RE: Chris Harris video: McLaren P1

[MC Bodge]

The video and (more-so)the preceding article were good, although I might have preferred less of the drifty stuff and more about how it managed to stay on the chosen cornering line.



ps. As others have mentioned: What was the point of those, apparently out-of-normal-character, extremely cringe-worthy crude (hardly innuendo) and out-of-place remarks? I'm not sure why they were left in, and who they were supposed to appeal to, but they were presumably left in deliberately. Mr Goodwin didn't appear to be encouraging it either.

That aspect was a bit disappointing really, from my point of view.

[Monty Zoomer]

Peloton25 said:

Dagnut said:

I'm not sure how far the Ferrari can travel on electric power alone.

LaFerrari is limited not by distance, but by speed, to 5 KPH in its electric mode. Basically enough to let you get quietly out of the garage and down the driveway in the morning.

Evidence of this happening can be seen in this video:

http://youtu.be/W4qpGgHIz64?t=2m23s

>8^)
ER

[CraigyMc]

Monty Zoomer said:

Peloton25 said:

Dagnut said:

I'm not sure how far the Ferrari can travel on electric power alone.

LaFerrari is limited not by distance, but by speed, to 5 KPH in its electric mode. Basically enough to let you get quietly out of the garage and down the driveway in the morning.

Evidence of this happening can be seen in this video:

http://youtu.be/W4qpGgHIz64?t=2m23s

>8^)
ER

Ferrari estimate between 9 and 14 miles for the LaFerrari on electric-only power, but you'd have to really need to use that to put up with that 3mph top speed, like if it was broken or something. Ferrari themselves treat it as a hypothetical (and rightly so) because it's pretty unlikely to be needed.

I suppose it'd make traffic jams quieter for LaFerrari drivers.

[mikebradford]

MC Bodge said:

I'm not sure why they were left in, and who they were supposed to appeal to, but they were presumably left in deliberately.

I personally didnt mind them. if they had of been edited out i would have been non the wiser.
But for me it gave the impression that it was a video representative of him on the day and his excitment.
I would imagine looking back at my self if every exciting event i every had was recorded, their would be several cringeworthy comments by myself.
I like the fact these were left in rather than it becoming edited to death , like those videos many are happy to churn out

[Dagnut]

CraigyMc said:

Monty Zoomer said:

Peloton25 said:

Dagnut said:

I'm not sure how far the Ferrari can travel on electric power alone.

LaFerrari is limited not by distance, but by speed, to 5 KPH in its electric mode. Basically enough to let you get quietly out of the garage and down the driveway in the morning.

Evidence of this happening can be seen in this video:

http://youtu.be/W4qpGgHIz64?t=2m23s

>8^)
ER

Ferrari estimate between 9 and 14 miles for the LaFerrari on electric-only power, but you'd have to really need to use that to put up with that 3mph top speed, like if it was broken or something. Ferrari themselves treat it as a hypothetical (and rightly so) because it's pretty unlikely to be needed.

I suppose it'd make traffic jams quieter for LaFerrari drivers.

So basically useless...

[007 VXR]

mikebradford said:

MC Bodge said:

I'm not sure why they were left in, and who they were supposed to appeal to, but they were presumably left in deliberately.

I personally didnt mind them. if they had of been edited out i would have been non the wiser.
But for me it gave the impression that it was a video representative of him on the day and his excitment.
I would imagine looking back at my self if every exciting event i every had was recorded, their would be several cringeworthy comments by myself.
I like the fact these were left in rather than it becoming edited to death , like those videos many are happy to churn out

+1 Well said

[007 VXR]

Dagnut said:

CraigyMc said:

Monty Zoomer said:

Peloton25 said:

Dagnut said:

I'm not sure how far the Ferrari can travel on electric power alone.

LaFerrari is limited not by distance, but by speed, to 5 KPH in its electric mode. Basically enough to let you get quietly out of the garage and down the driveway in the morning.

Evidence of this happening can be seen in this video:

http://youtu.be/W4qpGgHIz64?t=2m23s

>8^)
ER

Ferrari estimate between 9 and 14 miles for the LaFerrari on electric-only power, but you'd have to really need to use that to put up with that 3mph top speed, like if it was broken or something. Ferrari themselves treat it as a hypothetical (and rightly so) because it's pretty unlikely to be needed.

I suppose it'd make traffic jams quieter for LaFerrari drivers.

So basically useless...

This is why the 918 is different from the Lfa and P1

[Dagnut]

007 VXR said:

Dagnut said:

CraigyMc said:

Monty Zoomer said:

Peloton25 said:

Dagnut said:

I'm not sure how far the Ferrari can travel on electric power alone.

LaFerrari is limited not by distance, but by speed, to 5 KPH in its electric mode. Basically enough to let you get quietly out of the garage and down the driveway in the morning.

Evidence of this happening can be seen in this video:

http://youtu.be/W4qpGgHIz64?t=2m23s

>8^)
ER

Ferrari estimate between 9 and 14 miles for the LaFerrari on electric-only power, but you'd have to really need to use that to put up with that 3mph top speed, like if it was broken or something. Ferrari themselves treat it as a hypothetical (and rightly so) because it's pretty unlikely to be needed.

I suppose it'd make traffic jams quieter for LaFerrari drivers.

So basically useless...

This is why the 918 is different from the Lfa and P1

Completely agree, I did say in an earlier post.

[Monty Zoomer]

They should line all three up on the startine at the 'Ring and see which can go furthest on electricity only.

Presumably the Porsche would do a few laps, the McLaren would do less than half and the Ferrari would conk out at the bottom of the first hill

[007 VXR]

Monty Zoomer said:

They should line all three up on the startine at the 'Ring and see which can go furthest on electricity only.

Presumably the Porsche would do a few laps, the McLaren would do less than half and the Ferrari would conk out at the bottom of the first hill

That is the point most are missing, the 918 was designed in a diffrent way from the Lfa and P1...

[Peloton25]

007 VXR said:

That is the point most are missing, the 918 was designed in a diffrent way from the Lfa and P1...

Oh, so that explains why it is 500 lbs heavier.

>8^)
ER

[anonymous-user]

Peloton25 said:

007 VXR said:

That is the point most are missing, the 918 was designed in a diffrent way from the Lfa and P1...

Oh, so that explains why it is 500 lbs heavier.

>8^)
ER

I think it's worth pointing out that the 918's hybrid systems have been developed on a very different level to those in the P1. For the P1, it really was a cost no object exercise, and with less than 400 units being manufactured, lots of options became available that simply could not be used by Porsche for their much higher volume product. Also, the 918 doesn't stand alone for Porsche. It will not "wipe its feet" on its own, and was really only justifiable if the tech developed for it could be handed down to other products in the range (and not just the Porsche range!). This means the 918 is significantly heavier and relies less on it's hybrid systems than the P1, but those systems are very much more production intent than those in the P1.

[007 VXR]

Peloton25 said:

007 VXR said:

That is the point most are missing, the 918 was designed in a diffrent way from the Lfa and P1...

Oh, so that explains why it is 500 lbs heavier.

>8^)
ER

[CraigyMc]

007 VXR said:

Monty Zoomer said:

They should line all three up on the startine at the 'Ring and see which can go furthest on electricity only.

Presumably the Porsche would do a few laps, the McLaren would do less than half and the Ferrari would conk out at the bottom of the first hill

That is the point most are missing, the 918 was designed in a diffrent way from the Lfa and P1...

Battery Comparison
Car	Capacity	Peak Discharge Rate	Supplier	Weight	Cells	Nominal Voltage	Battery Endurance (e-Motor max)	Warranty Duration
Porsche 918	6.8kWh	230kW	(? suspect Panasonic)	138kg	312	385V (Max430V,Min283V)	6.8kWh @ 208kW = 117.6s	7 Years
McLaren P1	4.7kWh	180kW	Axeon (Johnson Matthey)	96kg	326 (6x54)	535V	4.7kWh @ 131kW = 129.1s	Expected life 10 years
Ferrari LaFerrari	2.3kWh	120kW	Samsung	57kg	120 (8x15)	380V	2.3kWh @ 120kW = 69.0s	?

• All above cars use liquid cooled Lithium Ion battery packs.
• Note that the "Battery Endurance (e-Motor max)" column is a purely hypothetical measure of how long the battery could maintain peak power to the fitted motor(s). It's not realistic for a number of reasons (eg. there's probably no hill in the world steep and long enough to make a 918 run its battery flat before getting to 94mph). Please take this as intended: it is provided for comparison only.
• All capacities stated are BOL (Beginning of Life). Li-Ion Batteries lose capacity over their lifespan.

e-Motor Comparison
Car	e-Motor(s) Input	e-Motor(s) Supplier	e-Motor Revlimit	e-Motor Weight	e-Motor Cooling
Porsche 918	208kW (Note e1)	? (suspect Porsche)	16000 (front), ? (rear)	front?kg,rear?kg	?front, ?rear
McLaren P1	131kW (Note e2)	McLaren Electronic Systems	18000	26kg	Water Cooled
Ferrari LaFerrari	120kW (Note e3)	Magnetti Marelli	?	47.5kg(EM1),15kg(EM2)	Oil 90ºC Max (EM1), Water 90ºC Max (EM2)

Note e1.

• The 918 has two e-motors, 93kW Front and 115kW Rear.
• The front e-motor has fixed gearing and disconnects via a clutch at 265km/h (was 240km/h during development) to avoid over-revving.
• The rear e-motor drives through the gearbox.

Note e2.

• If the MES eMachine (e-Motor) in the P1 is the same design as that supplied by MES to Formula E, it's actually capable of a peak output of 200kW.
• It steps down from 18000rpm through a fixed gearbox at 2.02:1 to the same approximate rev range as the IC motor (it's actually 0-8910rpm, the M838TQ IC motor idles at 600rpm and revs to 8500rpm). From there both drive through the main 7-speed P1 gearbox.

Note e3.

• The LaFerrari has two electric motors, EM1 and EM2.
• EM1 is the main e-motor, running at 380V, used to propel the car.
• EM2 is principally for ancillaries such as lighting and aircon.
• Both EM1 and EM2 are used for battery regen (EM2 generates all the time at a limited rate, EM1 is only on regen under braking but more power).

Car Comparison
Car	e-Motor only 0-60mph	e-Motor only vMax	e-Motor only range (Manufacturer)
Porsche 918 (Weissach)	6.1s (Note c1)	150km/h (limited)	32km
McLaren P1	? (Note c2)	>160km/h (Note c3)	10km (NEDC)
Ferrari LaFerrari	Not capable of 60mph	5km/h (limited)	9-14km at 5km/h

Note c1.

• Upgraded from 6.9s to 6.1s when the performance was restated in November 2013.

Note c2.

• Based on the power and weight, a 0-60mph time of around 7s seems reasonable [CraigyMc].

Note c3.

• Based on the power and drag, an e-Motor only vMax of around 230km/h seems reasonable [CraigyMc].

I intend to edit and update this as more info comes to light. If you know of something wrong or absent, let me know.

Useful Sources:
Laferrari HyKers Info: http://www.magnetimarelli.com/press_room/news/magn...

Edited by CraigyMc on Monday 24th February 19:30

[otolith]

bubney72 said:

It's been really bugging me that the P1 reminds me of another car, definitely Japanese. Today I've figured it out. Behold the P1 predecessor

Take more blotting paper with it.

[anonymous-user]

P1 Emachine is water cooled. Including the rotor (which is rotating at up to 18krpm.... ;-)

[CraigyMc]

Max_Torque said:

P1 Emachine is water cooled. Including the rotor (which is rotating at up to 18krpm.... ;-)

Thank you for the correction. Citation not needed.

[elephantstone]

I have never wanted a hyper car so much, its just a whole new thing.

[MC Bodge]

elephantstone said:

I have never wanted a hyper car so much, its just a whole new thing.

Drive one? Yes, given a road laws amnesty. Own one? No.

[AreOut]

maintaining these cars will be a bh for collectors...I don't think you will source these batteries so easily in 2030+