RE: Chevrolet Corvette Stingray (C7): Review
Discussion
Ed Straker said:
Yeah, but he's a TVR Fan-boy - no point in presenting a rational argument......
That's b0ll0cks and you know it. It's the Corvette 'Fan-boys' (sic) who seem to be so darn insecure about their choice that they need to yelp about how Corvettes are the be all and end all of sports cars and make TVRs obsolete at every and any occasion. They're not and they don't. They're very different cars.
What you folks conventiently forget is that some people don't want a car that's almost like a regular saloon when driving about on the motorway etc. and turns into a driver's car when you want it by twiddling with a few settings. Which is what this road test clearly indicates - among other things, it mentions about overlight and feelless steering when driving normally on regular settings.
To me, it would mean I'm driving about in a car that fails to bond with its driver 95% of the time - even when I have the time and opportunity to go somewhere where I can reasonably tap into the potential of a car of this stature, I'll have driven two hours on motorways and regular A-roads before I get there. I bet it's the same for most PH'ers with jobs and other commitments and living where they make their living (IYKWIM).
For the same reason, modern Porsches (or any other modern mainstream sports car/GT) are 'out' for me, too. Huge expense, no sense of occasion except those fleeting high days and holidays moments. If it weren't for TVRs I would probably would drive older classics, which are a lot more of a pain to keep in good shape than a TVR and, frankly, most of them need lots of help before they are anywhere near as good a drive.
I want something that feels intense at any speed on any road and am willing to sacrifice Nürburgring lap times and other bar room bragging rights for that.
Furthermore, £170 just buys you six litres of decent engine oil and a filter. If that all the cost your car has attracted in 17 months time, I'd suggest either you're not driving it all that much or you're about to offload it to some unsuspecting punter pretty soon. My diesel estate just needed four new 18" tyres and brakes all round. That part of the bill alone added up to a grand and a half. It's rather disingenious not to take these costs into account just because you may not have had to replace tyres or brakes (which again would indicate that your car is more of a garage queen).
Four new Bridgestones on the TVR OTOH cost less than £400. I made the mistake of assuming the front brake pads would be pretty much worn after 35,000 miles that included some pretty intense PH-type runs and a track session, on replacing them the DS2500s that came out turned out to have about 80% left. Road tax here is hardly anything (1/5th of that of the diesel estate) because it doesn't weigh very much.
For the record, one annual service with MOT is all my 20 years old TVR needs (and maybe an oil service inbetween depending on mileage), any funds spent above and beyond it are strictly optional because I'm developing the car towards my own vision of what I want it to be, not unlike the Eagle E-type, Frontline MGB LE50, Singer/Autofarm etc. 911...
People want different thing from their cars and will make different choices from yours for equally valid reasons. A new TVR would exist in a tiny market niche compared to the 30,000 or so 'Vettes that get built in a year and there's the factor of people wanting something a bit more tailor-made to their requirements than a mass-produced car can offer. People buy Morgans, too that cost as much as a Corvette or 911, or late 1960s 911s or Eagle E-Types that cost 5x as much, and their reasons for buying one are as good as yours for buying a Corvette. Any comparison with declaring one or the other superior is so far beyond the point it's become laughable.
Is that so darn hard to understand??
BlitzE34 said:
Everyone knows LHD is superior. Many cars have been compromised when converted to RHD.
I don't see the value in converting, either. I drive a RHD car here and apart from having to get out when fetching a parking ticket, you get used to it very quickly and it's no hardship unless the car in question is fecking huge.As for the quality of LHD-RHD conversions, in the past even some manufacturers' RHD versions weren't all that...
My view is to leave the car as intended 
5 USA said:
Good. 
Brits do love searching for excuses not to buy the world's most successful V8 sportscar.
If a pair of shoes don't fit me well enough, I don't buy them no matter how good someone else thinks they are. If you care about driving, choosing a car is as personal as that. Brits do love searching for excuses not to buy the world's most successful V8 sportscar.
It just cracks me up how people go out of their way to prove their car is so much faster (even though at a PH-type of run you will see a vast spread of cars in terms of on-paper performance be actually pretty close in real-world pace), more reliable, more advanced that they really don't understand how someone could choose XYZ instead... do you choose your spouse based on what others say about her/him and the doctor's health report, too?
In the real world it's simple. You have a short list of things that attract or interest you (or like me, you get to be a car hack and drive pretty much everything), you look at one, you drive it, you 'click'. Or you don't.
No reflection on the car, or yourself, if you don't - it's just not for you.
The thing I have a beef with, is 'performance cars' all developing in the same sort of direction, and ones that present us with an alternative take being slagged off because they're not as fast/cheap/reliable/whatever so that in time, the choice gets even more restricted.
As for 'the most popular' being a virtue in itself: I gather that Miley Cyrus is pretty 'popular' too but I hop that you don't mind me refraining from adding any of her work to my music collection. Thank you.
900T-R. I don't think he was replying to you. As for people going out of their way to try and prove their car is better, from where I am sitting, that appears to be you.
Although at the start I did agree somewhat with your post - as good as my Z06 is, I would never part with my ZR1. It has similar power, the only driver aid is ABS, it has an insane rev happy engine with a noise to die for and you always get out with a big grin on your face. Partly due to the fact you feel more attached to what the car is doing. That and the fact ive spent a lot of time and money getting where it is. Put it another way, on a 3000 mile trip through France, Germany, Italy last year, the Z06 performed excellently, it carried all our luggage with ease, did pretty good mpg, topped 190 on the autobahn, a track day at Modena and we never got out feeling fatigued. However, 3 hairpins into a mountain pass, I turned to my wife and said I wished I was in the ZR1. Mind, it's nice arriving somewhere after a long drive and not shouting at everybody and having a splitting headache.
I too like the rawness of older cars. Unfortunately that's not where they are going. You sit in the Z06 for a while after turning it off, you can hear all the electronics clicking away behind the dash. All these electronics in a modern car scare the s
t out of me tbh
Me I just like nice cars, bikes and planes don't really care about the make tbh
Although at the start I did agree somewhat with your post - as good as my Z06 is, I would never part with my ZR1. It has similar power, the only driver aid is ABS, it has an insane rev happy engine with a noise to die for and you always get out with a big grin on your face. Partly due to the fact you feel more attached to what the car is doing. That and the fact ive spent a lot of time and money getting where it is. Put it another way, on a 3000 mile trip through France, Germany, Italy last year, the Z06 performed excellently, it carried all our luggage with ease, did pretty good mpg, topped 190 on the autobahn, a track day at Modena and we never got out feeling fatigued. However, 3 hairpins into a mountain pass, I turned to my wife and said I wished I was in the ZR1. Mind, it's nice arriving somewhere after a long drive and not shouting at everybody and having a splitting headache.
I too like the rawness of older cars. Unfortunately that's not where they are going. You sit in the Z06 for a while after turning it off, you can hear all the electronics clicking away behind the dash. All these electronics in a modern car scare the s
t out of me tbh Me I just like nice cars, bikes and planes don't really care about the make tbh
Gixer said:
As for people going out of their way to try and prove their car is better, from where I am sitting, that appears to be you.
Um, I really don't care whether my car is 'better' (than what?) for someone else. But I do have a beef with people trying to tell me their car is better for me - I know what I like and what puts me off, so if people of a certain automotive persuasion are constantly droning on about how their chosen steeds is the universal panacea to everything and how cr*p other cars are in comparison (which is the way all threads in which the Corvette gets a mention go), I'll give the alternative view - which BTW is that of all new cars of the past twelve months or so, the bum-basic Caterham 160 piques my interest far more than any Porsche, Corvette, Lamborghini or Ferrari. 5 USA said:
dukebox9reg said:
It just doesn't work for me.
Good. Brits do love searching for excuses not to buy the world's most successful V8 sportscar.
There is a reason why it works in America. Its American for starters who's people are the most patriotic people in the world (that is a good thing by the way it was nice to go over there years ago as a member of the British Armed Forces and actually get treated with some respect rather than mainly looked down on in this country)
Its cheap compared to rivals over there which are arguably better but cant justify the increased price point.
Over here were the wheel is on the wrong side, the car looks and feels cheaper then its rivals (perceived quality)and it costs the same, ooooh and the biggest issue we pay by the litre and not by the gallon for our fuel.
If I was in the market for a pick up for example it wouldnt be a F150 and look how they sell!.....in America.
900T-R said:
Furthermore, £170 just buys you six litres of decent engine oil and a filter. If that all the cost your car has attracted in 17 months time, I'd suggest either you're not driving it all that much or you're about to offload it to some unsuspecting punter pretty soon. My diesel estate just needed four new 18" tyres and brakes all round. That part of the bill alone added up to a grand and a half. It's rather disingenious not to take these costs into account just because you may not have had to replace tyres or brakes (which again would indicate that your car is more of a garage queen).
Four new Bridgestones on the TVR OTOH cost less than £400. I made the mistake of assuming the front brake pads would be pretty much worn after 35,000 miles that included some pretty intense PH-type runs and a track session, on replacing them the DS2500s that came out turned out to have about 80% left. Road tax here is hardly anything (1/5th of that of the diesel estate) because it doesn't weigh very much.
To be fair, I have only spent about the same amount on maintenance as swerni has on his Corvette for my Camaro in the last year, and it is my DD for the moment. Replacing the tyres for winter tyres added 1.895 EUR to that.Four new Bridgestones on the TVR OTOH cost less than £400. I made the mistake of assuming the front brake pads would be pretty much worn after 35,000 miles that included some pretty intense PH-type runs and a track session, on replacing them the DS2500s that came out turned out to have about 80% left. Road tax here is hardly anything (1/5th of that of the diesel estate) because it doesn't weigh very much.
As for brakes, I'm seriously impressed that after 28.000-ish miles, the Brembos are far from worn out...
Over £60k - hardly makes it a bargain over here does it really. Which "bavarian" car is it 18kgs lighter than which has a 4.4 V8? I'm not sure if they mean the M3/4 which has 6 cylinders? it's also more expensive too, and (if I'm not mistaken) no back seats so hardly out and out competitors.
Here's some light reading for Corvette fans,
http://www.roadandtrack.com/bestof2013/2013-road-a...
Performance car of the year 2013
http://www.roadandtrack.com/bestof2013/2013-road-a...
Performance car of the year 2013
E65Ross said:
Over £60k - hardly makes it a bargain over here does it really. Which "bavarian" car is it 18kgs lighter than which has a 4.4 V8? I'm not sure if they mean the M3/4 which has 6 cylinders? it's also more expensive too, and (if I'm not mistaken) no back seats so hardly out and out competitors.
If it has been compared to one then I agree they are hardly competitors and are aimed at completely different end of the market. Then again Journo's have a habit of comparing chalk with cheesePersonally I'm not a fan. The new style from the rear quarter back just doesn't do it for me. Greatly improved by the Z06 but its still got that arse
Anyway, with all this bloody rain, perhaps we should be looking at boats or hovercraft as our next toy
Edited by Gixer on Friday 17th January 15:33
5 USA said:
Here's some light reading for Corvette fans,
http://www.roadandtrack.com/bestof2013/2013-road-a...
Performance car of the year 2013
Best comment though:http://www.roadandtrack.com/bestof2013/2013-road-a...
Performance car of the year 2013
"The wisest comment in this article is the one noting that the Fiesta has enough performance in every direction to go just as fast as you dare on the public roads. For those of us who won't ever get to a track, that's really important, for it's a lot more fun to drive less car at 9/10 than it is to drive more car at 7/10. The latter is an ego feed, but the former is just a gas."
This is IMO what we stand to lose in the battle of egos that the big players in the sports/super car market are locked into, and why there will always be a market for niche products like Morgan, TVR, Caterham et al. Give me the same sort of outright performance as a good modern hot hatch in a front engined, RWD car with a charismatic (multi cylinder) drivetrain, give me style, sense of occasion and a bit of everyday practicality and... well, that's it really. I think James May had similar ponderings regarding his Ferrari 458 - stating that his ideal would be something like an MX-5 with a rev-happy small V8 of 250 bhp or so and all the bespokeness and visual drama of a supercar. He may have written the piece in jest, but I happen to think he was dead right.
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