How do VW (and Audi) do it?
Discussion
Grandfondo said:
Grandfondo said:
Patrick Bateman said:
Grandfondo said:
Vorsprung Durch tecknik!
Development/advancement through technology, that isn't necessarily saying anything about reliability though, is it?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgHlAdSpn7Y
From the 1980s, so NOT in the last 20 years.
Grandfondo said:
Patrick Bateman said:
Grandfondo said:
Vorsprung Durch tecknik!
Development/advancement through technology, that isn't necessarily saying anything about reliability though, is it?More or less the first post was that the reason why VW's were "perceived" as reliable, when they werent was due to marketing.
My point was that they havent marketed themselves as being reliable in the last 20 years.
Please try to keep up
I honestly don't think you can beat a petrol focus for reliability. We've got one we bought new in 99. It's been abused, not serviced properly, tracked. Driven on bumpy Cumbrian roads it's entire life, it's on 130k now and nothing absolutely nothing has ever gone wrong with it. The handbrake stuck on once when it was left standing for a couple of months that's it.
lee_erm said:
I honestly don't think you can beat a petrol focus for reliability. We've got one we bought new in 99. It's been abused, not serviced properly, tracked. Driven on bumpy Cumbrian roads it's entire life, it's on 130k now and nothing absolutely nothing has ever gone wrong with it. The handbrake stuck on once when it was left standing for a couple of months that's it.
But you're going back a couple of generations there. You could say the same about a 1999 Golf. Do you really think the new 1.0T Focus will be without issues?
daemon said:
lee_erm said:
I honestly don't think you can beat a petrol focus for reliability. We've got one we bought new in 99. It's been abused, not serviced properly, tracked. Driven on bumpy Cumbrian roads it's entire life, it's on 130k now and nothing absolutely nothing has ever gone wrong with it. The handbrake stuck on once when it was left standing for a couple of months that's it.
But you're going back a couple of generations there. You could say the same about a 1999 Golf. Do you really think the new 1.0T Focus will be without issues?
t. Often breaks down, most electrical items have issues, interior is falling apart etc. etc. Costs him a fortune but 'why get rid of it, it is a quality German car' is his attitude. In the garage where I work local independent garage the most problem cars that cause the most issues are French cars mainly Peugeot and german cars mainly vw/audi. The main issue I have with vag cars are the stupid connectors on electrical components that snap even by looking at them.
From what ive seen over 4 years in the garage is that jap/Korean cars are the most reliable followed by ford excluding the 1.6 diesel engine and 2.0.
So what do I drive a 21 year old mk1 mx5 which has been totally reliable for me the engine gets given hell and it still keeps on going I don't think I will leave from jap cars the only downside is rust which is common in mx5 but being a welder doesn't cost me anything.
From what ive seen over 4 years in the garage is that jap/Korean cars are the most reliable followed by ford excluding the 1.6 diesel engine and 2.0.
So what do I drive a 21 year old mk1 mx5 which has been totally reliable for me the engine gets given hell and it still keeps on going I don't think I will leave from jap cars the only downside is rust which is common in mx5 but being a welder doesn't cost me anything.
My issue with this thread, and all the other "this car/brand/bank/restaurant/footballer is crap because......" Threads is that bad news travels faster and further than good news.
How often do people start a thread saying "wow, my German premium car is reliable, shocking!" People don't, because it's not considered even remotely worthy of mention. Fact is you could go out and spend a lot of money a motor and find it's an absolute dog, with no end of problems, and from just about any (consumer grade) car maker. "Friday afternoon specials", whatever you want to call them.
My Audi has done about as well as I expected..... Solid, squeak free interior wearing well after 100k miles, one CV boot replaced, and the usual servicing stuff like the cam belt and fluid changes. Ive had the oil for the Haldex system replaced as a precautionary measure, and beyond an unexpected encounter with a deer at 70mph, I've had no issues.
Am I one of the lucky ones, I really don't thinks so. I'd say if VAG products were that bad, people would have been turned off them in no time at all, such is the prevelance and power of social networks/the internet and general consumer savviness nowadays (thanks Watchdog
.
How often do people start a thread saying "wow, my German premium car is reliable, shocking!" People don't, because it's not considered even remotely worthy of mention. Fact is you could go out and spend a lot of money a motor and find it's an absolute dog, with no end of problems, and from just about any (consumer grade) car maker. "Friday afternoon specials", whatever you want to call them.
My Audi has done about as well as I expected..... Solid, squeak free interior wearing well after 100k miles, one CV boot replaced, and the usual servicing stuff like the cam belt and fluid changes. Ive had the oil for the Haldex system replaced as a precautionary measure, and beyond an unexpected encounter with a deer at 70mph, I've had no issues.
Am I one of the lucky ones, I really don't thinks so. I'd say if VAG products were that bad, people would have been turned off them in no time at all, such is the prevelance and power of social networks/the internet and general consumer savviness nowadays (thanks Watchdog
. daemon said:
Grandfondo said:
Patrick Bateman said:
Grandfondo said:
Vorsprung Durch tecknik!
Development/advancement through technology, that isn't necessarily saying anything about reliability though, is it?More or less the first post was that the reason why VW's were "perceived" as reliable, when they werent was due to marketing.
My point was that they havent marketed themselves as being reliable in the last 20 years.
Please try to keep up
And you were taken in by buying a Golf to do a long comute so economy and reliability would have been part of the buying decision ,yes?
Grandfondo said:
They are by making that statement implying that their cars are getting better ie reliable.
Better cars generally. Better economy, better dynamics, etc. They're certainly in the top quartile of their group with the latest golf.You're reading something thats not there to be honest.
Grandfondo said:
And you were taken in by buying a Golf to do a long comute so economy and reliability would have been part of the buying decision ,yes?
I dont see how buying a class leading car is being "taken in"?Reliability wasnt a big thing as the car is under warranty anyway. I'll probably stick an extended warranty on it when it hits three years old - as i would any car if i was keeping it - and then review things then. If its been acceptable i'll drive on at it, if its not, i'll change it.
Economy came in to it as i know from previous experience how frugal VAG engines can be, and i've not been disappointed. Averaging around 67mpg brim to brim so far.
I've done 10,000 trouble free miles in it with no issues.
It's very apt that several posters in this thread still swear blind that VW's (and in some cases German cars in general) are still more reliable and of a generally much better quality than other brands or cars from other countries. The marketing, myth and brand 'halo' is still working regardless of what the past ten years of owners say.
gvij said:
Foppo said:
Made me laugh very funny.>
Mines never broken down(12 years old and now on 90k miles), and yes the interior is the best of any car Ive been in and Ive been in 100 grand motors.
. It's a beautiful interior and never let me down on the road either but they can be a money pit. As owners say "You don't own an Audi TT, you support it" 
.daemon said:
Ved said:
Marketing
where, in the last 20 years, have they marketed themselves as reliable?Sounds just like a Golf campaign
"God only knows" VW Van campaign
All imply solid, highly reliable (both in engineering and through ownership) and a class above in their brand. They're also still very much relying on the foundations that the 80s marketing laid down so effectively. Some things don't need to be shouted about if they're already planted in the market place.
MissChief said:
It's very apt that several posters in this thread still swear blind that VW's (and in some cases German cars in general) are still more reliable and of a generally much better quality than other brands or cars from other countries. The marketing, myth and brand 'halo' is still working regardless of what the past ten years of owners say.
As a VW owner, i dont think they are particularly any more reliable than any other brand. Thats not why i bought it.AnotherClarkey said:
daemon said:
lee_erm said:
I honestly don't think you can beat a petrol focus for reliability. We've got one we bought new in 99. It's been abused, not serviced properly, tracked. Driven on bumpy Cumbrian roads it's entire life, it's on 130k now and nothing absolutely nothing has ever gone wrong with it. The handbrake stuck on once when it was left standing for a couple of months that's it.
But you're going back a couple of generations there. You could say the same about a 1999 Golf. Do you really think the new 1.0T Focus will be without issues?
t. Often breaks down, most electrical items have issues, interior is falling apart etc. etc. Costs him a fortune but 'why get rid of it, it is a quality German car' is his attitude. In the same way people think BMW's are a "sporting brand" when 90% of the cars they sell are diesel, and 90% of the rest are four pot petrols.
My experience, I had a 97 Audi A8 2.8 bought at 131,000 sold at 174,500.
Had a few age related problems but never let me down.
Directly after that I had a 03 Audi A4 2.0 FSI, got it from my son.
He had one injector replaced, and I finally tracked down misfire problems to a blocked fuel pump filter. A known problem now!
Never stopped me getting to work and back though, but the A4 was a real drop in quality from the A8. To be expected I suppose.
Worst car for quality of interior and exterior paint was a brand new Impreza Turbo 2000.
Shocking it was.
But I do suspect that since curing the "10 years old rust and scrap it" problems, they are now making the plastics involved only last 10 years so then start to fail.
Particularly plastics in the engine components.
I do believe this is deliberate, as being an Engineer myself it is rather obvious they are engineering them for this life-cycle, and thus keeping the "Churn" of old to new cars moving.
So expect it to get worse.
Had a few age related problems but never let me down.
Directly after that I had a 03 Audi A4 2.0 FSI, got it from my son.
He had one injector replaced, and I finally tracked down misfire problems to a blocked fuel pump filter. A known problem now!
Never stopped me getting to work and back though, but the A4 was a real drop in quality from the A8. To be expected I suppose.
Worst car for quality of interior and exterior paint was a brand new Impreza Turbo 2000.
Shocking it was.
But I do suspect that since curing the "10 years old rust and scrap it" problems, they are now making the plastics involved only last 10 years so then start to fail.
Particularly plastics in the engine components.
I do believe this is deliberate, as being an Engineer myself it is rather obvious they are engineering them for this life-cycle, and thus keeping the "Churn" of old to new cars moving.
So expect it to get worse.
Ved said:
daemon said:
Ved said:
Marketing
where, in the last 20 years, have they marketed themselves as reliable?Sounds just like a Golf campaign
"God only knows" VW Van campaign
All imply solid, highly reliable (both in engineering and through ownership) and a class above in their brand. They're also still very much relying on the foundations that the 80s marketing laid down so effectively. Some things don't need to be shouted about if they're already planted in the market place.
Says more about the fact that at that time people thought golfs cost more than they could afford.
Solidity does not equal reliability.
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