Bloodhound LSR Thread As Requested...

[14]

Jenson Button would be a good driver, and could bring in a significant amount of sponsorship money.

[CallMeLegend]

14 said:

Jenson Button would be a good driver, and could bring in a significant amount of sponsorship money.

I suspect he's very happy is it is and has no appetite for it.

[loudlashadjuster]

Harry Metcalfe’s video this week is on Bloodhound. Haven’t watched it yet, wonder if it’s a promotion thing?

Edited by loudlashadjuster on Sunday 19th November 19:37

[slartibartfast]

loudlashadjuster said:

Harry Metcalfe’s video this week is on Bloodhound. Heavenly watched it yet, wonder if it’s a promotion thing?

yes but quite interesting.
he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

[eliot]

At least they finally got it in front of some eyes rather than dragging round London or an empty silverstone,

[CraigyMc]

slartibartfast said:

he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

Fairly straightforward to do it with an electric motor.

[Gareth79]

CraigyMc said:

slartibartfast said:

he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

Fairly straightforward to do it with an electric motor.

I remember that was discussed way back, possibly I heard it at an event, but the issue was always keeping the total weight down. Modern battery density and motors might be up to it now though?

[Krikkit]

Gareth79 said:

CraigyMc said:

slartibartfast said:

he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

Fairly straightforward to do it with an electric motor.

I remember that was discussed way back, possibly I heard it at an event, but the issue was always keeping the total weight down. Modern battery density and motors might be up to it now though?

I thought it was pretty much just cost that kept them from finishing that? They were saying originally how awkward the engine was for packaging, and how the airflow management was a compromise, where a battery pack can be water cooled and distributed where needed.

[loudlashadjuster]

I recall they’d already swapped the Jag V8 for another, more modest engine before the planned switch to electric?

Jaguar were an initial sponsor, but that didn’t last until the SA shakedown so I think it had been replaced by then.

[PGN]

I'm sure they originally planned to use an F1 engine. That got changed to a Jaguar V8 (maybe the F1 thing was just to generate publicity) and now it's an electric pump.

[Olivergt]

What does/did the jet use to supply fuel to the engine? Surely the requirements are the same, why not use the same?

[ChocolateFrog]

loudlashadjuster said:

I recall they’d already swapped the Jag V8 for another, more modest engine before the planned switch to electric?

Jaguar were an initial sponsor, but that didn’t last until the SA shakedown so I think it had been replaced by then.

Other way round IIRC.

The Jag engine replaced something else, possibly a Cosworth F1 engine.

[robinessex]

Where is IN51GHT when you need him?

[lufbramatt]

robinessex said:

Where is IN51GHT when you need him?

Think he changed his username to "I am Legend" or something similar

ETA- "callmelegend"

Edited by lufbramatt on Monday 20th November 12:16

[robinessex]

lufbramatt said:

robinessex said:

Where is IN51GHT when you need him?

Think he changed his username to "I am Legend" or something similar

Oops, just found that out!!

[CallMeLegend]

CraigyMc said:

slartibartfast said:

he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

Fairly straightforward to do it with an electric motor.

I argued this years ago in exec engineering meetings, along with the head of structures. The pair of us had talked about it for a couple of months prior to suggesting it. The powers that be said it was non starter, despite the fact we'd done some preliminary calcs, they simply said "it won't work". Obviously it would work, especially now given the increase in cell energy density.

Edited by CallMeLegend on Monday 20th November 15:08

[CallMeLegend]

ChocolateFrog said:

loudlashadjuster said:

I recall they’d already swapped the Jag V8 for another, more modest engine before the planned switch to electric?

Jaguar were an initial sponsor, but that didn’t last until the SA shakedown so I think it had been replaced by then.

Other way round IIRC.

The Jag engine replaced something else, possibly a Cosworth F1 engine.

The CA2010 Cosworth lump was replaced by the AJ133 V8 Jag engine, neither of which were particularly well suited to the task, but when you are being offered them for free, you take what you can get.

Fundamentally any ICE unit is unsuitable, you have to get supersonic air in, slow it to manageable speeds, which heats it up, so you also have to cool it before the ICE gets to use it. Then you have the issues of dealing with exhaust gasses, so you are looking for the lowest pressure area in the under floor so perforate to have a suitable exhaust exit. Problem is these low pressure areas can move through the speed range.

Edited by CallMeLegend on Monday 20th November 15:27

[CraigyMc]

CallMeLegend said:

CraigyMc said:

slartibartfast said:

he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

Fairly straightforward to do it with an electric motor.

I argued this years ago in exec engineering meetings, along with the head of structures. The pair of us had talked about it for a couple of months prior to suggesting it. The powers that be said it was non starter, despite the fact we'd done some preliminary calcs, they simply said "it won't work". Obviously it would work, especially now given the increase in cell energy density.

Edited by CallMeLegend on Monday 20th November 15:08

Didn't you move on to the RR electric plane?

Seems a transferrable skill

[CallMeLegend]

CraigyMc said:

CallMeLegend said:

CraigyMc said:

slartibartfast said:

he seemed to skip what they are going to use instead of the Jag V8 to pump rocket fuel.
£12m and it runs.

Fairly straightforward to do it with an electric motor.

I argued this years ago in exec engineering meetings, along with the head of structures. The pair of us had talked about it for a couple of months prior to suggesting it. The powers that be said it was non starter, despite the fact we'd done some preliminary calcs, they simply said "it won't work". Obviously it would work, especially now given the increase in cell energy density.

Edited by CallMeLegend on Monday 20th November 15:08

Didn't you move on to the RR electric plane?

Seems a transferrable skill

Yep, took several speed records, now hanging from the ceiling of the Science Museum, London

[CraigyMc]

Olivergt said:

What does/did the jet use to supply fuel to the engine? Surely the requirements are the same, why not use the same?

Have just seen this post.

The EJ200 has an AMAD (basically a jet-engine powered alternator) but it's sized for the fighter the engine came from; the rocket motor pump power requirement is quite a bit bigger; I recall this being discussed years ago; it's in the hundreds of kW (~400 to 500).

This is historical info but:

• The oxidiser pump needs to dump 800 litres of HTP into the rocket in a total of about 17s.
• HTP's a bit denser than water, that 800 litres equates to about 1000kg.

Anyone who has used a pump will know that to move a tonne of liquid in 17s is a powerful pump.

If you're looking to visualise the output of the pump, it's roughly equivalent to 15 UK-spec firefighting hoses running in parallel, in terms of flow rate.

If you were to dump the HTP out through a tube (unburnt) rather than as the oxidiser for a PBAN rocket, it'd still give you about 400lb of thrust. This is simply because of the reaction mass of the HTP going out the back of the car.

That's why the jet can't power the pump. Too squirty.

Edited by CraigyMc on Monday 20th November 20:14