Discussion
Pints said:
Technomad said:
This is a complete non-starter in the UK:
- where there ARE high-bandwidth mobile networks, they're often congested or simply broken
- most of the country does not have even 3G coverage, however unreliable, let alone 4G
So anyone trying to use internet radio for mobile use will be the same position as BBC radio circa 1924.
Until we get a proper modern mobile data infrastructure with Universal Service Obligations, this is going nowhere.
I use DAB where I can, but 2/3 of my time I can only get marginal FM.
EE, O2 and Three all cover 90+% of the population with 3G. (Only Vodafone fail to meet this criteria.) 4G coverage is increasing almost daily.- where there ARE high-bandwidth mobile networks, they're often congested or simply broken
- most of the country does not have even 3G coverage, however unreliable, let alone 4G
So anyone trying to use internet radio for mobile use will be the same position as BBC radio circa 1924.
Until we get a proper modern mobile data infrastructure with Universal Service Obligations, this is going nowhere.
I use DAB where I can, but 2/3 of my time I can only get marginal FM.
I already listen to mobile/internet radio on a daily basis when commuting. I'm not sure what your beef is.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
But DAB has only reached the coverage it has with single-minded promotion and funding from central Govt., whereas mobile networks have been and continue to be driven by the market.I'd also take issue with your assertion. Yes, there are areas where DAB will be available and 3G coverage not, but drive from London to Norwich and DAB will drop out far more often and for far longer than 3G will. 3G/4G signals are more robust and devices on them can buffer around this, especially for non-live streaming, DAB less so.
The difference is that there is commercial interest in filling in the 3G/4G coverage gaps, albeit with some regulator push in marginal areas, but the only ones pushing DAB are the self-interest lobby groups who really only have a single source of funding - our taxes.
Even if the Govt. bulldozes everything and DAB does achieve universal coverage and acceptance (equal to FM, anyway), we'd still be left with a dead-end 1980s technological solution with millions of antiquated devices ensuring that when (not if) a move to a more flexible technology does occur, it'll end up costing us a lot more with far more migration headaches than we currently have, with the majority of listening still on FM.
There's also the issue that as the only major market still operating vanilla DAB, the UK is becoming out of step with the rest of the EU/world. Manufacturers are having to design and develop audio equipment specifically for the UK market. You think they're going to do that for free? Of course not, so we end up paying more for a product that is worse in every respect to that enjoyed elsewhere, whether it be DAB+, T-DAB, DMB, internet or satellite radio.
CraigyMc said:
Population coverage isn't the same as area coverage. You can cover 100% of the population (because it's specifically to do with where people live) without covering even the main roads.
Fair enough, but I haven't dropped a call while travelling on a main road in quite some time.Here in the USA internet radio seems to be already the thing in most cars, despite the patchy 4G reception. The consumer pull for fast mobile internet has finally caught up with the investment required to put it everywhere, so its pretty much assured. In the UK, If people can make money on it (unlike early 3G where the handsets weren't ready and consumers didn't know what to do with it) they will build the infrastructure.
I used streaming on my phone everywhere, and it pretty much never drops out, used to all the time on previous networks. But now I am on Three, I get internet all the time and its unlimited.
O2 is the worst network for interent I have ever used, they only ever seem to have 2G signal, god knows why they are bothering with 4G when they barely have 3G. T-Mobile has good reception, but low speeds. Three you get around 15mbps in most places on H, and 4G is free too, Three is the way forwards, as is using your phone for all your music!
O2 is the worst network for interent I have ever used, they only ever seem to have 2G signal, god knows why they are bothering with 4G when they barely have 3G. T-Mobile has good reception, but low speeds. Three you get around 15mbps in most places on H, and 4G is free too, Three is the way forwards, as is using your phone for all your music!
Pints said:
EE, O2 and Three all cover 90+% of the population with 3G. (Only Vodafone fail to meet this criteria.) 4G coverage is increasing almost daily.
I already listen to mobile/internet radio on a daily basis when commuting. I'm not sure what your beef is.
The key word as you say is population. Their contractual obligation is worded as population not geographical cover so there is little incentive for the operators to cover the roads between the populated area. businesses.I already listen to mobile/internet radio on a daily basis when commuting. I'm not sure what your beef is.
As other have mentioned, the key issue would be network capacity, bearing in mind the huge network consolidation projects going on between VF/O2 and EE/3 the operators individual coverage footprints and capacity has in real terms shrunk.
Pints said:
Fair enough, but I haven't dropped a call while travelling on a main road in quite some time.
The operators do aim to cover the main roads pretty well, however they aren't covered for high capacity usage as the majority of users will be travelling at speed so are only locked on to that cell for a couple of minutes before being handed over to the next one.TEKNOPUG said:
rtz62 said:
Didn't one of The Beatles have a record player fitted in their car? Now THATS the way forward.....!
Marilyn Monroe in a Caddy.loomx said:
I used streaming on my phone everywhere, and it pretty much never drops out, used to all the time on previous networks. But now I am on Three, I get internet all the time and its unlimited.
O2 is the worst network for interent I have ever used, they only ever seem to have 2G signal, god knows why they are bothering with 4G when they barely have 3G. T-Mobile has good reception, but low speeds. Three you get around 15mbps in most places on H, and 4G is free too, Three is the way forwards, as is using your phone for all your music!
All true if you live in towns or cities, but not if you don't.O2 is the worst network for interent I have ever used, they only ever seem to have 2G signal, god knows why they are bothering with 4G when they barely have 3G. T-Mobile has good reception, but low speeds. Three you get around 15mbps in most places on H, and 4G is free too, Three is the way forwards, as is using your phone for all your music!
I assume that those with internet phones have to pay monthly fees for the service?
I work from home, so have a basic PAYG mobile, which can be used with my BT head unit in the car, for hands free - but that's as far as I'll go with phones.
Those who say they are streaming music/radio stations from their phone, is it really that fantastic if you're paying a monthly bill for the privilege?
I prefer my trusty USB stick for my 'mix tapes' and some 6Music podcasts - living in the sticks makes both DAB and mobile internet connections a silly choice.
I work from home, so have a basic PAYG mobile, which can be used with my BT head unit in the car, for hands free - but that's as far as I'll go with phones.
Those who say they are streaming music/radio stations from their phone, is it really that fantastic if you're paying a monthly bill for the privilege?
I prefer my trusty USB stick for my 'mix tapes' and some 6Music podcasts - living in the sticks makes both DAB and mobile internet connections a silly choice.
varsas said:
<snip>
Sadly a lot of the FM transmitters are already past their intended life, that's what's driving the switch off as much as anything.
You think?Sadly a lot of the FM transmitters are already past their intended life, that's what's driving the switch off as much as anything.
Edited by varsas on Thursday 19th December 13:40
So it's not the prospect of the government selling off the frequency spectrum that's driving it then?
Just in the same way they forced the switch over to digital TV, so they could sell off the analogue TV spectrum too.
The DAB system that was adopted here in the UK is out of date, and has been for years.
DAB reception is patchy and prone to interference, and to cut costs many DAB stations stream at very low bit rates.
From a sound quality *and* reception point of view, DAB in the UK is a failure.
I don't know why manufacturers just don't provide "radio" only receivers than can tune into the radio services on Sky / Freeview.
loomx said:
Three you get around 15mbps in most places on H, and 4G is free too, Three is the way forwards, as is using your phone for all your music!
It can only be free if they've actually got 4G. Which they don't. They're years behind the competition and will be for quite a while yet.I can plug a USB stick into my head unit and with the capacity of USB drives now that makes a lot of albums. I never listen to the radio anyway as there's extremely little stuff broadcast that's of interest to me. Current mainstream music IMO is rubbish. My opinion true, but the only use i see for radio's is news, traffic reports and weather and i try and avoid the news too because that's full of crap also (seldom got anything positive to say).
So if a car can give me the weather report where i'm heading, or tell me of a traffic jam 5 miles down the road i couldn't care how the car tells me as long as it conveys the information for FREE and clearly.
So if a car can give me the weather report where i'm heading, or tell me of a traffic jam 5 miles down the road i couldn't care how the car tells me as long as it conveys the information for FREE and clearly.
NormalWisdom said:
olly22n said:
big_boz said:
For music lovers (not Radio) Spotify streamed via Bluetooth is the future.
This.I love spotify.
We should be using Satellite radio - it's absurd that we are trying to roll out something better, but still relying on ground based transmitters.
DAB car radios are far superior to FM, but in the living room with decent speakers and no background noise, you can easily spot it's small bit rate shortfalls.
DAB car radios are far superior to FM, but in the living room with decent speakers and no background noise, you can easily spot it's small bit rate shortfalls.
NickGibbs said:
wouldn't a great big chunk of that be better spent putting more 3G/4G masts along major roads?
At some point in the future we will have to deal with the significant health consequences of our ever increased exposure to electro magnetic radiation.
RESONANCE ~ Beings Of Frequency Documentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6n-fIHGia8
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