Lotus, BMW or mazda?
Discussion
Mismatched tyres can have a massive effect on handling - the MX5 shouldnt behave like this. You also don't know the state of the suspension, springs, geometry - also, there could be leaves on the road, oil, bad tarmac - so you really can't make an informed decision based on that one incident. My E92 will kick out big time if you try - all RWD cars will. I even drifted my old 924 at 20 mph when it was raining around a roundabout (ditch finders on the back) - that was unintentional, and quite amusing at the time.
The MX5 is the best in terms of running costs, you may even be able to upgrade it to a supercharger if you got an older model?
The MX5 is the best in terms of running costs, you may even be able to upgrade it to a supercharger if you got an older model?
stuart-b said:
The MX5 is the best in terms of running costs.
Why do you say that? I'd expect the Elise to be vastly cheaper. I bought my Elise seven years ago and it's cost me around £1500 a year including everything except fuel to run. If I'd bought a brand new MX5 at that time, it would have cost more than that in depreciation alone.
kambites said:
Why do you say that? I'd expect the Elise to be vastly cheaper.
Is that before or after the engine rebuild?But seriously, if the Elise is anything like the Esprit in terms of build quality ..... good luck!
I would love to own one, but if the OP is considering an MX5, they're no in the same league really. One is a hardcore mid-engine manual window winding track car for the road, the other is an every day proposition for most non hardcore types.
Would you really tell him to get an Elise... without mentioning any known pitfalls or impartial advice as an owner? What happens if he shunts the front, how much is a clam?
stuart-b said:
Would you really tell him to get an Elise... without mentioning any known pitfalls or impartial advice as an owner? What happens if he shunts the front, how much is a clam?
No I wouldn't, but I wouldn't blindly say an MX5 would be cheaper either. 
I also don't know anyone who's ever needed an engine rebuild (unless you could head gasket replacement as an engine rebuild) on an Elise unless they've over-revved it by screwing up a gear-change, and that's hardly the car's fault.
kambites said:
No I wouldn't, but I wouldn't blindly say an MX5 would be cheaper either.
Cheaper can be said about any car. Your Octavia new is more expensive than an M3 (second hand).We can't compare apples and oranges.
Every day running costs are a different story, as are repair situations if he spins again!
P.S if he gets an MX5 almost new or new, what warranty does that come with, vs. a 5 year old Elise?
Can he afford a Toyota engine one, or a high power K series? Point is, a fully warrantied Japanese MX-5 is not even comparable to an older no-warranty, fibre glass high revving mid engine "baby super car" and you know it isn't
I'm comparing total running costs of both cars.
I doubt anyone would run an Elise without comprehensive insurance, so whilst the repair costs obviously push up insurance prices, that's a quantifiable cost of ownership. My Elise, (including a crash which involved replacing the front clam and the associated insurance hikes) has cost me less to run including fuel than a new MX5 would depreciate in the same time period.
I doubt anyone would run an Elise without comprehensive insurance, so whilst the repair costs obviously push up insurance prices, that's a quantifiable cost of ownership. My Elise, (including a crash which involved replacing the front clam and the associated insurance hikes) has cost me less to run including fuel than a new MX5 would depreciate in the same time period.
stuart-b said:
Can he afford a Toyota engine one, or a high power K series? Point is, a fully warrantied Japanese MX-5 is not even comparable to an older no-warranty, fibre glass high revving mid engine "baby super car" and you know it isn't
No it's not comparable - the MX5 will be vastly more expensive to run! Buying newish cars, depreciation is typically by far the biggest cost of ownership. He could get any model except the V6 for that money.
kambites said:
I'm comparing total running costs of both cars.
I doubt anyone would run an Elise without comprehensive insurance, so whilst the repair costs obviously push up insurance prices, that's a quantifiable cost of ownership. My Elise, (including a crash which involved replacing the front clam and the associated insurance hikes) has cost me less to run including fuel than a new MX5 would depreciate in the same time period.
But you are assuming any Elise he buys will never break. Which isn't fair, because it probably will, that's the law of probability. Better if he spends that money to get a new, warrantied car, which he will enjoy for a long time, and (IMHO) a car better suited to his current driving skills.I doubt anyone would run an Elise without comprehensive insurance, so whilst the repair costs obviously push up insurance prices, that's a quantifiable cost of ownership. My Elise, (including a crash which involved replacing the front clam and the associated insurance hikes) has cost me less to run including fuel than a new MX5 would depreciate in the same time period.
If it was me I'd have the Elise (I'm not worried about warranties or repairs) - but I'm going on what the OP has said he likes and his current situation / driving abilities and confidence.
Lets face it, if the MX5 wasn't the better choice, we wouldn't see millions of them on the roads vs. a handful of Elises.
stuart-b said:
But you are assuming any Elise he buys will never break.
No I'm not. I'm assuming it'll break as much as mine has broken which has been fairly typical of a K-series powered car. A Toyota powered one should break less. If you can find a single person who bought an MX5 new (which is what the OP is talking about) and ran it for seven years for less than it's cost to run my Elise, I'll be astonished.
ETA: Don't get me wrong, the Mazda is a lovely car but the OP would be losing thousands of pounds a year in depreciation - it's gonna cost more to run. If he was comparing a five year-old MX5 to an 5 year-old Elise or a new MX5 to a new Elise, the Mazda would be cheaper to run; but he isn't.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 7th January 17:41
Again I'll vouch for the MX-5 as one of the most predictable and manageable RWD sports cars going - ideal for beginners. Leaving aside the fact that you crashed it, by your own admission you don't have much experience which is no crime, but you do need to develop a feel for RWD cars and the MX-5 is probably the best going for this purpose.
MX-5s are sensitive to mismatched tyres. Ours (with limited slip diff) developed some utterly bizzare behaviour on mismatched rears even with similar tread.
Get an MX-5 on 4 good quality tyres and you'll love it, and you should learn from it and progress to more "advanced" driver's cars later.
MX-5s are sensitive to mismatched tyres. Ours (with limited slip diff) developed some utterly bizzare behaviour on mismatched rears even with similar tread.
Get an MX-5 on 4 good quality tyres and you'll love it, and you should learn from it and progress to more "advanced" driver's cars later.
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