Unsafe Mods - Extreme Dubs / Drifters / Stance etc.
Discussion
StottyEvo said:
binge said:
Stuff...
Regards
Ben
Regards
Ben
brilliant post. A lot of the old grumpy PHeders will be scrathing their heads at this one.The dub scene is not for me at all, but a few are my friends are very involved in it. And the lengths they go to (similar to yours) to achieve the look is astounding. I often ask why they don't use their skills to make something... decent (IMO of course) but they aren't interested.
More about the asthetics than performance, which is why cars/vans like these get such a negative response on PH (who are more about performance than asthetics)
It seems Ph has a lot of people that don't appreciate some people want to be individual which begs the question as to why they are on ph as it was born from the modifying scene big bodykits & all!!!
While not being a stance guy every car I've ever owned gets a 30mm drop & rims etc just because I don't want it to look the same as everyone elses.
Nothing wrong with running 4Deg -ve camber.. Touring Cars run 6Deg (or more) and I ran 3Deg on my track car for a long time. I think there's an important distinction to be drawn between that and people running 10Deg, 15Deg and so on, because you start to get rapidly diminishing performance in both braking / accel and cornering and it just isn't safe. Fair enough if you trailer it to a show and it never moves under it's own power, but not ok for use on the roads.
doogz said:
ZX10R NIN said:
Great post I did ask him how many normal cars he fails everyday but he failed to respond I doubt he'll respond to your post.
It seems Ph has a lot of people that don't appreciate some people want to be individual which begs the question as to why they are on ph as it was born from the modifying scene big bodykits & all!!!
While not being a stance guy every car I've ever owned gets a 30mm drop & rims etc just because I don't want it to look the same as everyone elses.
It was?It seems Ph has a lot of people that don't appreciate some people want to be individual which begs the question as to why they are on ph as it was born from the modifying scene big bodykits & all!!!
While not being a stance guy every car I've ever owned gets a 30mm drop & rims etc just because I don't want it to look the same as everyone elses.
See what I did there...
Bradley1500 said:
GregK2 said:
austinsmirk said:
there was a lad in a white golf on BBC traffic cops a few months ago, who had a stanced, slopey wheels set up.
they waited for him in some precinct to return to his car and then nabbed him.
he has his mum with him I think, or it was his mums new golf that she'd allowed to be customised. Purely as I don't think an 18 yr old was likely to be running his own brand new golf !
It was a Polo, with hydraulic adjustable suspension and he got done because he was driving with it at a dangerously low level (evidence the alloy rim had been making contact with the body) If he'd just flicked a switch before driving off the Police wouldn't have been able to do anything.they waited for him in some precinct to return to his car and then nabbed him.
he has his mum with him I think, or it was his mums new golf that she'd allowed to be customised. Purely as I don't think an 18 yr old was likely to be running his own brand new golf !
The tyre/rim contact on the bodywork was from lowering the car upon parking as the 'fitment' was tight enough for each to catch slightly. It went to court and there wasn't sufficient evidence for him to be prosecuted.
Cars which are not modified owned by non-car enthusiasts are potentially far more dangerous from poor or no maintenance. Someone with a modified car is a car enthusiast - whatever their taste and style may be - so are far more likely to keep up to date with general maintenance.
I run stretched tyres on my Polo so will regularly and before every non local journey check the tyre pressures. This is to keep me, my car and other road-user safe.
I'm sure the police could clear most of the crap off our roads by checking if they are correctly insured, which I would bet my left nut on, won't be.
The angled wheels are a prime example, less grip and over stressing the tyre in a manner the manufacturer never intended, not safe, not clever, and looks s
t.Gary C said:
Bradley1500 said:
GregK2 said:
austinsmirk said:
there was a lad in a white golf on BBC traffic cops a few months ago, who had a stanced, slopey wheels set up.
they waited for him in some precinct to return to his car and then nabbed him.
he has his mum with him I think, or it was his mums new golf that she'd allowed to be customised. Purely as I don't think an 18 yr old was likely to be running his own brand new golf !
It was a Polo, with hydraulic adjustable suspension and he got done because he was driving with it at a dangerously low level (evidence the alloy rim had been making contact with the body) If he'd just flicked a switch before driving off the Police wouldn't have been able to do anything.they waited for him in some precinct to return to his car and then nabbed him.
he has his mum with him I think, or it was his mums new golf that she'd allowed to be customised. Purely as I don't think an 18 yr old was likely to be running his own brand new golf !
The tyre/rim contact on the bodywork was from lowering the car upon parking as the 'fitment' was tight enough for each to catch slightly. It went to court and there wasn't sufficient evidence for him to be prosecuted.
Cars which are not modified owned by non-car enthusiasts are potentially far more dangerous from poor or no maintenance. Someone with a modified car is a car enthusiast - whatever their taste and style may be - so are far more likely to keep up to date with general maintenance.
I run stretched tyres on my Polo so will regularly and before every non local journey check the tyre pressures. This is to keep me, my car and other road-user safe.
I'm sure the police could clear most of the crap off our roads by checking if they are correctly insured, which I would bet my left nut on, won't be.
The angled wheels are a prime example, less grip and over stressing the tyre in a manner the manufacturer never intended, not safe, not clever, and looks s
t.StottyEvo said:
More about the asthetics than performance, which is why cars/vans like these get such a negative response on PH (who are more about performance than asthetics)
Most of the negatives are not about cars like the chap above's van, which appears to have a moderate amount of camber and approximately the correct tyres. Not my taste but it looks decently engineered.It's about the nobbers with their wheels at a 45 degree angle and tyres 2 inches too narrow for their wheels.
Mikeyplum said:
Gary C said:
The angled wheels are a prime example, less grip and over stressing the tyre in a manner the manufacturer never intended, not safe, not clever, and looks st.
In your opinion... t.But can I also presume that the rest of Gary's statement is not something that you're disagreeing with? We're all happy to agree on those?
To what point, then, should subjective cosmetic fashion be protected in law as a priority over those other aspects?
TooMany2cvs said:
Mikeyplum said:
Gary C said:
The angled wheels are a prime example, less grip and over stressing the tyre in a manner the manufacturer never intended, not safe, not clever, and looks st.
In your opinion... t.But can I also presume that the rest of Gary's statement is not something that you're disagreeing with? We're all happy to agree on those?
To what point, then, should subjective cosmetic fashion be protected in law as a priority over those other aspects?
Mikeyplum said:
Gary C said:
Bradley1500 said:
GregK2 said:
austinsmirk said:
there was a lad in a white golf on BBC traffic cops a few months ago, who had a stanced, slopey wheels set up.
they waited for him in some precinct to return to his car and then nabbed him.
he has his mum with him I think, or it was his mums new golf that she'd allowed to be customised. Purely as I don't think an 18 yr old was likely to be running his own brand new golf !
It was a Polo, with hydraulic adjustable suspension and he got done because he was driving with it at a dangerously low level (evidence the alloy rim had been making contact with the body) If he'd just flicked a switch before driving off the Police wouldn't have been able to do anything.they waited for him in some precinct to return to his car and then nabbed him.
he has his mum with him I think, or it was his mums new golf that she'd allowed to be customised. Purely as I don't think an 18 yr old was likely to be running his own brand new golf !
The tyre/rim contact on the bodywork was from lowering the car upon parking as the 'fitment' was tight enough for each to catch slightly. It went to court and there wasn't sufficient evidence for him to be prosecuted.
Cars which are not modified owned by non-car enthusiasts are potentially far more dangerous from poor or no maintenance. Someone with a modified car is a car enthusiast - whatever their taste and style may be - so are far more likely to keep up to date with general maintenance.
I run stretched tyres on my Polo so will regularly and before every non local journey check the tyre pressures. This is to keep me, my car and other road-user safe.
I'm sure the police could clear most of the crap off our roads by checking if they are correctly insured, which I would bet my left nut on, won't be.
The angled wheels are a prime example, less grip and over stressing the tyre in a manner the manufacturer never intended, not safe, not clever, and looks s
t.And yes, all my modifications are above board and insured correctly. Coilovers listed, non-standard wheels listed and interior retrim listed. The insurance company had no problem with any of these modifications.
As for cambered wheels, my friend runs camber shims to camber his wheels. He states he's fitted camber shims to his insurance company and they ask no other questions.
I think a lot of this comes down to ignorance of people simply not understanding how these cars are modified.
TooMany2cvs said:
Mikeyplum said:
Gary C said:
The angled wheels are a prime example, less grip and over stressing the tyre in a manner the manufacturer never intended, not safe, not clever, and looks st.
In your opinion... t.But can I also presume that the rest of Gary's statement is not something that you're disagreeing with? We're all happy to agree on those?
To what point, then, should subjective cosmetic fashion be protected in law as a priority over those other aspects?
I disagree that they all look s
t.Which they don't, IMO. One man's meat and all that. The first part of his sentence could be read that he was stating (arguably) fact. It annoyed me that he also tried passing off the "it looks s
t" as fact also. Which it isn't. So there :Pandy_s said:
Bradley1500 said:
I think a lot of this comes down to ignorance of people simply not understanding how these cars are modified.
Who - the insurance companies?HorneyMX5 said:
andy_s said:
Bradley1500 said:
I think a lot of this comes down to ignorance of people simply not understanding how these cars are modified.
Who - the insurance companies?My Golf GTI once its back on the road will be fully declared with an agreed value. If the worse happens and I'm involved in an accident I don't want to be getting book value for the car as it will be substantially less than what has been put into the car.
Bradley1500 said:
I think a lot of this comes down to ignorance of people simply not understanding how these cars are modified.
The problem is that you aren't speaking for all of them.For every well-done car that's running air and a reasonable level of camber to make it actually road-worthy, there's at least one bodge. It's pretty much always been the way with modified cars that for every one done well, there are multiple ones done badly that try and achieve the same look on the cheap.
Building a car which looks like some of those in this thread in such a way that it is actually road-worthy is expensive. A similar look can be achieved on the cheap. Remember a few years ago, the trend for fitting wobble bolts instead of re-drilling hubs with the proper PCD to mount wheels designed for different marques? The same is true here. Claiming that all cars of this nature are safe purely because some of the better-publicised examples have numerous fail-safes and proper engineering solutions built in ignores the fact that there's always been a proportion of the modifying scene who have been all too eager to just cheap out and then cheat the system to get their cars back on the road. You only need a cursory look at the "still an **** on the log book" thread to see how common third-rate, undeclared and poorly executed engine transplants are in the modifying community, why would people running large degrees of camber be any different?
As an aside, the fact that people can't point to a single incident that's directly resulted in an accident because of these dangerous modifications does not make any less dangerous. To me that's like claiming that a decommissioned machine pistol that's been converted in a back-street machine shop to fire again isn't dangerous because no-one has been shot with it yet.
Edited by ManOpener on Friday 13th June 12:21
My EP3 is lowered 30mm on Eibach springs. Any lower (not that I would go any lower as it really knackers the EP3) than 50mm and Admiral won't cover it.
I'm big into the modifying scene, and I haven't actually owned a non modified car yet. The whole "stance scene" in the UK makes me cringe. The cars can look pretty suave, no doubt, but as with everything there's that little niche group that give everyone else a bad rep. Often commonly seen wearing womens jeans, new ear hats at vertical 90 degrees, and a body mass index that makes the average Ethiopian look like Rick Waller. To me, "stance" means changing the wheels for some that fill the arches nicely which is often a by product of fitting wider, stickier rubber, and lowering it slightly to make it look purposeful, not fitting the most ridiculous wheels possible and putting it on air ride.
For example, this MR2 has nice stance.
This is st
[/2p]
I'm big into the modifying scene, and I haven't actually owned a non modified car yet. The whole "stance scene" in the UK makes me cringe. The cars can look pretty suave, no doubt, but as with everything there's that little niche group that give everyone else a bad rep. Often commonly seen wearing womens jeans, new ear hats at vertical 90 degrees, and a body mass index that makes the average Ethiopian look like Rick Waller. To me, "stance" means changing the wheels for some that fill the arches nicely which is often a by product of fitting wider, stickier rubber, and lowering it slightly to make it look purposeful, not fitting the most ridiculous wheels possible and putting it on air ride.
For example, this MR2 has nice stance.
This is s
t[/2p]
ManOpener said:
Blah, blah, blah.... Remember a few years ago, the trend for fitting wobble bolts instead of re-drilling hubs with the proper PCD to mount wheels designed for different marques? .... blah, blah, blah.
What's wrong with wobble bolts?Edited by ManOpener on Friday 13th June 12:21
ManOpener said:
Remember a few years ago, the trend for fitting wobble bolts instead of re-drilling hubs with the proper PCD to mount wheels designed for different marques? The same is true here.
Are you saying "wobbley" bolts are unsafe? That's just not true. They are designed to convert oddball patterns like 4x98, 5x98 to more sensible 4x100 and 5x100 etc. They are perfectly safe and perfectly legal. This thread is just getting silly. Tyre stretch, camber and lows can all be done in a completely legal way and result in a perfectly drive able and road worthy car. The opposite is also true. Some people like it, some don't. It's that simple.
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