RE: Mazda MX-5: PH Heroes
Discussion
tvrolet said:
It seemed to have surprisingly little grip, and I've noticed the same on track days that even at quite modest speeds MX-5s look 'on the limit'...but she loved it, so as a car for a non-petrol-head missus I guess it was ideal.
The point, you missed it. It's all about exploring limits at lower speeds, that's why they're fun.
I notice one thing hasn't beenmentioned in this thread yet and thet's geo settings. The MX5 having all round double wishbone suspensions with good adjustment for everything is one of the most tuneable cars for geo settings. It is also quite sensitive to them being set wrong and I seem to recall reading that many came from dealers not set up that well.
Get the geo set right and they are reasonably grippy on the standard size rubber and then allow you plenty of scope for slip angle etc without firing you off into the nearest hedge.
My own MX5 is going a little above it's humble beginings as it runs much wider tyres, stiffer springs, better damping and I'm bolting a supercharger to it on Thursday. Now I'll be be able to overtake on the straights all those cars on trackdays that hold me up in the bends.
928.org240513 766.jpg by Nicholas R Horne, on Flickr
Untitled by Nicholas R Horne, on Flickr
Untitled by Nicholas R Horne, on Flickr
HorneyMX5 said:
tvrolet said:
It seemed to have surprisingly little grip, and I've noticed the same on track days that even at quite modest speeds MX-5s look 'on the limit'...but she loved it, so as a car for a non-petrol-head missus I guess it was ideal.
The point, you missed it. It's all about exploring limits at lower speeds, that's why they're fun.
Edited by bicycleshorts on Friday 21st February 11:30
This sums up the experience i have with my Car...Brands Hatch, Paddock hill bend, you get to about 90 along the straight and then have the blind right hand drop before Hailwood hill... unknown to me the clio spins infront and everything is pushing me towards it, being a driver of limited skills, i lift off and try abit of brake, the 5 just twitches her hips and tightens the line and we pass inside...no driver aids, just a well sorted chassis saves the day, any sort of spin and i'm wearing the clio.
Great little car...
Edited by Itsallicanafford on Friday 21st February 11:32
Ahh I miss mine every time I read an article or thread like this!
You can quite literally spend as little or as much as you want on one and still have more fun than anything else on the road in the respective price bracket.
I spent a fortune modifying mine and whilst it was absolutely fantastic to drive with its upgraded suspension, brakes, tyres, and supercharger, if I had another mk1 I'd probably keep it standard, aside from decent consumables like brake pads and tyres. I've learnt that you don't need to modify one to have fun, it's just the icing on the cake.
I've never driven a car with better controls and that I felt more "connected" with, like I was joined to the road, to the car's controls, cerebrally.
I'm just glad that my car's new owner, a thoroughly decent bloke, is enjoying it as much as I did.
You can quite literally spend as little or as much as you want on one and still have more fun than anything else on the road in the respective price bracket.
I spent a fortune modifying mine and whilst it was absolutely fantastic to drive with its upgraded suspension, brakes, tyres, and supercharger, if I had another mk1 I'd probably keep it standard, aside from decent consumables like brake pads and tyres. I've learnt that you don't need to modify one to have fun, it's just the icing on the cake.
I've never driven a car with better controls and that I felt more "connected" with, like I was joined to the road, to the car's controls, cerebrally.
I'm just glad that my car's new owner, a thoroughly decent bloke, is enjoying it as much as I did.
Edited by Howard- on Friday 21st February 11:26
Robert Elise said:
They do need the suspension set up correctly.
Definitely, the suspension is very adjustable which is great for setting them up the way you like them, but also means there are a multitude of things that can mess the handling up if they aren't set right.
Even in standard form I found them great fun on track, sure most things people use on track are faster on the straights but its a lot of fun showing up supposedly superior machinery in the corners. So balanced and progressive you can drive neatly or you can arse around on the lockstops, whatever you like. I never found the steering to be anything other than direct and precise, but I guess if you're comparing with an Elise it might be different.
I can see my Elise days being numbered as I get to drive a 2 seater less and less (new baby)
I will be looking for a sub £5k toy with sensible running costs.....not really sure if the MX5 has much competition in this category?
Boxster/S200 more expensive to run, Vx220/Caterfield too expensive to buy.
I will be looking for a sub £5k toy with sensible running costs.....not really sure if the MX5 has much competition in this category?
Boxster/S200 more expensive to run, Vx220/Caterfield too expensive to buy.
VladD said:
Agent Orange said:
My view is if you want a car like this do it properly and get a Caterham, Elise or VX220.
Article said:
To compare it to more hardcore cars like the Elise, VX220 or even the Honda S2000 is to miss the point. The MX-5's key strengths are all to be found - in varying measure - in every generation of the car.
I can completely get that the MX5 is a nice car but it is a compromise. It's a car you can use every day and can be a little bit of fun occasionally. However it's not very fast, it doesn't accelerate well, it doesn't sound great and whilst it's a bit of fun to flick about that gets boring pretty quickly.
If I want a fun car I want to enjoy it and it'll be a second car. That means acceleration, noise and sense of occasion. I didn't get those three things in a MX5.
Don't get me wrong. They are nice and enjoyable cars, my mother loves her MX5, but a PH Hero? A step too far for me.
Agent Orange said:
If I want a fun car I want to enjoy it and it'll be a second car. That means acceleration, noise and sense of occasion. I didn't get those three things in a MX5.
That is a fair point. I think they're a hero car because the handling is so rewarding it makes up for those faults that you correctly point out.TVR sounds a good choice for you? or a Morgan Plus 8, Noble...
Agent Orange said:
VladD said:
Agent Orange said:
My view is if you want a car like this do it properly and get a Caterham, Elise or VX220.
Article said:
To compare it to more hardcore cars like the Elise, VX220 or even the Honda S2000 is to miss the point. The MX-5's key strengths are all to be found - in varying measure - in every generation of the car.
I can completely get that the MX5 is a nice car but it is a compromise. It's a car you can use every day and can be a little bit of fun occasionally. However it's not very fast, it doesn't accelerate well, it doesn't sound great and whilst it's a bit of fun to flick about that gets boring pretty quickly.
If I want a fun car I want to enjoy it and it'll be a second car. That means acceleration, noise and sense of occasion. I didn't get those three things in a MX5.
Don't get me wrong. They are nice and enjoyable cars, my mother loves her MX5, but a PH Hero? A step too far for me.
FYI, I considered an Elise before buying my MX5, but they're not directly comparible cars. You don't consider them both with the same criteria in mind. One is cheap to buy and run, is reasonably practical and gives low speed fun, the other is more expensive to buy, less practical and takes more commitment to get it moving around. I decided I wanted to take whatever I bought to Le Mans and that I could get more in an MX5, it would be more comfotable for the wife and that for the times when I drove it on my own I wanted it to be more expolitable more of the time. Of course we're all not the same.
Edited by VladD on Friday 21st February 12:04
Agent Orange said:
See I would argue that is not the case and comparing it is absolutely valid. Not least because I actually considered an MX5 as a fun second car but ended up buying a Caterham.
That comparison depends a lot on your financial situation too - I could afford an MX5 as a second car, but not a Caterham or Elise. Especially when you consider that the cheapest Elises down here are 10x the price of the cheapest MX5s, and good Sevens aren't really that much cheaper.I'd argue that they're a PH hero car because they made genuinely great handling and involvement accessible to practically any budget, you don't have to be rich to enjoy PH-ness.
Edited by GravelBen on Friday 21st February 12:01
Cheap to buy, easy to drive sideways and reliable even after you slap a turbo on. What's not to like?
Show me another £1500 car I could drive like that for 7 years without breaking it. My E36 is falling to bits just from commuting, and neither of my Nissans could manage more than 4 months without breaking.
Thanks to Doristars.com for the pictures
Frimley111R said:
I likes our Mk2 but the rear end, with no weight over it, made it a real handful in the wet. I am surprised not more is written about that. Otherwise its a good looking, fun, reliable little car.
I had a 1.6 S.E. (black with Tan leather) Mk1 and you had to be careful of the rear end in the wet, on 'off camber' corners or if it was very cold. Ended up lowering the springs which greatly improved the grip.When they came out I was 20 and rolling in a Triumph Herald. It semed to be a 'dream' car from my perspective and when the '91 special edtion came out in BRG and tan leather, I was well and truly smitten (but still poor so I remember spending rather too many hours on a 'witty' phrase to try an win one in a Car magazine promotion at the expense of my thesis)!
Years later, I almost bought a used one but believed that I saw better value in a used Barchetta... Plenty of folk criticised that car for being FWD but to be frank, the lift-off oversteer opportunities around Highbury Corner were hilarious and I never had anything but good times in mine over 30,000 miles.
Since then, I have rented MX-5's for 4 days in total from Mazda dealers in Europe (as they occasionally offer them out cheaply to try and hook buyers) but these experiences never convinced me that the intrinsic benefits of RWD made it any more fun than my old Barchetta... I would like to try a sorted one on track though, as the platform clearly has potential and kudos to those who tweek theirs.
The MX-5 in standard road-going trim: Iconic? Almost certainly yes (based on sales volume and 'passion' shown by owners). A true PH hero?? Nothing to see here, Shirley.
Years later, I almost bought a used one but believed that I saw better value in a used Barchetta... Plenty of folk criticised that car for being FWD but to be frank, the lift-off oversteer opportunities around Highbury Corner were hilarious and I never had anything but good times in mine over 30,000 miles.
Since then, I have rented MX-5's for 4 days in total from Mazda dealers in Europe (as they occasionally offer them out cheaply to try and hook buyers) but these experiences never convinced me that the intrinsic benefits of RWD made it any more fun than my old Barchetta... I would like to try a sorted one on track though, as the platform clearly has potential and kudos to those who tweek theirs.
The MX-5 in standard road-going trim: Iconic? Almost certainly yes (based on sales volume and 'passion' shown by owners). A true PH hero?? Nothing to see here, Shirley.
Might as well jump on the band wagon. For me the love of the MX5 down to the fact I started with a very small budget. I wanted a Lotus Elise but I would have had to finance it. And we all know what you lot think of finance. So, to appease the greater PistonHeads population I bought it out right for the princely sum of £400. I have then subsequently spent a small fortune on it and got it to the spec it is today which I will summarise with, Omex ITB's, Lightened Flywheel, Gaz Shocks, 13 x 7 wheels on R888's, full cage and bucket seats.
There's a hell of a lot more to it than that but if I wrote out the spec sheet we would be here all day. Suffice to say that it's 150hp, weighs 930kg and sticks like the proverbial to a blanket.
I sodding love it.
It's also been driven by Mr Trent who quite liked it....
http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyI...
There's a hell of a lot more to it than that but if I wrote out the spec sheet we would be here all day. Suffice to say that it's 150hp, weighs 930kg and sticks like the proverbial to a blanket.
I sodding love it.
It's also been driven by Mr Trent who quite liked it....
http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyI...
g7jhp said:
Frimley111R said:
I likes our Mk2 but the rear end, with no weight over it, made it a real handful in the wet. I am surprised not more is written about that. Otherwise its a good looking, fun, reliable little car.
I had a 1.6 S.E. (black with Tan leather) Mk1 and you had to be careful of the rear end in the wet, on 'off camber' corners or if it was very cold. Ended up lowering the springs which greatly improved the grip.I must admit I'm seriously considering buying a Mk2.5 1.8S to take hillclimbing this year as a perfect car for a novice.
Plan is to run a for a season, see how much improvement myself and the car can realise without breaking the bank and then start on sensible upgrades for the following year
Plan is to run a for a season, see how much improvement myself and the car can realise without breaking the bank and then start on sensible upgrades for the following year
P-1 said:
I must admit I'm seriously considering buying a Mk2.5 1.8S to take hillclimbing this year as a perfect car for a novice.
Plan is to run a for a season, see how much improvement myself and the car can realise without breaking the bank and then start on sensible upgrades for the following year
If you are using it for just motorsport get yourself into a MK1. It would the better starting point and although the Mk1 & 2 are not dramatically different there is alot more support for the MK1. And alot more parts.Plan is to run a for a season, see how much improvement myself and the car can realise without breaking the bank and then start on sensible upgrades for the following year
GravelBen said:
g7jhp said:
Frimley111R said:
I likes our Mk2 but the rear end, with no weight over it, made it a real handful in the wet. I am surprised not more is written about that. Otherwise its a good looking, fun, reliable little car.
I had a 1.6 S.E. (black with Tan leather) Mk1 and you had to be careful of the rear end in the wet, on 'off camber' corners or if it was very cold. Ended up lowering the springs which greatly improved the grip.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff