you should be able to find a good one.

[nottyash]

a_bread said:

I had no rust on my e46 and never saw it on any e46s so I don't know where you get that from...but I do agree with you that the st220 is pretty special. It's what I have now. They are enhanced relative to the normal mondeos almost as much as an m3 is enhanced over a regular 3 series. Amazing handling for a front drive, and great engine which I find more sporty, responsive, revvy and characterful than the 330's (e46), and than equivalent engines from Audi or merc at that time.

http://fastestlaps.com/comparisons/bmw_330i-vs-for...

Note the advantage between 100 to 200kmh: could be useful on autoroutes...

Not sure I agree.
The M3 is built on a different production line to a regular 3 series, and is one hell of a car.
It has clearly been well developed, ad most parts are m3 only.

The Mondeo ST 220 even has the same terrible brakes as a 1.8 Mondeo, so clearly its not been developed.
One thing to factor in is some St Focus Callipers, discs and pads to make the car drivable.
I was actually amazed Ford produces a car with such poor brakes.
It's well documentedon all ST sites.

[VinceFox]

Seriously, go and look at e36 m3s OP, 4 grand and some haggling will get you a very rewarding, special car. FWIW theyre significantly quicker than the 330.

[DJP]

Out of that lot, I'd have the Volvo all day long.

Proven, characterful, tough as old boots engine and no issues with rust or chassis cracking etc.

Certainly the best built car of the lot.

[Podie]

nottyash said:

The Mondeo ST 220 even has the same terrible brakes as a 1.8 Mondeo, so clearly its not been developed.
One thing to factor in is some St Focus Callipers, discs and pads to make the car drivable.
I was actually amazed Ford produces a car with such poor brakes.
It's well documentedon all ST sites.

It's funny, I read this all the time. Having driven many, many Mondeos over the years I never had an issue with the brakes on any of them - if they were properly maintained.

Interestingly...

Ford press release said:

ST220 features 300 mm ventilated disc brakes at the front, each with single pot callipers equipped with large, 57 mm pistons to exert powerful pressure on the brake pads. At the rear, solid discs measuring 280 mm are fitted.

The brake system delivers 62 mph to zero braking distances of 37 metres

I certainly never found an issue, although I will agree there is a big inmprovement to be had with the Focus ST (225) calipers. Sadly the days of picking them up for £50 a pair are long gone.

[Blue Oval84]

Podie said:

It's funny, I read this all the time. Having driven many, many Mondeos over the years I never had an issue with the brakes on any of them - if they were properly maintained.

Interestingly...

I drive a bog standard Mondeo 2.0 and whilst I wouldn't necessarily say they have immediate bite (it's not exactly a sports car), if I decide I really want to stop they will happily put any passenger who isn't belted up straight through the windscreen. It's a car that stops very, very well IMO.

[Pvapour]

DJP said:

Out of that lot, I'd have the Volvo all day long.

Proven, characterful, tough as old boots engine and no issues with rust or chassis cracking etc.

Certainly the best built car of the lot.

+1

pre 2005 V70 sees no DPF on D5 (all manufacturers have dpf issues) simple £300 rica chip will see 220 bhp, sorted, get an SE in manual to avoid gaytronic issues, 220 bhp, 50 mpg, reasonable to maintain great forum for DIY, ridiculously comfortable and excellent stereo

we've just gone post 2005 D5 (no town driving for us) & I'm so impressed with it after our Range Rover (L322), 185k miles with FSH, £2500, I'd wager a low miler 2004 could be had for the same.