RE: Porsche Macan: Review
Discussion
I can see why they have worked so hard on the dynamics. In recent surveys 84% of school run mums stated that the way a car handles the transition from under to oversteer while remaining benign under power was a primary factor in choosing their next car.
Now Porsche have got that engineering conundrum sussed, I suspect plenty of Macans will be appearing outside suburban primary schools at drop-off time.
Now Porsche have got that engineering conundrum sussed, I suspect plenty of Macans will be appearing outside suburban primary schools at drop-off time.
'Like it or not this is Porsche's income stream'
Technically, Porsche's income stream comes from owning over 50% of the world's second largest automotice firm. This income dwarfs anything they can make from selling their own cars. The argument that Porsche SUVs are a necassary evil to generate the money needed to make and develop sports cars is a total myth as they could halt production of everything bar the 911 RS and only build one of those a year and they would still be comically profitable so long as people kept buying Skodas, VW's, Audis, Seats, Suzukis, and numerous other products.
Personally, I happen to really like Porsche's SUV products. They took a product pioneered by the likes of Land Rover and recognised that the offroad element wasn't where it was at going forward and that what the market needed along side off road versions was proper fast road versions. And they have been proven crushingly correct. There is an army of buyers who want the convenience of these modern versions of the family saloon but really wants to hold onto performance and handling at the same time.
The original Cayenne was a bit of a warthog but there is absolutely no way that anyone who likes the thrill of driving wouldn't piss themselves laughing when they bury the throttle of a Cayenne Turbo and then fire it into a corner and survive the outcome. It's a staggering bit of mobile fridge. The new shape actually looks nice and for the first time Porsche have understood that SUV buyers expect luxury interiors as defined in the segment by JLR and applied this also.
I'm sure this Pecan is phenominal. Until JLR put their v8 in the Evoque then it cannot hold a candle to it. The only way an Evoque can scare the s
t out of you is when the dealer hands you the itemised repair bill. I'm a JLR man through and through but when the Pecan offers the same space, a great interior and at the same time ball whacking performance then it is a bit of a no brainer.
Technically, Porsche's income stream comes from owning over 50% of the world's second largest automotice firm. This income dwarfs anything they can make from selling their own cars. The argument that Porsche SUVs are a necassary evil to generate the money needed to make and develop sports cars is a total myth as they could halt production of everything bar the 911 RS and only build one of those a year and they would still be comically profitable so long as people kept buying Skodas, VW's, Audis, Seats, Suzukis, and numerous other products.
Personally, I happen to really like Porsche's SUV products. They took a product pioneered by the likes of Land Rover and recognised that the offroad element wasn't where it was at going forward and that what the market needed along side off road versions was proper fast road versions. And they have been proven crushingly correct. There is an army of buyers who want the convenience of these modern versions of the family saloon but really wants to hold onto performance and handling at the same time.
The original Cayenne was a bit of a warthog but there is absolutely no way that anyone who likes the thrill of driving wouldn't piss themselves laughing when they bury the throttle of a Cayenne Turbo and then fire it into a corner and survive the outcome. It's a staggering bit of mobile fridge. The new shape actually looks nice and for the first time Porsche have understood that SUV buyers expect luxury interiors as defined in the segment by JLR and applied this also.
I'm sure this Pecan is phenominal. Until JLR put their v8 in the Evoque then it cannot hold a candle to it. The only way an Evoque can scare the s
t out of you is when the dealer hands you the itemised repair bill. I'm a JLR man through and through but when the Pecan offers the same space, a great interior and at the same time ball whacking performance then it is a bit of a no brainer.IMI A said:
God Porsche is making some shyte these days. Just total shyte. They'll be sticking the badge on lawn mowers soon. There is nothing in their current range that gets the blood going. The range is so bad that nice examples of the air-cooled stuff will become 6 figure values cars even run of the mill 993 C2 and 964 C2 as more and more people seek out the original DNA. Even watercooled 996 and 997 GT3s will head in a similar direction as they do not sell drivers cars any more.
If this is your definition of shyte, then god help "lesser" manufacturers. Some understanding of how to ensure your company survives in the modern world might help you too.kambites said:
That rather depends on which "Porsche" you're talking about. The Porsche holding company owns half of VW which in turn owns the Porsche car company.
It is a wonderful mess, when you factor in the 20% voting limit or the stock options but it's the holding company that is pertinent in the argument/view over money as that is where the money ultimately flows to. The income stream from their stock exposure is more than sufficient to counter any need to put a low performance engine in one of their fridges to obtain volume sales. IMI A said:
God Porsche is making some shyte these days. Just total shyte. They'll be sticking the badge on lawn mowers soon. There is nothing in their current range that gets the blood going. The range is so bad that nice examples of the air-cooled stuff will become 6 figure values cars even run of the mill 993 C2 and 964 C2 as more and more people seek out the original DNA. Even watercooled 996 and 997 GT3s will head in a similar direction as they do not sell drivers cars any more.
The next generation of petrol heads will be saying the same, as the 997 and 991 head into starship £ figures, with 20 and 30 somethings then citing they really were the 'last of the great drivers cars' whilst complaining that the relatively cheap second hand 992 and the new 994's are just "too easy and too comfortable to be a drivers car". They are all good. All different, but all good in different ways.
The Macan looks fab and will no doubt be a fast and comfortable machine - but I can't work out the rationale for the cost of the base models at all. Add in leather interior and you are only about £2k price difference from a Cayenne. I can't see this breaking ground with a new generation of customers; it is a smaller Cayenne for the same price, really.
DonkeyApple said:
kambites said:
That rather depends on which "Porsche" you're talking about. The Porsche holding company owns half of VW which in turn owns the Porsche car company.
It is a wonderful mess, when you factor in the 20% voting limit or the stock options but it's the holding company that is pertinent in the argument/view over money as that is where the money ultimately flows to. The income stream from their stock exposure is more than sufficient to counter any need to put a low performance engine in one of their fridges to obtain volume sales. If we want to see the Porsche badge survive on the nose of cars, I think these things have got to be a good thing.
IMI A said:
God Porsche is making some shyte these days. Just total shyte. They'll be sticking the badge on lawn mowers soon. There is nothing in their current range that gets the blood going. The range is so bad that nice examples of the air-cooled stuff will become 6 figure values cars even run of the mill 993 C2 and 964 C2 as more and more people seek out the original DNA. Even watercooled 996 and 997 GT3s will head in a similar direction as they do not sell drivers cars any more.
I can sympathise with this view to some degree. The 991, in particular, left me cold on an extended test drive too. I don't think it's because it's intrinsically bad - it clearly isn't - but more down to some unfortunate choices Porsche made that have left the car feeling somewhat soul-less and uninvolving compared to the 997 I currently own. In no particular order the 'let-downs' (for me) are: Dead electric steering. No decent manual gearbox option(the PDK-derived manual is horrible). Dreadful, Audi-style, over-serviced brakes. Fake engine noise piped into the cabin via a 'Sound Symposer' (tube, diaphragm and sound-shaper box attached to the inlet manifold at one end and open to the cabin at the other). Overall balance of the car being a lot less '911' in feel. Looks that have gone too generic.
The looks are something we can do nothing about in real terms, but were Porsche to offer the current range with hydraulic power steering, a decent manual 'box option, less sound deadening / the false pneumatic generators removed and properly-weighted brakes again, it would restore a lot of what Porsches are about without diminishing any of the gains Porsche has made. I think that's all it would take to make a lot of people feel very differently about the current models.
DeanHelix said:
Unfortunate name. Just wait till one goes missing in Portugal, we'll never hear the end of it.
I doubt anyone is going to sedate their car to keep it quiet whilst they have dinner then when they return the car won't start so they take it to some remote place and torch it before pushing it into the ocean. Impasse said:
I can see why they have worked so hard on the dynamics. In recent surveys 84% of school run mums stated that the way a car handles the transition from under to oversteer while remaining benign under power was a primary factor in choosing their next car.
Now Porsche have got that engineering conundrum sussed, I suspect plenty of Macans will be appearing outside suburban primary schools at drop-off time.
Exactly this. The people who really care about the way the car drives are the sort of people who are probably not going to be interested. It will sell like hot cakes and hopefully keep the bean counters happy at Porsche. Now Porsche have got that engineering conundrum sussed, I suspect plenty of Macans will be appearing outside suburban primary schools at drop-off time.
IMI A said:
God Porsche is making some shyte these days. Just total shyte. They'll be sticking the badge on lawn mowers soon. There is nothing in their current range that gets the blood going. The range is so bad that nice examples of the air-cooled stuff will become 6 figure values cars even run of the mill 993 C2 and 964 C2 as more and more people seek out the original DNA. Even watercooled 996 and 997 GT3s will head in a similar direction as they do not sell drivers cars any more.
In order for Porsche to make stuff such as the 911 GT3 etc, they have to sell these type of cars.But obviously you know better.
Inevitable next family car for me - never thought I would buy an SUV, but the missus wants one, and in fairness the added piece of mind you get in winter when you have extreme weather (snow, or now rain it seems!)does make some sense when it comes to real life tasks like the school run!
Key is to have other car(s) on the driveway that can float your boat and keep the the juices flowing - this may well be good on a track, but nobody is going to use it on a track, and I'd be gutted if an SUV was my *only* source of motoring fun!
Key is to have other car(s) on the driveway that can float your boat and keep the the juices flowing - this may well be good on a track, but nobody is going to use it on a track, and I'd be gutted if an SUV was my *only* source of motoring fun!
IMI A said:
Lets be clear the range is mostly compromised of rebadged and optimised VWs or Audi platforms.
IMI A said:
the range is mostly compromised of rebadged
IMI A said:
mostly
Compare:
2 out of 8 currently available Porsches are remotely related to other VW group platforms.
What did you say again...
IMI A said:
mostly
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