A cyclist and tax question
Discussion
kambites said:
I believe you can already get points on your driving licence for breaking the rules of the road on/in unlicenced vehicles. Strictly speaking, you can probably get banned from driving for walking along a road while drunk. 
Reminded of this: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110106/0355081...
Snowboy said:
I think that's nonsense.
There are a few quite vocal people who rant about tax, but the majority of PH and people in general don't use that argument.
For my sins I've been on PH for a lot longer than you, and can tell you that the (non-existent) issue of road tax has come up time and time again. It goes way beyond that though, for instance if you put 'road tax' into the search on youtube you'll get lots of results.There are a few quite vocal people who rant about tax, but the majority of PH and people in general don't use that argument.
Stuff like this gem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UiWji4osR0 where a car drove into a person in broad daylight - viewers phone in not to express surprise and anger at such appalling driving, and how long will it be before the driver kills etc, but instead phone in to address an issue of tax.
I can't think of any other subject (apart from directly addressing issues of tax) whereby tax forms such a major part of a discussion. I doubt the topic arises anywhere else in the world, so I think it is fair and honest to say that the average UK driver has an obsession going on with tax when it comes to cyclists.
Only yesterday this sort of nonsense was going on in PH:
Mr SFJ said:
Also, if they were to pay their way a little more on the roads, perhaps car drivers might give them a little extra room, as they're also paying for the upkeep? And in return, and Cyclists will use cycle lanes where provided?
That, to me, is fair.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/post.asp?h=0&f=23&t=1397785&r=28358959&m=quoteOne&mid=26635That, to me, is fair.
"If they were to pay a little more on the roads, perhaps car drivers might give them a little extra room, as they're also paying for the upkeep?" - he can't have any idea what they're paying in the first place, but somehow feels that because they own a bicycle they're somehow paying less - presumably less than himself - and he feels that he is somehow paying for the upkeep of the roads?.
(I don't wish to appear harsh on MR SFJ - his comments are entirely typical of what I've seen in my time on PH).
So i've been exploring the notion of how is it possible that the ownership of a bicycle can somehow convey the notion that less tax is being paid, (it's something that only applies to bicycles and not any other possession, surely?) and used two well known motorists, who are known also to be keen cyclists, to portray the utter absurdity of this thinking.
Have I got this wrong?
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
calibrax said:
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
"Simply"? You mean simply introduce a massive, expensive bureaucratic exercise which will achieve precisely nothing other than reduce the numbers of cyclists and thus reduce their safety, and put more cars on the road (which surveys have shown jump red lights to much the same degree)? 
heebeegeetee said:
calibrax said:
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
"Simply"? You mean simply introduce a massive, expensive bureaucratic exercise which will achieve precisely nothing other than reduce the numbers of cyclists and thus reduce their safety, and put more cars on the road (which surveys have shown jump red lights to much the same degree)? These days I've not used my bike for almost a year. Should I have SORNed it?
Impasse said:
heebeegeetee said:
calibrax said:
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
"Simply"? You mean simply introduce a massive, expensive bureaucratic exercise which will achieve precisely nothing other than reduce the numbers of cyclists and thus reduce their safety, and put more cars on the road (which surveys have shown jump red lights to much the same degree)? These days I've not used my bike for almost a year. Should I have SORNed it?
I get taxed everyday with my bike..... it is taxing on me having to cycle, i get out of breath and sweaty and tired
roadman said:
As long as you keep your cycling Cycling Proficiency Test in your wallet where it can be inspected upon request I dont think there will be a problem.
Sod that. I don't keep my driving licence in my wallet so am unlikely to do the same with much else. What my post was getting at was that education is the key to safer roads for everyone. If that education is started young (say when people are just starting to understand the joys of the independence of a set of wheels) then it may be possible to instill a degree of road awareness across a future generation.Yay,let's introduce VED for cyclists so hundreds of civil servants can be employed to run expensive computer systems to issue paperwork to millions of cyclists to show they don't need to pay anything. It'd help with unemployment but would probably need to raise the VED on cars to pay for it.
calibrax said:
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
Most car drivers are trained, have licenses, and regularly break the law. Why would imposing the same rules on cyclists have any different effect?And should a cyclist receive the same penalty as a car driver for the same misbehaviour when the third party consequences of that misbehaviour are significantly less severe?
calibrax said:
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
My 4 year old's driving licence doesn't have room for an extra category though.It is already too full with her Teddy Bear Doctor's licence and I Spy: Category 3.
I love these threads. It really helps justify my already rock-bottom opinions on the intellect of the average human.
It will be a cold day in hell when morons realise that vehicles that offer almost no danger or risk to other road users need to be treated differently - but I still look forward to it.
calibrax said:
No need for a tax. Simply make cycling a category on a driving licence that you have to pass a separate test for, i.e. like motorcycling. That way cyclists will all be trained, and will have no excuse for jumping red lights etc - and they can receive the same penalties as car drivers for misbehaviour.
Could we have an internet licence?It's posts like these that give me hope. I mean most days I sit staring blankly at the screens in front of me wondering where it all went wrong. Reading things like this make me feel so much better, life is so much more challenging for some
Feel free to tax my bikes and make sure to tax each one in the highest emission band possible, that'll be change from £0.00 if my calculations are correct. Then check my insurance, I pay about £80 a month for two bikes IIRC and my BC membership covers me for any damage I may make to your car if you run me over, something which I will apologize in advance for.
In fact can we double the tax across all vehicles and put in on fuel. My 9 mile commute to work won't be affected much but the people who actually use the roads to the greatest extent will pick up the tab.
will_ said:
Just think about how stupid the average person is.
Then remember that half the population are more stupid than that.
The think of jimbop1.
And then think a few of them are pro cyclists, anti everything else, the world revolves around us types...such as yourself and a couple of others that post in every cycle related thread and have to turn to insults when anything they don't agree with is said. Then remember that half the population are more stupid than that.
The think of jimbop1.
jimbop1 said:
And then think a few of them are pro cyclists, anti everything else, the world revolves around us types...such as yourself and a couple of others that post in every cycle related thread and have to turn to insults when anything they don't agree with is said.
Wrong.Consistent, but wrong.
Do you think I'm on PH because I'm "anti everyting else"?
You don't say anything of value - you just endlessly troll.
If you added anything constructive you might learn something. But I think you're genuinely incapable of rational argument based on evidence and don't have any interest in learning about anything that is different to you and your prejudiced, hateful views.
jimbop1 said:
And then think a few of them are pro cyclists, anti everything else, the world revolves around us types...such as yourself and a couple of others that post in every cycle related thread and have to turn to insults when anything they don't agree with is said.
You troll every cycling thread. It's almost a religion for you.Gassing Station | Pedal Powered | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff