Winter tyres vol 2
Discussion
HustleRussell said:
Actually now that I think about it there's quite a bit less wheel bolt / nut length, taper and tightening torque discussion than I'd have liked too.
Again, correct. My previous comments above apply just as much to this, plus you're forgetting issues like wheel fixings material spec and mechanical strength / heat treatment condition. Car owners get away with it because of over-engineering and massive window for safe clamping force in the design.P
It is often wet, though, so a set of tyres that are good in the rain/damp are a good year-round option for the low-lands in my view.
f1nn said:
But surely you are coping with a compromised tyre for a longer period, say late Feb to early Dec, than the potential benefits offered from mid Dec to Mid Feb.
This seems backwards to me, it really does.
In a temperate country of few extremes in weather, other than cold (sometimes) in the far north and every decade or so in the south and some occasional hottish weather in the south, the compromise is probably not that great either way.This seems backwards to me, it really does.
It is often wet, though, so a set of tyres that are good in the rain/damp are a good year-round option for the low-lands in my view.
f1nn said:
blearyeyedboy said:
I've run winter tyres all year round without crashing and dying of death. No, you shouldn't take liberties while driving on them but a decent winter tyre in summer is less of a liability than a summer tyre in very cold weather.
But surely you are coping with a compromised tyre for a longer period, say late Feb to early Dec, than the potential benefits offered from mid Dec to Mid Feb.This seems backwards to me, it really does.
nickfrog said:
This thread seems to be mainly frequented by well informed people who make choices based on experience. Personally, and like most, I stick to OE wheels, albeit second hand and OE size new winters. And like most, I recognise that the 7deg thing is marketing led. But guess what, in a non-binary world, it doesn't instantly render winters useless, it just means the threshold is more like 2/3 deg C. Which means I might get away with not needing to fit them, but at least I have the option at minimal cost as winter packages put together in summer show no depreciation when sold in November two years later, only in my experience of course, as I am sure yours will be different.
You either have a big issue with people on winters or you are a closet winter tyre lover. Either way, what does it matter to you so much what OTHER people prefer to fit on their wheels? Do your own thing and I am sure people won't mind.
I have no issues with what people choose to do, just as I wouldn't expect people to have issues with my choices.You either have a big issue with people on winters or you are a closet winter tyre lover. Either way, what does it matter to you so much what OTHER people prefer to fit on their wheels? Do your own thing and I am sure people won't mind.
Edited by nickfrog on Sunday 29th November 10:43
I find the winter tyre issue interesting, that's why I take part in the thread. I have as much right to do that as anyone here.
You are correct, we all make experiences based on experience. My experience of the last 20 years tells me that driving style and being sensible negates the need to fit seasonal tyres in most parts of the UK, most of the time for most people, and the fluctuating temperatures around the threshold you suggest we experience make benefits somewhat hard to quantify.
Of course, I fully appreciate that for people living in remote areas, the rules change. however, vehicle and drive type would then become more important IMO.
If I genuinely thought that there was a benefit that didn't unduly compromise performance at other temperatures experienced in the periods that they would need to be fitted, then Perhaps I would consider using winter tyres.
What is a source of amusement, is the people on this thread who fit winter tyres for the benefit in low temperatures, but then proudly boast that they use the same tyres through the summer, where presumably the performance would be inferior to a summer tyre for a much larger proportion of the year.
Targarama said:
Modern winter tyres are very good in warmer weather. Summers are far worse in winter than winters are in summer.
Granted, but to make a decision to change to a winter tyre for a potential performance benefit for 2-3 months to then suffer a potential permformane decrease for 9-10 months seems upside down.bigvanfan said:
I have a trip to Orkney coming up at new year, I have a set of winters coming next week for my octavia , but I've been offered a discovery for the week , so what's the best bet to get me there if the snow and ice arrive?
Where are you getting the ferry from? If it's Aberdeen the main roads will generally be ok, if you're going up to Wick it's likely to be a lot worse.Orkney and Shetland don't tend to get so much snow (well any that lies for any length of time).
Personally I'd take the Octavia, if the roads are so bad that it won't get through with winters you will be stuck behind other cars anyway.
It's also more likely to be able to stop if the roads are slippery as it'll have less weight and grippier tyres.
nickfrog said:
This thread seems to be mainly frequented by well informed people who make choices based on experience. Personally, and like most, I stick to OE wheels, albeit second hand and OE size new winters.
...
You either have a big issue with people on winters or you are a closet winter tyre lover. Either way, what does it matter to you so much what OTHER people prefer to fit on their wheels? Do your own thing and I am sure people won't mind.
You are a proponent of winter tyres for safety reasons. We are both proponents of using the right wheels for the same reason. ...
You either have a big issue with people on winters or you are a closet winter tyre lover. Either way, what does it matter to you so much what OTHER people prefer to fit on their wheels? Do your own thing and I am sure people won't mind.
People who are thinking of buying a second set of wheels should be aware that centre bore, offset, rim width and the fixings used are important and often overlooked.
There is not enough awareness of these things in this thread. Just flagging it up.
People who are dishing out advice and talking only about rim diameter, PCD and whether they'll 'fit over the brakes' should be aware that neglecting these elements could result in disappointment or even a safety issue.
In cold conditions they will provide more grip than summers even on a dry surface. They'll also clear standing water and slush much better, as well as the obvious benefits on snow and ice.
ETA: Just don't ask anyone on here at what temperature winter tyres start to out-perform summer tyres as it's a topic of much debate.
ETA: Just don't ask anyone on here at what temperature winter tyres start to out-perform summer tyres as it's a topic of much debate.
Northernchimp said:
Any tips for a Fiesta ST (205/40r17)? I can just tell it'll be a total 
on the ice.
There doesn't seem to be a mid range option, they're either ditch finders or pricey. I'm not convinced winters will work anyway given the absence of side wall. Has anybody resorted to winter wheels in order to get decent tyres? I don't think 14s would clear the brakes, but are 15" Fiesta/Focus wheels with the same stud pattern likely to cause issues?
I'm pretty sure the spare wheel is a 15 inch so you could check by trying that on if you have that option. on the ice.There doesn't seem to be a mid range option, they're either ditch finders or pricey. I'm not convinced winters will work anyway given the absence of side wall. Has anybody resorted to winter wheels in order to get decent tyres? I don't think 14s would clear the brakes, but are 15" Fiesta/Focus wheels with the same stud pattern likely to cause issues?
I have the same size wheels on my Fiesta (125 Zetec S) I got a full set of wheels and tyres in 15 inch from Tyreleader for £360 and that was with Conti 850's, could have saved about £100 going for cheaper tyres. Very pleased with them, they are actually Ford wheels not some aftermarket make. I went for 195/55's to make sure the rolling resistance was correct. Your brakes will be bigger but a quick google shows that a lot of American owners use 15's in the winter on their ST and I would assume they have the same brakes as the UK version. I'd still test the spare to be sure.
Other benefits come from having a second set of wheels. You can downsize your winter set which will enable you to use a higher profile tyre which'll better protect your wheels and suspension from winter damaged potholed roads. They'll also be more comfortable and often quieter than summers which is a nice trade when you can't enjoy the feel and directness of lower profile summers for fear of coming off the road or damaging your wheels in a pothole.
HustleRussell said:
In cold conditions they will provide more grip than summers even on a dry surface. They'll also clear standing water and slush much better, as well as the obvious benefits on snow and ice.
ETA: Just don't ask anyone on here at what temperature winter tyres start to out-perform summer tyres as it's a topic of much debate.
If it wasn't for the snow/slush I wouldn't bother with them tbh.ETA: Just don't ask anyone on here at what temperature winter tyres start to out-perform summer tyres as it's a topic of much debate.
Slow said:
HustleRussell said:
I don't bother with them despite the snow / slush.
Dont drive a rwd car in the highlands then.That said I had a Sierra years ago and it went absolutely anywhere in the snow. I remember turning up for work one day when a lot of people didn't make it because of the snow, even my manager was surprised when I ploughed into the lane and commended me for making it
Slow said:
HustleRussell said:
I don't bother with them despite the snow / slush.
Dont drive a rwd car in the highlands then.Tyres are only 225s so it's worlds apart from the horrific performance of newer cars on obscenely wide obscenely low profile summers.
HustleRussell said:
So far my 525i has gotten me everywhere I needed to go for the last couple of winters on summer tyres. No, this does not include the highlands. I live in Surrey.
Tyres are only 225s so it's worlds apart from the horrific performance of newer cars on obscenely wide obscenely low profile summers.
How 'obscenely wide' are tyres on newer hot hatches?Tyres are only 225s so it's worlds apart from the horrific performance of newer cars on obscenely wide obscenely low profile summers.
HustleRussell said:
Slow said:
HustleRussell said:
I don't bother with them despite the snow / slush.
Dont drive a rwd car in the highlands then.Tyres are only 225s so it's worlds apart from the horrific performance of newer cars on obscenely wide obscenely low profile summers.
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