Did This Guy Really Drive On The Track During A Live Race?
Discussion
well said that man.teamHOLDENracing said:
I am a driver and team manager of one of the cars in the affected race and I don’t feel sorry for the lad. He did something that had potential consequences beyond his comprehension – including his current incarceration.
I agree that as things turned out no-one was hurt, but why was that? Fun Cup is almost unique in that all drivers are connected to race control with one way radios and the clerk of the course can communicate to all drivers instantaneously. The moment that Cottle drove onto the track the race was neutralised and all the drivers slowed. This was the reason that the speed differential was not apparent. Any other race would have relied upon flags and these cannot be deployed as quickly. Cottle was also fortunate that he happened to join the track in a gap in traffic - it is not uncommon for Fun Cup cars to go through Paddock Hill three abreast and that could have been nasty.
On this occasion no-one was hurt but this was purely down to good fortune and not because the ‘prank’ itself was fundamentally harmless.
This brings us onto the key issue here – if this happened again people could be seriously hurt. Cottle appeared to have no appreciation of this, or show any form of remorse after the incident. On the contrary, he bragged about it on social and conventional media. He saw a few minutes of fame and revelled in that. The only time he showed any remorse was when things started looking more serious for him.
That brings the risk of like-minded people copying his antics and this is what concerned me most about the whole thing. If the likelihood of others doing this is increased there are really only two ways to address this: 1) make every circuit like Fort Knox so that it is physically impossible or 2) punish the individual in a sufficiently serious manner that is an effective deterrent to others.
Option 1) forces circuit owners to spend money on increased security and physical barriers to deal with deliberate anti-social behaviour. Someone has to pay for that – me as a racer or the spectators in increased ticket prices. I will also have to deal with the inconvenience brought about more stringent security and one of the great things about UK club motorsport – that punters can get close to the teams – is lost. Also at the end of the day, if someone is absolutely determined to disrupt something, they will find a way of breaching security. Maybe not with a car, but they could climb over a fence and get onto a track at even the biggest race meeting, probably before anyone could stop them.
Which brings us to Option 2).
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was.
I’m sure you’re aware that invading the pitch at a football match is a criminal offence. It’s not dangerous but it is disruptive to the rest of the spectators and TV audience. We no longer have fences at football matches for obvious reasons, so you discourage people with the threat of a criminal record. The chap that swam out into the boat race also got a custodial sentence - he only put himself in harm’s way, but he ruined an event enjoyed by thousands.
I’m not a lawyer, but I imagine the judge took into account these and other factors, such as the distress caused to the girl in the car (apparently not his girlfriend).
So overall I think a custodial sentence is appropriate. Harsh compared to sentences for other crimes – perhaps – but probably because those sentences are overly lenient. The thing that may affect him for the rest of his life is the criminal record – and that will be there whether he served time or did community service.
Notice that I have not commented on the immediate impact to those of us racing. The entry fee for that race was over £2,000 per car. Considerably more is spent preparing the cars and on fuel tyres etc. We were over three hours into a 4 hour endurance race that had to be stopped – stopped not ‘paused’ – no-one knew Cottle would only do one lap . It’s not like a football match – you can’t just break off for a couple of minutes then put the ball back down and resume where you started off. In this case the race was restarted, with cars placed in the order they were when the race was stopped. However all the gaps between cars were eliminated (some had been many laps down) – it was like starting the race from scratch. The start is when most incidents happen – but normally in an endurance race it is pretty good because the position you are in after the first corner has little impact on the race outcome 4 hours later. When that 4 hour race becomes a 15 minute ‘winner takes all’ sprint to the end guess what – you get accidents. Numerous cars were damaged in the restart (ours included) – so many in fact that the restarted race had to be abandoned within a lap. With the benefit of hindsight I think the officials made a mistake restarting the race, but at the time we would probably have complained if our race had been cut short and time was still on the clock. The fact that any of this happened at all was down to Cottle’s actions. The paying spectators were also deprived of seeing the end of a race they had paid to watch.
I hope that he reflects on how stupid he has been, sorts himself out and goes on to make a useful contribution to society and for himself. I also hope that other idiots who think this type of thing is something to be looked up to are discouraged from emulating him.
Eloquently put old chap. I agree that as things turned out no-one was hurt, but why was that? Fun Cup is almost unique in that all drivers are connected to race control with one way radios and the clerk of the course can communicate to all drivers instantaneously. The moment that Cottle drove onto the track the race was neutralised and all the drivers slowed. This was the reason that the speed differential was not apparent. Any other race would have relied upon flags and these cannot be deployed as quickly. Cottle was also fortunate that he happened to join the track in a gap in traffic - it is not uncommon for Fun Cup cars to go through Paddock Hill three abreast and that could have been nasty.
On this occasion no-one was hurt but this was purely down to good fortune and not because the ‘prank’ itself was fundamentally harmless.
This brings us onto the key issue here – if this happened again people could be seriously hurt. Cottle appeared to have no appreciation of this, or show any form of remorse after the incident. On the contrary, he bragged about it on social and conventional media. He saw a few minutes of fame and revelled in that. The only time he showed any remorse was when things started looking more serious for him.
That brings the risk of like-minded people copying his antics and this is what concerned me most about the whole thing. If the likelihood of others doing this is increased there are really only two ways to address this: 1) make every circuit like Fort Knox so that it is physically impossible or 2) punish the individual in a sufficiently serious manner that is an effective deterrent to others.
Option 1) forces circuit owners to spend money on increased security and physical barriers to deal with deliberate anti-social behaviour. Someone has to pay for that – me as a racer or the spectators in increased ticket prices. I will also have to deal with the inconvenience brought about more stringent security and one of the great things about UK club motorsport – that punters can get close to the teams – is lost. Also at the end of the day, if someone is absolutely determined to disrupt something, they will find a way of breaching security. Maybe not with a car, but they could climb over a fence and get onto a track at even the biggest race meeting, probably before anyone could stop them.
Which brings us to Option 2).
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was.
I’m sure you’re aware that invading the pitch at a football match is a criminal offence. It’s not dangerous but it is disruptive to the rest of the spectators and TV audience. We no longer have fences at football matches for obvious reasons, so you discourage people with the threat of a criminal record. The chap that swam out into the boat race also got a custodial sentence - he only put himself in harm’s way, but he ruined an event enjoyed by thousands.
I’m not a lawyer, but I imagine the judge took into account these and other factors, such as the distress caused to the girl in the car (apparently not his girlfriend).
So overall I think a custodial sentence is appropriate. Harsh compared to sentences for other crimes – perhaps – but probably because those sentences are overly lenient. The thing that may affect him for the rest of his life is the criminal record – and that will be there whether he served time or did community service.
Notice that I have not commented on the immediate impact to those of us racing. The entry fee for that race was over £2,000 per car. Considerably more is spent preparing the cars and on fuel tyres etc. We were over three hours into a 4 hour endurance race that had to be stopped – stopped not ‘paused’ – no-one knew Cottle would only do one lap . It’s not like a football match – you can’t just break off for a couple of minutes then put the ball back down and resume where you started off. In this case the race was restarted, with cars placed in the order they were when the race was stopped. However all the gaps between cars were eliminated (some had been many laps down) – it was like starting the race from scratch. The start is when most incidents happen – but normally in an endurance race it is pretty good because the position you are in after the first corner has little impact on the race outcome 4 hours later. When that 4 hour race becomes a 15 minute ‘winner takes all’ sprint to the end guess what – you get accidents. Numerous cars were damaged in the restart (ours included) – so many in fact that the restarted race had to be abandoned within a lap. With the benefit of hindsight I think the officials made a mistake restarting the race, but at the time we would probably have complained if our race had been cut short and time was still on the clock. The fact that any of this happened at all was down to Cottle’s actions. The paying spectators were also deprived of seeing the end of a race they had paid to watch.
I hope that he reflects on how stupid he has been, sorts himself out and goes on to make a useful contribution to society and for himself. I also hope that other idiots who think this type of thing is something to be looked up to are discouraged from emulating him.
teamHOLDENracing said:
I am a driver and team manager of one of the cars in the affected race and I don’t feel sorry for the lad. He did something that had potential consequences beyond his comprehension – including his current incarceration.
I agree that as things turned out no-one was hurt, but why was that? Fun Cup is almost unique in that all drivers are connected to race control with one way radios and the clerk of the course can communicate to all drivers instantaneously. The moment that Cottle drove onto the track the race was neutralised and all the drivers slowed. This was the reason that the speed differential was not apparent. Any other race would have relied upon flags and these cannot be deployed as quickly. Cottle was also fortunate that he happened to join the track in a gap in traffic - it is not uncommon for Fun Cup cars to go through Paddock Hill three abreast and that could have been nasty.
On this occasion no-one was hurt but this was purely down to good fortune and not because the ‘prank’ itself was fundamentally harmless.
This brings us onto the key issue here – if this happened again people could be seriously hurt. Cottle appeared to have no appreciation of this, or show any form of remorse after the incident. On the contrary, he bragged about it on social and conventional media. He saw a few minutes of fame and revelled in that. The only time he showed any remorse was when things started looking more serious for him.
That brings the risk of like-minded people copying his antics and this is what concerned me most about the whole thing. If the likelihood of others doing this is increased there are really only two ways to address this: 1) make every circuit like Fort Knox so that it is physically impossible or 2) punish the individual in a sufficiently serious manner that is an effective deterrent to others.
Option 1) forces circuit owners to spend money on increased security and physical barriers to deal with deliberate anti-social behaviour. Someone has to pay for that – me as a racer or the spectators in increased ticket prices. I will also have to deal with the inconvenience brought about more stringent security and one of the great things about UK club motorsport – that punters can get close to the teams – is lost. Also at the end of the day, if someone is absolutely determined to disrupt something, they will find a way of breaching security. Maybe not with a car, but they could climb over a fence and get onto a track at even the biggest race meeting, probably before anyone could stop them.
Which brings us to Option 2).
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was.
I’m sure you’re aware that invading the pitch at a football match is a criminal offence. It’s not dangerous but it is disruptive to the rest of the spectators and TV audience. We no longer have fences at football matches for obvious reasons, so you discourage people with the threat of a criminal record. The chap that swam out into the boat race also got a custodial sentence - he only put himself in harm’s way, but he ruined an event enjoyed by thousands.
I’m not a lawyer, but I imagine the judge took into account these and other factors, such as the distress caused to the girl in the car (apparently not his girlfriend).
So overall I think a custodial sentence is appropriate. Harsh compared to sentences for other crimes – perhaps – but probably because those sentences are overly lenient. The thing that may affect him for the rest of his life is the criminal record – and that will be there whether he served time or did community service.
Notice that I have not commented on the immediate impact to those of us racing. The entry fee for that race was over £2,000 per car. Considerably more is spent preparing the cars and on fuel tyres etc. We were over three hours into a 4 hour endurance race that had to be stopped – stopped not ‘paused’ – no-one knew Cottle would only do one lap . It’s not like a football match – you can’t just break off for a couple of minutes then put the ball back down and resume where you started off. In this case the race was restarted, with cars placed in the order they were when the race was stopped. However all the gaps between cars were eliminated (some had been many laps down) – it was like starting the race from scratch. The start is when most incidents happen – but normally in an endurance race it is pretty good because the position you are in after the first corner has little impact on the race outcome 4 hours later. When that 4 hour race becomes a 15 minute ‘winner takes all’ sprint to the end guess what – you get accidents. Numerous cars were damaged in the restart (ours included) – so many in fact that the restarted race had to be abandoned within a lap. With the benefit of hindsight I think the officials made a mistake restarting the race, but at the time we would probably have complained if our race had been cut short and time was still on the clock. The fact that any of this happened at all was down to Cottle’s actions. The paying spectators were also deprived of seeing the end of a race they had paid to watch.
I hope that he reflects on how stupid he has been, sorts himself out and goes on to make a useful contribution to society and for himself. I also hope that other idiots who think this type of thing is something to be looked up to are discouraged from emulating him.
Good points well made. Encapsulates what a lot of us have been saying but way more effective coming from someone like yourself who was significantly affected.I agree that as things turned out no-one was hurt, but why was that? Fun Cup is almost unique in that all drivers are connected to race control with one way radios and the clerk of the course can communicate to all drivers instantaneously. The moment that Cottle drove onto the track the race was neutralised and all the drivers slowed. This was the reason that the speed differential was not apparent. Any other race would have relied upon flags and these cannot be deployed as quickly. Cottle was also fortunate that he happened to join the track in a gap in traffic - it is not uncommon for Fun Cup cars to go through Paddock Hill three abreast and that could have been nasty.
On this occasion no-one was hurt but this was purely down to good fortune and not because the ‘prank’ itself was fundamentally harmless.
This brings us onto the key issue here – if this happened again people could be seriously hurt. Cottle appeared to have no appreciation of this, or show any form of remorse after the incident. On the contrary, he bragged about it on social and conventional media. He saw a few minutes of fame and revelled in that. The only time he showed any remorse was when things started looking more serious for him.
That brings the risk of like-minded people copying his antics and this is what concerned me most about the whole thing. If the likelihood of others doing this is increased there are really only two ways to address this: 1) make every circuit like Fort Knox so that it is physically impossible or 2) punish the individual in a sufficiently serious manner that is an effective deterrent to others.
Option 1) forces circuit owners to spend money on increased security and physical barriers to deal with deliberate anti-social behaviour. Someone has to pay for that – me as a racer or the spectators in increased ticket prices. I will also have to deal with the inconvenience brought about more stringent security and one of the great things about UK club motorsport – that punters can get close to the teams – is lost. Also at the end of the day, if someone is absolutely determined to disrupt something, they will find a way of breaching security. Maybe not with a car, but they could climb over a fence and get onto a track at even the biggest race meeting, probably before anyone could stop them.
Which brings us to Option 2).
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was.
I’m sure you’re aware that invading the pitch at a football match is a criminal offence. It’s not dangerous but it is disruptive to the rest of the spectators and TV audience. We no longer have fences at football matches for obvious reasons, so you discourage people with the threat of a criminal record. The chap that swam out into the boat race also got a custodial sentence - he only put himself in harm’s way, but he ruined an event enjoyed by thousands.
I’m not a lawyer, but I imagine the judge took into account these and other factors, such as the distress caused to the girl in the car (apparently not his girlfriend).
So overall I think a custodial sentence is appropriate. Harsh compared to sentences for other crimes – perhaps – but probably because those sentences are overly lenient. The thing that may affect him for the rest of his life is the criminal record – and that will be there whether he served time or did community service.
Notice that I have not commented on the immediate impact to those of us racing. The entry fee for that race was over £2,000 per car. Considerably more is spent preparing the cars and on fuel tyres etc. We were over three hours into a 4 hour endurance race that had to be stopped – stopped not ‘paused’ – no-one knew Cottle would only do one lap . It’s not like a football match – you can’t just break off for a couple of minutes then put the ball back down and resume where you started off. In this case the race was restarted, with cars placed in the order they were when the race was stopped. However all the gaps between cars were eliminated (some had been many laps down) – it was like starting the race from scratch. The start is when most incidents happen – but normally in an endurance race it is pretty good because the position you are in after the first corner has little impact on the race outcome 4 hours later. When that 4 hour race becomes a 15 minute ‘winner takes all’ sprint to the end guess what – you get accidents. Numerous cars were damaged in the restart (ours included) – so many in fact that the restarted race had to be abandoned within a lap. With the benefit of hindsight I think the officials made a mistake restarting the race, but at the time we would probably have complained if our race had been cut short and time was still on the clock. The fact that any of this happened at all was down to Cottle’s actions. The paying spectators were also deprived of seeing the end of a race they had paid to watch.
I hope that he reflects on how stupid he has been, sorts himself out and goes on to make a useful contribution to society and for himself. I also hope that other idiots who think this type of thing is something to be looked up to are discouraged from emulating him.
Fantastic post THR. I couldn't word it any better than the previous post...
With a suitable punishment now dished out to Cottle, my only hope is that the knock on effect at events is minimal.
zebra said:
Good points well made. Encapsulates what a lot of us have been saying but way more effective coming from someone like yourself who was significantly affected.
...great to see what so many of us have said (as spectators) reiterated by someone in the pit lane. With a suitable punishment now dished out to Cottle, my only hope is that the knock on effect at events is minimal.
@ team holden - are you not slightly pissed off with brands or the series organisers that he was able to drive unhindered into pit lane and if that's not bad enough on track?
The guy who got on track is a complete t
t but I fear every race series will cost more now as they will all need security to prevent this happening again.
The guy who got on track is a complete t
t but I fear every race series will cost more now as they will all need security to prevent this happening again.egor110 said:
@ team holden - are you not slightly pissed off with brands or the series organisers that he was able to drive unhindered into pit lane and if that's not bad enough on track?
The guy who got on track is a complete tt but I fear every race series will cost more now as they will all need security to prevent this happening again.
I think the sentence is designed to deter that from happening and I think it will have that effect. No punishment, or a typical slap on the wrist, would most definitely have encouraged copycats. Perhaps more CCTV is the easiest option for organisers.The guy who got on track is a complete t
t but I fear every race series will cost more now as they will all need security to prevent this happening again.Edited by 9mm on Friday 21st November 11:01
BlimeyCharlie said:
Graham said:
To put in into some sentencing context, the swimmer who interrupted the boat race got 6 months, for causing a public nuisance,
so 8 months for cottle who's action carried much more risk to people and property 8 months doesn't seem unfair.
what cottle should be worried about now though is civil claims from the teams etc
Good point there about the swimmer. I also remember a vicar getting busted for a similar stunt at the British GP, when he ran onto the track, so actually not similar at all really when I think about it, which I have.so 8 months for cottle who's action carried much more risk to people and property 8 months doesn't seem unfair.
what cottle should be worried about now though is civil claims from the teams etc
It makes me laugh on these 'ere forums. Despite there being an actual video of what happened, plus a court case, verdict, sentence etc, 45 pages later people still can't agree on hardly anything from the incident itself, to anything thereafter.
I blame the parents...
He got 2 months for aggravated trespass.
The following year he pushed the Brazilian who was leading the marathon at the Athens Olympics into the crowd, thus costing the athlete a likely gold medal (he ended up finishing third). 12 months suspended sentence and a 3000 Euro fine. The judge could have given him 5 years but didn't because a) Horan, unlike Cottle, apologised and b) he thought, probably correctly, that Horan was mentally unhinged.
I'm conflicted about Cottle's jail sentence because there is a need to send a message to dissuade like-minded 'legends' from copycat actions, yet there is no payback of any sort to all those at Brands Hatch who were directly affected - i.e. MSV/race teams/sponsors/spectators/etc.
Sometimes I think that rather than incarcerating people we should bring back the stocks and the pillory as punishment for offences like this. The supermarket chains could provide free rotten fruit and veg to throw for those who want to express their distaste. Huge public embarrassment might be more salutary than being locked away out of sight in what is in effect a crime factory.
Red Devil said:
Sometimes I think that rather than incarcerating people we should bring back the stocks and the pillory as punishment for offences like this. The supermarket chains could provide free rotten fruit and veg to throw for those who want to express their distaste. Huge public embarrassment might be more salutary than being locked away out of sight in what is in effect a crime factory.
The concept of shame as a punishment can be powerful, but does depend a little on the subject finding shame and humiliation a punishment.I always though that for minor thefts (i.e. criminals who haven't shown threat to a person) having to where a pink dayglo boiler suit with the word "thief" on the back and being required to pick litter for a month in a public place might be a good punishment.
Cottle got what he deserved. In truth, he will be released within a few weeks on a tag or Home Detention Curfew as it's known. (6 I think is the minimum before eligibility)
What I found most frustrating was his view that somehow Brands Hatch were to blame, for his being able to physically join the track. He steadfastly refused to see that he was wholly responsible. Hopefully, now he has time to reflect at his leisure, the penny may finally drop?
What I found most frustrating was his view that somehow Brands Hatch were to blame, for his being able to physically join the track. He steadfastly refused to see that he was wholly responsible. Hopefully, now he has time to reflect at his leisure, the penny may finally drop?
e21Mark said:
Cottle got what he deserved. In truth, he will be released within a few weeks on a tag or Home Detention Curfew as it's known. (6 I think is the minimum before eligibility)
What I found most frustrating was his view that somehow Brands Hatch were to blame, for his being able to physically join the track. He steadfastly refused to see that he was wholly responsible. Hopefully, now he has time to reflect at his leisure, the penny may finally drop?
You would like to think so, but then somebody that lacks the thought process that would lead to him not doing it in the first place is probably going to continue trying to pin the responsibility of his actions on somebody else. Sadly "Just because you can do a thing, doesn't mean you should" is lost on people like him and the crowd of utter cretins that surround people like him.What I found most frustrating was his view that somehow Brands Hatch were to blame, for his being able to physically join the track. He steadfastly refused to see that he was wholly responsible. Hopefully, now he has time to reflect at his leisure, the penny may finally drop?
Like any normal person who wants to do a lap or two of Brands Hatch you book in on a track day and have a go. But then it wouldn't be a dare or something to make him look big in front of the 'in crowd'. Or like the idiots that street race then bleat “give us somewhere to race”, a while back some scrote was overheard at York Raceway saying “People only race here because they haven’t got the balls to do it on the street”.
Could be worse for him; I was talking to a mate about this last night and his response was "He should have been dragged out of the car and shot".
zebra said:
Good points well made. Encapsulates what a lot of us have been saying but way more effective coming from someone like yourself who was significantly affected.
Quite. The problem though is figuring-out how to deal with the knuckle-draggers and to dissuade their braindead ilk from doing similar (or worse) in future. However, I agree with what PanzerCommander says below:PanzerCommander said:
You would like to think so, but then somebody that lacks the thought process that would lead to him not doing it in the first place is probably going to continue trying to pin the responsibility of his actions on somebody else. Sadly "Just because you can do a thing, doesn't mean you should" is lost on people like him and the crowd of utter cretins that surround people like him.
That is the nub. - Some of these people don't think and lack the mental capacity to consider consequences. It doesn't matter if you threaten them with prison, death, VBRJ...whatever. They just don't think about the effects or any responsibility that lies with them. Monkey see, monkey do.teamHOLDENracing said:
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was.
It's a societal problem. As I see it, the solution is either in education (rising above this type of behaviour) or taking the warning signs away and letting natural selection work for a change.9mm said:
egor110 said:
@ team holden - are you not slightly pissed off with brands or the series organisers that he was able to drive unhindered into pit lane and if that's not bad enough on track?
The guy who got on track is a complete tt but I fear every race series will cost more now as they will all need security to prevent this happening again.
I think the sentence is designed to deter that from happening and I think it will have that effect. No punishment, or a typical slap on the wrist, would most definitely have encouraged copycats. Perhaps more CCTV is the easiest option for organisers.The guy who got on track is a complete t
t but I fear every race series will cost more now as they will all need security to prevent this happening again.Edited by 9mm on Friday 21st November 11:01
No you can't stop the risk 100% but by having security this incident would of never happened, so you could reduce the risk substantially.
teamholdenracing said:
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was
The rate at which these morons are breeding at is worrying. A lot of Polish people are employed where I work. They are some of the friendliest and hard working people I have ever worked with, despite a lot of them being on minimum wage. In contrast most UK bred youngsters that have been employed have been pretty much useless. We had one that was warned about using his phone whilst on the production line. Of course he ignored the warning and carried on texting when he felt like it. On his way out of the building one evening he was overheard mouthing off that "it's like being back at school innit". He was sacked the next day.
GSE said:
teamholdenracing said:
Unfortunately Cottle had massively increased the likelihood of copying by his actions after the incident, and I was dismayed reading some of the comments made by others on his (specially created) Facebook page about what a ‘legend’ he was
The rate at which these morons are breeding at is worrying. A lot of Polish people are employed where I work. They are some of the friendliest and hard working people I have ever worked with, despite a lot of them being on minimum wage. In contrast most UK bred youngsters that have been employed have been pretty much useless. We had one that was warned about using his phone whilst on the production line. Of course he ignored the warning and carried on texting when he felt like it. On his way out of the building one evening he was overheard mouthing off that "it's like being back at school innit". He was sacked the next day.
On min wage jobs they seem to make there money go a lot further, i pressume they all pay tax, road tax insurance etc so where do they make the savings?
egor110 said:
Well off topic but we should have economics classes from the Polish.
On min wage jobs they seem to make there money go a lot further, i pressume they all pay tax, road tax insurance etc so where do they make the savings?
/off topicOn min wage jobs they seem to make there money go a lot further, i pressume they all pay tax, road tax insurance etc so where do they make the savings?
A lot of them seem to live in shared houses, where they share costs including transport etc.
The point is these workers realize that the world doesn't owe them a living, unlike Cottle, and they are prepared to get off their arses, and even move country to make an honest living. This could be something to do with the fact that if you don't work in Poland, you get virtually nothing from the Government, where as here, you can make a living on the dole.
/back on topic
egor110 said:
Well off topic but we should have economics classes from the Polish.
On min wage jobs they seem to make there money go a lot further, i pressume they all pay tax, road tax insurance etc so where do they make the savings?
Probably largely from living in rented, shared accomodation and appreciating how wealthy they actually are.On min wage jobs they seem to make there money go a lot further, i pressume they all pay tax, road tax insurance etc so where do they make the savings?
After I left Uni I took a massive paycut to get my foot in the door in a science job, earning £13,000. I was still living in a student house, sharing a room with my GF and paying £200/month for a nice flat in central Edinburgh. I ran a 200SX, a motorbike, did trackdays etc. etc.
I think most people's money goes on a) accomodation and b) stupid car choices (i.e. financing or leasing a shiny new VAG product they can't afford but seem to think they're entitled to). My actual outgoings would be pitiful if I didn't spend all my cash on overpaying my mortgage and frivolous petrol powered toys...I reckon even now I could live comfortably on minimum wage if I really had to, and still have a fun car to hoon about in.
Edited by T0MMY on Friday 21st November 18:04
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