BMW, Mercedes or Audi?

[RobM77]

I couldn't give a toss about badge, I don't aspire to things, and I'm sat here in a t-shirt that cost me £6. With that out of the way, I can say that I've driven a number of Mercs and Audis, I had an A4 for three months last year and I chose a BMW to own, in fact I'm on my fifth over a 13 year period. I'd have to put Audi at the bottom of the pile, mainly due to their handling, but the A4 I ran for three months was also very noisy at speed, had some inexcusable ergonomic woes, and didn't do much to the gallon either. The Audi did have a nice looking and feeling interior though, but I primarily buy a car for how it drives, so they're out straight away. Mercedes build jolly good cars, and for me each time I change my daily driver I always look at a Merc; the trouble is it's hard to find them secondhand with manual gearboxes, which is a shame. BMW have always been on top for me because I focus a lot on how a car drives, and they drive beautifully. Sadly, since all the electronics came in circa year 2000 many BMWs have been very jerky and hard to drive smooth, and suffer from throttle lag, so I'm now down to liking a small percentage of their output, but that small percentage are truly fantastic. On balance (no pun intended) I still chose a BMW as my last car and currently it's looking likely my next car will be one too. The only downside to BMW ownership is road rage - I reckon every other time I drive my 3 series I get flashed, beeped and/or sworn at, which has never happened to me in an Audi or Merc; in fact that extends to pretty much any car, no matter how politely or rudely I drive them (and if it's a hire car, I'm often inviting road rage, but I never get it in any other make of car). It's also never happened to me in mainland Europe, only the UK. It's a major problem (I've been threatened with violence twice now, and I worry when my wife drives the car), but I'm still just about holding BMW as my favourite maker of daily drivers (and by that I mean roof bars, big boot, tow bar etc). If I didn't need a four seater with roof bars etc though I wouldn't be in any of the three.

[Convert]

Urban Sports said:

Nothing better than seeing that badge sitting on your drive.

Perhaps they need to use a premium adhesive then...

[Tickle]

Convert said:

Urban Sports said:

Nothing better than seeing that badge sitting on your drive.

Perhaps they need to use a premium adhesive then...

[powerstroke]

I would have something from any of these Marques
Pre 2000 when they were a little bit better made and more involving ,but if it had to be current range would go merc BMW with Audi last
As they are truly dull and uninspiring now ...

Edited by powerstroke on Sunday 5th January 12:18

[g3org3y]

RobM77 said:

I couldn't give a toss about badge, I don't aspire to things, and I'm sat here in a t-shirt that cost me £6.

I'd buy some pants also otherwise you might need to buy a new chair.

[sparks_E39]

A late facelift D2 A8 with the 4.2 engine would be my pick from the early 2000's era.

[AB]

fatboy b said:

AB said:

BMW are in a different class in terms of driving dynamics.

You think otherwise?

A4 vs 3 series vs C class

A6 vs 5 series vs E class

Etc etc.

Driven them all. The BMW is a class ahead.

[RobM77]

AB said:

fatboy b said:

AB said:

BMW are in a different class in terms of driving dynamics.

You think otherwise?

A4 vs 3 series vs C class

A6 vs 5 series vs E class

Etc etc.

Driven them all. The BMW is a class ahead.

I'd put Merc a lot closer to BMW than Audi, but yes, BMW handling is extremely good; if you can find a model that drives fluidly (increasingly unlikely, but possible), then they're in a totally different league to Audi for sure. Image will blind a lot of people though, which is a shame as they really are better than many so called sports/GT cars.

[scherzkeks]

fatboy b said:

Agreed. A trite statement. Audis handle very well, but they require a different driving style than RWD vehicles, as do all AWD chassis that are not heavily rear biased. I prefer the stability and grip that AWD provides, vs. the more nervous on-limit handling of RWD; it is less fatigue inducing to drive an AWD car 9/10ths on a track, and almost always faster and more sure footed.

[Willy Nilly]

I can't imagine going back to a German car. Honda have been spoiling me for the last 12 years.

[BigBen]

The Mrs has had an Audi A3, W203 C class, and Audi A5 and a Jag XF as her last 3 company cars. The thinking behind each was:

- The Audi was the best choice in a list of dross. No problems with it, reasonably nice place to be.

- At the time of getting the C-class they had loads more kit than the equivalent 3-series which was important for a high mileage user, also felt a bit bigger and more premium that the 3'er. Audis were even more miserly equipped than the BM.

- The A5 was the obvious choice at the time, the 2.0 TFSI engine got very good mpg for a petrol and the interior equipment levels were not too bad. However the car was not exciting to drive and she / we never really bonded with it. No specific problems just didn't like it. The later C-class was also considered but the interior felt much cheaper than its predecessor (somewhat address with the later facelift cars). The Jag XF was just over budget at this point.

- The Jag was a choice this time and comes with plenty kit, a great interior and is made in the UK nothing not to like. The E-class, C-class (now facelifted so much nicer interior) and 5 series were all considered. The 5-series interior really moved things on for BMW and they are cheaper to lease, but the Jag looks better drives well and there are not 100,000 others in our village. The E-class was much nicer than the C. Did not consider an Audi at this point.

Overall the W203 Mercedes was the one that she did not want to give back at the end of the lease term (all are company cars), I suspect the same may be true of the Jag but that is not for a few years.

Personally I don't mind some of BMWs current range but am generally a Merc fancier.

Ben

[daemon]

kambites said:

daemon said:

I personally dont "get" Audis. Given most A4s are common or garden 2.0 TDI's and the bulk of those are SEs, i dont understand what the advantage is over a VW Passat. Likewise an A3 in "standard" trim offers little advantage over a Golf.

For the 90% of compact executive buyers who wouldn't know chassis balance if it bit them on the nose, what advantage does a 3-series or C-class offer than an A4 doesn't?

Probably very little down to personal choice. However my point was that if i want a medium saloon car built by Mercedes Benz then i would buy a C Class. If i want a medium saloon car built by BMW, i buy a 3 series. If i want a medium saloon car built by VAG, then you can get a just-as-good but better spec'd Passat for £4K less.

I dont see a standard A4 offering anything over a standard passat

[daemon]

Faxo said:

V88Dicky said:

They'll be the 2.0 TDI 170s that owners are offloading before the injectors go pop.

NEVER seen any injector faults on the newer model A4, A3, A5, A6 etc

The only weak point on the newer Audis are DMFs, but this depends on driving style

"so far"

These issues only tend to hit from mid life onwards.

[blade7]

g3org3y said:

RobM77 said:

I couldn't give a toss about badge, I don't aspire to things, and I'm sat here in a t-shirt that cost me £6.

I'd buy some pants also otherwise you might need to buy a new chair.

[RobM77]

Willy Nilly said:

I can't imagine going back to a German car. Honda have been spoiling me for the last 12 years.

I'm a massive Honda fan, but it's such a shame they don't make a RWD car with a low CofG. As much as I love my wife's CTR, I could never have one as a daily driver as for me it's too tall and I prefer RWD. If Honda made a 3 series and it drove well, I'd never give a second thought to BMW.

[BFG TERRANO]

AB said:

You think otherwise?

A4 vs 3 series vs C class

A6 vs 5 series vs E class

Etc etc.

Driven them all. The BMW is a class ahead.

Personal taste and choice. I think BMW are streets behind. Not from personal experience but friends and colleagues cars.

[blueg33]

AB said:

fatboy b said:

AB said:

BMW are in a different class in terms of driving dynamics.

You think otherwise?

A4 vs 3 series vs C class

A6 vs 5 series vs E class

Etc etc.

Driven them all. The BMW is a class ahead.

I disagree - I came out of a 5 series into the A6 Quattro, you need to drive a quattro differently but it can get the power down much earlier than a rwd 5 series.

As for which car is better overall - I kept the 5 series for 2 years and have had the A6 for 7 years. Enough said.

[va1o]

They appeal to different markets IMO. Audi is the more fashionable and trendy brand, BMW is sportier and Mercedes is the traditional one. As actual cars there isn't a lot between the individual models these days.

[Willy Nilly]

RobM77 said:

Willy Nilly said:

I can't imagine going back to a German car. Honda have been spoiling me for the last 12 years.

I'm a massive Honda fan, but it's such a shame they don't make a RWD car with a low CofG. As much as I love my wife's CTR, I could never have one as a daily driver as for me it's too tall and I prefer RWD. If Honda made a 3 series and it drove well, I'd never give a second thought to BMW.

It would be nice if they engineered them to be a little more driver focused. They don't have to be the last word in driving dynamics for me, just a little more involving would be nice.

I don't buy the German engineering marketing BS. I have no doubt the interiors "feel" nicer and plusher, but I'm only interested in reliability. My car is very old now and has done just under 800 miles over christmas without issue after spending much of the time sitting on my drive. My bike is only 2 years old, it doesn't really shine in any particular area, but the whole thing just works. You never pick up on that on a 20 minute test drive. A Honda is for life, not just for Christmas.

[av185]

Fact is, none of these three marques are "premium" sector cars any more. Fleets, discounting, easy finance and ubiquity has put paid to that and it could be argued by many they are now as much "white goods" as more recognised mainstream brands.....

IMHO most Audis are particularly dull, soporific and uninvolving to drive and Mercedes run a close second.....

Most BMWs, in contrast, whilst in no way being the "ultimate driving machine" offer much more to the seasoned PH petrolhead as an all round ownership proposition......