Ferrari 355 Accident "Cold Tyres"

[Doddington]

Thought I should share this little incident with the world...

So a few months back I was in a well known high end sports car dealership in Surrey and got talking the hilariously 'toffy' sales guy about 355's and 348's... After some coffee and lots of 'toffy' talk he asked if I wanted to test drive a blue Lhd 355 that he had just recieved in... He explained that he was selling it of behalf of the widow of the previous owner. He had died in another one of his Ferrari whilst racing a few weeks previously.

So we went down and jumped into this gorgeous 355. He appologiesed that it hadnt been prepped yet, this was clearly evident from the various items still in the cabin. Sunglasses, smokes etc. Slighty eery considering the fate of the last owner...

Anyway, he said ill just warm her up and then you can drive. Cool... So off we went after prob a minute of letting the engine warm up... Straight out the car park and he abosulty floored it, pedal to the metal, up throuh the gears at rate of knots into about 3rd or 4th... This was down a long straight on a fairly busy industrial estate at 10am on a Saturday, overtaking about 4 cars, a bus and a scrap metal truck... Ducking in and out to avoid oncoming traffic... So at this point I was thinking jesus this things quick and this guys either a race driver or a complete nutter!

So after this failry long staright there was a 90 degree long sweeping left hand bend.. He changed down but was still doing some serious speed, prob 70mph.. Bearing in mind it was a 30mph speed limit. I was thinking bloody hell hes going a bit fast... I must just add that at this exact point he was saying, "She handles like a dream". Then just after entering the bend the back majorly went out. He shouted 'Ohh fk!' In a posh accent I shouted ''Bloody Hell!" Then I dont know how but he managed to counteract it and get the back out the opposite way!?! Then he swung it back to the right, sideways again!?! So now we were heading sideways towards a deep hedgrow lined with large trees and dense undergrowth. Oh and a pretty solid looking metal lamppost was heading my way... Being Lhd I was going to bear the brunt of any Impact...

Doing about 50mph now, the rear right hand wheel mounted the kerb down followed by the rest of the car. All I could see was folliage of various sizes heading my way fairly fast. We proceeded to carry on through the hedge sideways for about 30 meters, finally coming to a stop due to a large tree slamming into my door.

After I realised I wasn't dead... I thought st we better get out of this thing is case it blows up! He just froze and kept saying' "fk fk fk are you alright!?". I said "Just get the fk out now in case it blows up!". I coudnt get out my side due to a tree being impaled in the door... So had to climb over his side then crawl out of the hedge!

Once we were both out we stood on the otherside of the road and I couldnt help laughing. He on the other hand was still saying "fk fk fk" repetedly and proceeded to chain smoke Marlborough Red. "Cold tyres" I said... "Cold tyres... Cold Tyres... Yes cold Tyres. fk" he said.

Then the scrap metal truck with 2 s on board that he had brazenly over taken just moments ago pulled up. They looked at us then looked for the car and saw its nose poking out of the undergrowth. They were pissing themselves laughing but did ask if we were both ok. Which we were, fortuntaly.

The car on the other hand wasnt... After about 10 mins of "fk fk fk, Cold tyres" and about 20 Marlbourgh Red he decided he better call his boss. He suggested I walk back to the garage and go gome for a stiff drink. Which I did...

On the 5 min walk back to the garage I bumped into his boss on his way down to check the damage... He asked if I was ok and he was kind of laughing about it. Dont think he realised how bad it was. I picked up my car and drove back past the accident and saw the sale guys breaking down in the arms of his boss.

I got home poured myslef a stiff drink as instructed. Half an hour later the phone rang and it was the sales guy checking I was alright. Proberly making sure I wasnt planning on sueing. He said his job was safe and the car wasnt that bad. I knew the car was bad and wondered how they were going to explain it to the widow they were supposed to be selling it on behalf of. As I understand it they just selling it for her so didnt actually own it.

A couple of weeks passed and I was passing the said garge and decided to pop in. Turns out the car was a complete right off.. All £41k of it.. Such a shame...

[Prof Prolapse]

I'll refrain from sounding like a keyboard warrior, but I'm impressed with your restraint.

If he's not been already I believe you should insure the gentleman in question is fired. If they won't budge threaten to sue.

He's willingly endangered your life, and the lives of others, you have a moral obligation to ensure he is removed from a position where he can do so.

[carreauchompeur]

What an absolute dick, and a waste of a lovely car.

I can't stand people taking liberties like this. A home dealer bruv type turned up to view my RX8 once and absolutely nailed it, in first then in reverse, down my underground garage and told me to relax as he was a good driver when I complained. He and his bruvs later got told to 'fk off'....

[soad]

Must have thought he's a racing driver. Silly sod ran out of talent.

[Doddington]

soad said:

Must have thought he's a racing driver. Silly sod ran out of talent.

Haha thats exactly what the kid valeting at the dealership said!

[Doddington]

Prof Prolapse said:

I'll refrain from sounding like a keyboard warrior, but I'm impressed with your restraint.

If he's not been already I believe you should insure the gentleman in question is fired. If they won't budge threaten to sue.

He's willingly endangered your life, and the lives of others, you have a moral obligation to ensure he is removed from a position where he can do so.

The thought did cross my mind at the time... One of the main reasons I didn't is that the dealership in question is quite well known and the owners are dam nice chaps and are seen regularly at various petrol head events which I also attend.
It happened back in July so I think its to late to take legal action now? I also have no evidence it actually occurred. No witnesses etc. I annoyingly didn't have my phone on me when it happened either so couldn't take a picture of the sad state the car was in?!

[StottyZr]

I can never understand why anybody would attempt to push a car to it cornering limits from the get go.

It takes me at least a few minutes of teasing the car towards the limit before I can judge entrance speeds properly. If you can't feel the limits of the car you're essentially guessing, and that can't be good.



Disclaimer: Driving gods may be able to judge entrance speeds from the get go

[MissChief]

Certainly in my experience road tyres can only get warm with huge amounts of slip and wheelspin. The amount of grip they give however hardly changes in my experience.

[Prof Prolapse]

Doddington said:

The thought did cross my mind at the time... One of the main reasons I didn't is that the dealership in question is quite well known and the owners are dam nice chaps and are seen regularly at various petrol head events which I also attend.
It happened back in July so I think its to late to take legal action now? I also have no evidence it actually occurred. No witnesses etc. I annoyingly didn't have my phone on me when it happened either so couldn't take a picture of the sad state the car was in?!

No evidence? The car was written off. It's strange in the least he wasn't done for dangerous driving.

I'm not a lawyer but, you are a witness.... You have no vested interest, why would you lie?

As for the delay, well, I'm sure a lot of people are curious why you took so long, myself included. Better late than never. Why not simply ring the garage and ask what became of the gentleman in question? Tell them your conscience concerns you and ask what they did about it.

If they did nothing then they're not the "nice chaps", you have them down for. The guy could have killed you and others.

[slipstream 1985]

MissChief said:

Certainly in my experience road tyres can only get warm with huge amounts of slip and wheelspin. The amount of grip they give however hardly changes in my experience.

really? not in my experience.

[Prof Prolapse]

MissChief said:

Certainly in my experience road tyres can only get warm with huge amounts of slip and wheelspin. The amount of grip they give however hardly changes in my experience.

Depends on the tyres. Higher the performance and demand the more you'll notice it.

I've been lucky enough to drive a few supercars, the tyres make a difference. The best example is on motorcycles, there's a huge difference.

[Doddington]

Prof Prolapse said:

No evidence? The car was written off. It's strange in the least he wasn't done for dangerous driving.

I'm not a lawyer but, you are a witness.... You have no vested interest, why would you lie?

As for the delay, well, I'm sure a lot of people are curious why you took so long, myself included. Better late than never. Why not simply ring the garage and ask what became of the gentleman in question? Tell them your conscience concerns you and ask what they did about it.

If they did nothing then they're not the "nice chaps", you have them down for. The guy could have killed you and others.

The police were not involved at all... The dealership promptly sent out a recovery truck out and hastily whisked the old girl back to there dealership to be hidden out the back under a cover. I did pop back in a few weeks later to see what the damage to the car was and if sales guy was still there... He was and his boss says he didnt sack him because he owes him £40k as the car was a complete right off!

[MissChief]

Prof Prolapse said:

MissChief said:

Certainly in my experience road tyres can only get warm with huge amounts of slip and wheelspin. The amount of grip they give however hardly changes in my experience.

Depends on the tyres. Higher the performance and demand the more you'll notice it.

I've been lucky enough to drive a few supercars, the tyres make a difference. The best example is on motorcycles, there's a huge difference.

I can believe a Motorcycle where the softer the tyre the more 'squidge' and the larger/stickier the contact patch but on a road car, unless the tyre is a Semi slick, just road legal effort I can't say I've ever felt warm tyres give better grip. Most tyres are just too hard to noticably change grip levels with heat. You just can't get enough load into the tyre to warm it up sufficiently unless your car has steel poles for springs.

[carinaman]

So is weaving a hyper bike on the road in an attempt to get heat into the tyres effective or acceptable?

[Prof Prolapse]

Doddington said:

The police were not involved at all... The dealership promptly sent out a recovery truck out and hastily whisked the old girl back to there dealership to be hidden out the back under a cover. I did pop back in a few weeks later to see what the damage to the car was and if sales guy was still there... He was and his boss says he didnt sack him because he owes him £40k as the car was a complete right off!

Of course they did. To prevent a dangerous driving charge and their reputation being dragged through the mud.

Owes them 40K, so not insured then? So if you had been crippled by his incompetence no compensation for you or your widow. Or maybe he was just lying to you?

Yeah they sound like great upstanding guys.

[Prof Prolapse]

carinaman said:

So is weaving a hyper bike on the road in an attempt to get heat into the tyres effective or acceptable?

I don't know what a hyperbike is, but if you're trying to refer to this as a requirement unique to very high performance motorcycles you're mistaken. It's as much an issue on CB500s as it is HP4s.

I'm not sure how effective weaving is on a bike, I've never done it even on the track. On the roads you just let your tyres warm up gradually.

[greygoose]

Prof Prolapse said:

Of course they did. To prevent a dangerous driving charge and their reputation being dragged through the mud.

Owes them 40K, so not insured then? So if you had been crippled by his incompetence no compensation for you or your widow. Or maybe he was just lying to you?

Yeah they sound like great upstanding guys.

It sounds like a cowboy outfit in every part of the story.

[Prof Prolapse]

MissChief said:

I can believe a Motorcycle where the softer the tyre the more 'squidge' and the larger/stickier the contact patch but on a road car, unless the tyre is a Semi slick, just road legal effort I can't say I've ever felt warm tyres give better grip. Most tyres are just too hard to noticably change grip levels with heat. You just can't get enough load into the tyre to warm it up sufficiently unless your car has steel poles for springs.

I don't understand why you think the physics of friction and heat doesn't apply to car tyres.

We'll just have to agree to disagree. I don't think it's a point that needs to be argued.

[Doddington]

Prof Prolapse said:

Of course they did. To prevent a dangerous driving charge and their reputation being dragged through the mud.

Owes them 40K, so not insured then? So if you had been crippled by his incompetence no compensation for you or your widow. Or maybe he was just lying to you?

Yeah they sound like great upstanding guys.

If I had suffered injury I would obviously pursue compensation. I think to get an insurance payout they would have had to report it to police? And possibly pay a huge excess. I don't know... They defiantly have insurance as they are a very well known high end dealership. And the owners are really nice chaps however it may sound. Apparently the sales guy had been with them for many years. Im very much of the opinion we all make mistakes and learn from it. I for one certainly have over the years. Im sure the sales guy has. He didnt seem so cocky next time i went in.

[Doddington]

greygoose said:

It sounds like a cowboy outfit in every part of the story.

I know it does sound like that but they are not... In fact a well known dealership that specialise in servicing, restoration and race preparation of Italian marques namely Ferrari, Lamborghini and Maserati.

Edited by Doddington on Thursday 10th October 22:58