Did This Guy Really Drive On The Track During A Live Race?

[nitrodave]

TVRJAS said:

nitrodave said:

but ultimately there was no harm caused and he just misjudged the severity of what he was doing.

Hello nitroDave,

No harm to you or I... But what about the drivers involved in the race that had spent hours preparing their cars,over two hours of racing and then this stunt by the Muppet destroys the whole event.

If you were one of the drivers involved I'm pretty sure you would have a different opinion. If I'm wrong and it wouldn't of harmed or ruined your day then we live different life's.

Just to point out.
Because reading text is so different to actual conversation then don't read it in an anger approach,I'm simply saying "yeah but it would be different if you were racing"

i hear you brother when i say no harm done, nobody was actually injured, he didn't go out there intending to harm anyone by say... driving the wrong way round the track nor did was it a public highway so certainly no pedestrians about to step out.

from a racers perspective harm was done, but from a spectator point of view it seems he caused financial and time loss to guys like yourself.

don't get me wrong he messed up big time and inconvenienced many people but he was quite a way off from putting lives at risk

[Vaud]

nitrodave said:

don't get me wrong he messed up big time and inconvenienced many people but he was quite a way off from putting lives at risk

How about the lack of safety gear and speed differential, where a car at racing speed, and with appropriate safety protection could have hit this car which had no such kit? He absolutely put his passengers at risk, in a car that wasn't his and with a heavily protesting passenger.

Not a long way off at all.

[TVRJAS]

nitrodave said:

i hear you brother when i say no harm done, nobody was actually injured, he didn't go out there intending to harm anyone by say... driving the wrong way round the track nor did was it a public highway so certainly no pedestrians about to step out.

from a racers perspective harm was done, but from a spectator point of view it seems he caused financial and time loss to guys like yourself.

don't get me wrong he messed up big time and inconvenienced many people but he was quite a way off from putting lives at risk

I hear you back

Vaud has replied with my But question.

[nitrodave]

fair point i hadn't considered that he had passengers and their lives were put at risk because of his stupidity.

It just grinds my gears a little that he gets 8 months for this when just a few weeks back in court I a saw an unemployed migrant who lives in a gratis flat in belgravia, claims hundreds in benefits getting off with a £200 fine payable over 5 months for smashing a guys face in.

[T0MMY]

It saddens me that so many people are saying Brands has to share the blame for this. If someone had been able to accidentally drive onto the track then sure, that's a genuine failing of the organisers, but this guy did it deliberately.

This is about personal responsibility; you can't completely stop people doing stupid things and nor should you have to or be responsible for the consequences when they do. How hard would it be to stop someone on foot gaining access anywhere round the several-mile perimeter of a race track to run onto the tarmac and get themselves killed? Do we really want to restrict all activities to the extent that no one can hurt themselves no matter how hard they try?

[GSE]

T0MMY said:

It saddens me that so many people are saying Brands has to share the blame for this. If someone had been able to accidentally drive onto the track then sure, that's a genuine failing of the organisers, but this guy did it deliberately

Exactly. Brands should not take any blame whatsoever for this incident. It is Cottle who is solely responsible. If Brand or other racetracks are forced to take action to cater for pillocks like Cottle, then they might as well tell everyone to go home and watch the race on TV.

[T0MMY]

GSE said:

Exactly. Brands should not take any blame whatsoever for this incident. It is Cottle who is solely responsible. If Brand or other racetracks are forced to take action to cater for pillocks like Cottle, then they might as well tell everyone to go home and watch the race on TV.

Yep...in fact if you take this to the extreme, the only practical way to stop someone hurting themselves at a race event no matter how hard they try to do so would be to not run the event.

[madbadger]

T0MMY said:

GSE said:

Exactly. Brands should not take any blame whatsoever for this incident. It is Cottle who is solely responsible. If Brand or other racetracks are forced to take action to cater for pillocks like Cottle, then they might as well tell everyone to go home and watch the race on TV.

Yep...in fact if you take this to the extreme, the only practical way to stop someone hurting themselves at a race event no matter how hard they try to do so would be to not run the event.

If you bar the pits and only allow pit bikes in then you will end up with some muppet trying to do a hot lap on a pit bike.

[T0MMY]

madbadger said:

If you bar the pits and only allow pit bikes in then you will end up with some muppet trying to do a hot lap on a pit bike.

And if you banned pitbikes someone could run out onto the track!

Thinking about trackdays, how could you mitigate against some tit booking on properly then pulling a u-turn as they join the track and going the wrong way for a lap, just for the facebook video notoriety? The possibilities for being a prat are endless.

[egor110]

GSE said:

T0MMY said:

It saddens me that so many people are saying Brands has to share the blame for this. If someone had been able to accidentally drive onto the track then sure, that's a genuine failing of the organisers, but this guy did it deliberately

Exactly. Brands should not take any blame whatsoever for this incident. It is Cottle who is solely responsible. If Brand or other racetracks are forced to take action to cater for pillocks like Cottle, then they might as well tell everyone to go home and watch the race on TV.

Brands does take action though at the big national series, no way he'd even of got that car in the pit lane at bsb/btcc.

I guess it all comes down to cost though.

[T0MMY]

egor110 said:

Brands does take action though at the big national series, no way he'd even of got that car in the pit lane at bsb/btcc.

I guess it all comes down to cost though.

I guess they have to worry about protestors etc. at a big televised event so the risk is that much higher, as is the income available to mitigate that risk.

[MiniBeej]

egor110 said:

GSE said:

T0MMY said:

It saddens me that so many people are saying Brands has to share the blame for this. If someone had been able to accidentally drive onto the track then sure, that's a genuine failing of the organisers, but this guy did it deliberately

Exactly. Brands should not take any blame whatsoever for this incident. It is Cottle who is solely responsible. If Brand or other racetracks are forced to take action to cater for pillocks like Cottle, then they might as well tell everyone to go home and watch the race on TV.

Brands does take action though at the big national series, no way he'd even of got that car in the pit lane at bsb/btcc.

I guess it all comes down to cost though.

2 reasons why this is the case;
1. Cost (as you said) and...
2. The people that attend club level race days are normally 'die-hard' race fans and are normally outnumbered by marshals and people directly involved with the racing. The odds of having such a dick in the small number of speccies on a club day is tiny. As with anything, if you save just 1 life then it's worth any cost but in reality it isn't practical.

[rallycross]

slightly different version of events reported here

http://sniffpetrol.com/2014/11/18/brands-hatch-idi...

[Clivey]

T0MMY said:

And if you banned pitbikes someone could run out onto the track!

Thinking about trackdays, how could you mitigate against some tit booking on properly then pulling a u-turn as they join the track and going the wrong way for a lap, just for the facebook video notoriety? The possibilities for being a prat are endless.

Exactly; which is why we should not expect to be able to physically prevent every possible scenario. It'd be like the authorities attempting to make it physically impossible to assault someone. - Even if you wrapped us all in cotton wool, someone would still get pushed into a fire / off a rooftop etc. etc.

[Simond S]

You have to feel sorry for the lad. He did a prank that harmed no one, disrupted a few racing drivers, but has been punished for a crime far worse.

In reality the race could have pause when he pulled into the pits, a rolling start and t he race continues.

His speed wasn't that different to the racers speeds, they had ample time to see him and avoid (as they all managed to do)

I'm personally shocked at the holier than thou attitude that drivers and their cronies have come out with, in the old days this would have been seen as a juvinile prank and punished as such.

Just because he isn't deemed worthy yet it doesn't mean he isn't going to be a valuable asset to a company one day, aside from all the goatie wearing multi directorship types on here many people develop late and have strong careers. Community service would have been a much better punishment.

[With these feet]

Simond S said:

You have to feel sorry for the lad. He did a prank that harmed no one, disrupted a few racing drivers, but has been punished for a crime far worse.

In reality the race could have pause when he pulled into the pits, a rolling start and t he race continues.

His speed wasn't that different to the racers speeds, they had ample time to see him and avoid (as they all managed to do)

I'm personally shocked at the holier than thou attitude that drivers and their cronies have come out with, in the old days this would have been seen as a juvinile prank and punished as such.

Just because he isn't deemed worthy yet it doesn't mean he isn't going to be a valuable asset to a company one day, aside from all the goatie wearing multi directorship types on here many people develop late and have strong careers. Community service would have been a much better punishment.


Maybe he had a poor upbringing and needs a holiday? Give me a break, the kid drove onto a live circuit. What if it were a train track or the wrong way round the M25? Still "high jinks" or a jolly jape?


Kid acts like a tt, gets caught, acts the big jack the lad and unfortunately for him comes up against a beak that understands the disruption and cost of what he did.

[The Surveyor]

Simond S said:

You have to feel sorry for the lad. He did a prank that harmed no one, disrupted a few racing drivers, but has been punished for a crime far worse.

In reality the race could have pause when he pulled into the pits, a rolling start and t he race continues.

His speed wasn't that different to the racers speeds, they had ample time to see him and avoid (as they all managed to do)

I'm personally shocked at the holier than thou attitude that drivers and their cronies have come out with, in the old days this would have been seen as a juvinile prank and punished as such.

Just because he isn't deemed worthy yet it doesn't mean he isn't going to be a valuable asset to a company one day, aside from all the goatie wearing multi directorship types on here many people develop late and have strong careers. Community service would have been a much better punishment.

Feel free to feel sorry for him and mourn the loss of his future contribution to society. Another view is that he was a prat who not only did an idiotic thing endangering his passengers and the racers on the track for no other reason than a juvenile prank, but that he also showed no appreciation of magnitude of his stupidity and went on to brag about it. Sometimes these Teflon tracksuit wearing d*ckheads need a little tough-love to stop them going through life thinking they are above the law. Fair sentence IMHO

[xRIEx]

Simond S said:

Just because he isn't deemed worthy yet it doesn't mean he isn't going to be a valuable asset to a company one day, aside from all the goatie wearing multi directorship types on here many people develop late and have strong careers. Community service would have been a much better punishment.

Maybe this is a wake up call to him to stop being such an "everything is someone else's fault" imbecile and will now be a more valued asset than he would otherwise have been.

[teamHOLDENracing]

Simond S said:

You have to feel sorry for the lad. He did a prank that harmed no one, disrupted a few racing drivers, but has been punished for a crime far worse.

In reality the race could have pause when he pulled into the pits, a rolling start and t he race continues.

His speed wasn't that different to the racers speeds, they had ample time to see him and avoid (as they all managed to do)

I'm personally shocked at the holier than thou attitude that drivers and their cronies have come out with, in the old days this would have been seen as a juvinile prank and punished as such.

Just because he isn't deemed worthy yet it doesn't mean he isn't going to be a valuable asset to a company one day, aside from all the goatie wearing multi directorship types on here many people develop late and have strong careers. Community service would have been a much better punishment.

I am a driver and team manager of one of the cars in the affected race and I don’t feel sorry for the lad. He did something that had potential consequences beyond his comprehension – including his current incarceration.

I agree that as things turned out no-one was hurt, but why was that? Fun Cup is almost unique in that all drivers are connected to race control with one way radios and the clerk of the course can communicate to all drivers instantaneously. The moment that Cottle drove onto the track the race was neutralised and all the drivers slowed. This was the reason that the speed differential was not apparent. Any other race would have relied upon flags and these cannot be deployed as quickly. Cottle was also fortunate that he happened to join the track in a gap in traffic - it is not uncommon for Fun Cup cars to go through Paddock Hill three abreast and that could have been nasty.

On this occasion no-one was hurt but this was purely down to good fortune and not because the ‘prank’ itself was fundamentally harmless.

This brings us onto the key issue here – if this happened again people could be seriously hurt. Cottle appeared to have no appreciation of this, or show any form of remorse after the incident. On the contrary, he bragged about it on social and conventional media. He saw a few minutes of fame and revelled in that. The only time he showed any remorse was when things started looking more serious for him.

That brings the risk of like-minded people copying his antics and this is what concerned me most about the whole thing. If the likelihood of others doing this is increased there are really only two ways to address this: 1) make every circuit like Fort Knox so that it is physically impossible or 2) punish the individual in a sufficiently serious manner that is an effective deterrent to others.

Option 1) forces circuit owners to spend money on increased security and physical barriers to deal with deliberate anti-social behaviour. Someone has to pay for that – me as a racer or the spectators in increased ticket prices. I will also have to deal with the inconvenience brought about more stringent security and one of the great things about UK club motorsport – that punters can get close to the teams – is lost. Also at the end of the day, if someone is absolutely determined to disrupt something, they will find a way of breaching security. Maybe not with a car, but they could climb over a fence and get onto a track at even the biggest race meeting, probably before anyone could stop them.

Which brings us to Option 2).

Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was.

I’m sure you’re aware that invading the pitch at a football match is a criminal offence. It’s not dangerous but it is disruptive to the rest of the spectators and TV audience. We no longer have fences at football matches for obvious reasons, so you discourage people with the threat of a criminal record. The chap that swam out into the boat race also got a custodial sentence - he only put himself in harm’s way, but he ruined an event enjoyed by thousands.

I’m not a lawyer, but I imagine the judge took into account these and other factors, such as the distress caused to the girl in the car (apparently not his girlfriend).

So overall I think a custodial sentence is appropriate. Harsh compared to sentences for other crimes – perhaps – but probably because those sentences are overly lenient. The thing that may affect him for the rest of his life is the criminal record – and that will be there whether he served time or did community service.

Notice that I have not commented on the immediate impact to those of us racing. The entry fee for that race was over £2,000 per car. Considerably more is spent preparing the cars and on fuel tyres etc. We were over three hours into a 4 hour endurance race that had to be stopped – stopped not ‘paused’ – no-one knew Cottle would only do one lap . It’s not like a football match – you can’t just break off for a couple of minutes then put the ball back down and resume where you started off. In this case the race was restarted, with cars placed in the order they were when the race was stopped. However all the gaps between cars were eliminated (some had been many laps down) – it was like starting the race from scratch. The start is when most incidents happen – but normally in an endurance race it is pretty good because the position you are in after the first corner has little impact on the race outcome 4 hours later. When that 4 hour race becomes a 15 minute ‘winner takes all’ sprint to the end guess what – you get accidents. Numerous cars were damaged in the restart (ours included) – so many in fact that the restarted race had to be abandoned within a lap. With the benefit of hindsight I think the officials made a mistake restarting the race, but at the time we would probably have complained if our race had been cut short and time was still on the clock. The fact that any of this happened at all was down to Cottle’s actions. The paying spectators were also deprived of seeing the end of a race they had paid to watch.

I hope that he reflects on how stupid he has been, sorts himself out and goes on to make a useful contribution to society and for himself. I also hope that other idiots who think this type of thing is something to be looked up to are discouraged from emulating him.

[xRIEx]

teamHOLDENracing said:

Lots of stuff.

Excellent post.