RE: Evora S Sports Racer: Intro
Discussion
It really grinds my gears to see British not supporting a British brand. The fact of the matter is Porsche has had twenty years of your money to spend, develop and improve. Lotus have had a fraction of that support and have done and exceptional job which i wholeheartedly salute!
Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
jazzyjeff said:
All those statistics state is that Italy is a poor market for sports cars generally (although it would be interesting to include sales of Ferrari and Maserati in the same period, if available 
)
Sure, but it shows that, even in hard times, a small displacement car like a Lotus can't compete with a stronger brand. )As per your question, in the first 3 months of 2014, in Italy 350 Maserati (+821% compared with 2013!) and 72 Ferrari (+2,8%) have been sold.
Again, to put that into context, in UK, Lotus sold 256 cars in the whole 2013, just 137 cars in 2012 and 329 cars in 2011.
And UK is their biggest market, of course (data taken from http://www.rmif.co.uk/ )
Whith these numbers, you go nowhere.
Edited by Kamox on Saturday 12th April 15:01
rocketride said:
It really grinds my gears to see British not supporting a British brand. The fact of the matter is Porsche has had twenty years of your money to spend, develop and improve. Lotus have had a fraction of that support and have done and exceptional job which i wholeheartedly salute!
Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
The engine failed on the Porsche tank .......hmm I'm starting to see a pattern Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
....Edited by blueg33 on Saturday 12th April 15:34
Lotus got so much RIGHT when they developed the original Elise. Amongst other things it brought sales of the Renault Spider Sport to an immediate halt and Lotus simply owned the sector for years.
It's a real shame IMO they never followed up with a bigger, more comfortable V6 brother for Elise at c.£45k.
Occasionally Lotus get a road car right. Let's hope the next one is soon.
It's a real shame IMO they never followed up with a bigger, more comfortable V6 brother for Elise at c.£45k.
Occasionally Lotus get a road car right. Let's hope the next one is soon.
rocketride said:
It really grinds my gears to see British not supporting a British brand. The fact of the matter is Porsche has had twenty years of your money to spend, develop and improve. Lotus have had a fraction of that support and have done and exceptional job which i wholeheartedly salute!
Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
A very unfashionable view but one I share completely. I often wish I shared the remarkable ambivalence of most UK car buyers. But I'm stuck with an outmoded inclination to support the few remaining sportscar brands that build in the UK.Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
I happen to believe the cars that McLaren, Lotus, Aston Martin and Jaguar build are absolute proof of the exceptional design and engineering talent we have in the UK. And that is precisely why it's so sad that it doesn't attract more domestic support, it would be a huge loss if any more British brands go the way of TVR. But if Porsche owners were merely ambivalent about where their car is made that would be one thing, but to sneer and mock British people who want to support what's left of our car industry is hard to stomach.
Most British buyers don't 'get' the new Exige V6 at all. I suppose they don't consider it a proper car, just a toy like a Caterham. But those that do are almost universally amazed by the excellence of the product. I don't know any other car company in the world who could make such a responsive car so confidence inspiring. The Evora doesn't even make it onto the consideration list for the vast majority. But in this instance, their negative associations with british manufacturers means they're missing out. But I have and it remains the car I would most like to own for everyday use.
rocketride said:
It really grinds my gears to see British not supporting a British brand. The fact of the matter is Porsche has had twenty years of your money to spend, develop and improve. Lotus have had a fraction of that support and have done and exceptional job which i wholeheartedly salute!
I'd take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
I wonder how much allowance Lotus expect their customers to make for their lack of development resources. In the 50s and 60s when Porsche were making only a few thousand cars a year they managed to both sell fully resolved products, develop a replacement, and fund a world class competition effort. I'd take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Buy British
BTW Lotus' current owners were shooting at my old man 50 years ago, a point I feel equally relevant.
SS7
Kamox said:
Again, to put that into context, in UK, Lotus sold 256 cars in the whole 2013, just 137 cars in 2012 and 329 cars in 2011.
And UK is their biggest market, of course (data taken from http://www.rmif.co.uk/ )
Whith these numbers, you go nowhere.
Lotus currently export around 80% of their output. Figures from the end of January show Hethel made about 40 cars per week and the lead time for a new car is around four months. They made 1368 cars in 2013.And UK is their biggest market, of course (data taken from http://www.rmif.co.uk/ )
Whith these numbers, you go nowhere.
Still not enough, but not as doom laden as some may suggest.
shoestring7 said:
I wonder how much allowance Lotus expect their customers to make for their lack of development resources. In the 50s and 60s when Porsche were making only a few thousand cars a year they managed to both sell fully resolved products, develop a replacement, and a German Government funded world class competition effort.
I've edited that for you Oilchange said:
Were we at war with Malaysia? My history is pants, was it a communist insurgent uprising or something?
No we weren't, it was ethnic Chinese communists trying to overthrow the Malaysian government during the independence handover. You aren't the only one here whose history is pants.
Oilchange said:
More about perspective really, when you get a government behind a sportscar brand with decades of investment and protectionism put up against a privateer with an old WW2 airfield, a few groats and a bright idea... well you get the gist.
I do get the gist, but actually I was referring to rocketride's strange way of seeing things, nearly 70 years after the end of WW2, rather than the merits of governments sponsoring motorsport:rocketride said:
Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
Nohedes said:
Oilchange said:
More about perspective really, when you get a government behind a sportscar brand with decades of investment and protectionism put up against a privateer with an old WW2 airfield, a few groats and a bright idea... well you get the gist.
I do get the gist, but actually I was referring to rocketride's strange way of seeing things, nearly 70 years after the end of WW2, rather than the merits of governments sponsoring motorsport:rocketride said:
Id take a Lotus over Porsche any day of the week plus the fact i at least know that lotus didn't make tanks to fire 88mm shells at my ancestors.
i've never been a porsche fan, my first car was an elise, i had it for 10 years, i thought it was amazing, until i started owning other cars
logically i should be the ideal customer for lotus, i spend a lot on cars, i like my cars, i've become more affluent as i've got older, i should be the perfect person for them to sell this to
but i'd rather hand back my licence then ever give lotus any more money, they need to learn about customer service, they need to leaner how test a car for the real world and not for just when it's new. A car that just crosses the finishing line and then collapses may be acceptable on a race track, it's not acceptable in a road car if you're rude and tell you're previous customers to get stuffed, they will do the same when you try and sell
at this price the competition is serious, you can't get away a car that resembles a parts bin car
it also looks kind of weird, where as the present cayman looks great and the f-type amazing
sorry this is way to expensive, even if it was made by someone else it would be too expensive for what it is, knowing it's made by lotus and comes with lotus backing and lotus quality it's a no brainer
logically i should be the ideal customer for lotus, i spend a lot on cars, i like my cars, i've become more affluent as i've got older, i should be the perfect person for them to sell this to
but i'd rather hand back my licence then ever give lotus any more money, they need to learn about customer service, they need to leaner how test a car for the real world and not for just when it's new. A car that just crosses the finishing line and then collapses may be acceptable on a race track, it's not acceptable in a road car if you're rude and tell you're previous customers to get stuffed, they will do the same when you try and sell
at this price the competition is serious, you can't get away a car that resembles a parts bin car
it also looks kind of weird, where as the present cayman looks great and the f-type amazing
sorry this is way to expensive, even if it was made by someone else it would be too expensive for what it is, knowing it's made by lotus and comes with lotus backing and lotus quality it's a no brainer
ravon said:
The fact that "The Wookie" has such an excellent pedigree as a racing driver, and working in the industry , developing cars, makes me think that my views on the engine position of the Evora being a handicap must we wrong, but I still feel, development money/cost no object Lotus would never go for an axle mounted rear engine over a proper transaxle layout, would this be a fair assessment ?
More pedigree chum than pedigree, I spent most of my time there on Chinese things 
The engine position isn't great but it isn't as big a deal as it's made out to be. However the Evora has a lot of things going for it, apart from the engine the bulk of the mass is very low in the car.
I very much doubt they'd choose a rear engined layout, but it does say a lot that they've more than matched Porsche with the Cayman, both in terms of the skill of the guys there and making the best of what they could use with the packaging
rocketride said:
shoestring7 said:
I wonder how much allowance Lotus expect their customers to make for their lack of development resources. In the 50s and 60s when Porsche were making only a few thousand cars a year they managed to both sell fully resolved products, develop a replacement, and a German Government funded world class competition effort.
I've edited that for you SS7
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