RE: Dodge Challenger Hellcat: 707hp

RE: Dodge Challenger Hellcat: 707hp

Author
Discussion

graemel

7,017 posts

216 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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I seriously want one of these. Only new car in years that has excited me.

Fartgalen

6,630 posts

206 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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As an American muscle car lover. Yes please.

bobberz

1,832 posts

198 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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LuS1fer said:
The downside with these cars is the American propensity for dealers to be able to charge around $20000 premium for the first cars. always happens and mnaufacturers can't stop them, under the system they have over there.
The first Challengers and GT500s had these ludicrous "scabbing" premiums attached, until demand evened out and there was no longer a queue.
^^This.

Back in 2007 when the first Shelby GT500s came out, I thought, "fantastic; 500bhp for only $40 grand". Unlike certain German car companies, American high-performance cars don't typically have long and expensive options lists, so the "as-tested" price in most of the magazines was pretty close to the $40K base price.

Then I saw one at a local dealership for the first time. Sure enough, the total MSRP was less than $45,000. However, scrawled by the dealership on a piece of paper tacked under the window sticker said "adjusted market value" or some such nonsense of, whaddya know, exactly $40,000. So, what the magazines were hailing as "the performance bargain of the century" turned out to be over $80,000!

BTW, they still do it, even though the GT500 is now an outgoing model. However, at least now the markup is only a few grand.



h0b0

7,559 posts

195 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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skyrover said:
manmaths said:
skyrover said:
thatdude said:
Second key though? a bit of further elaboration on that?
So the valet does not crash it wink
500bhp is more than enough bhp for a valet to write the car off wink No?
Of course not biggrin
I have a second key which I can limit the speed at which the car is driven. It is aimed for giving to your kids. It will also limit the volume of the radio and will tell me how the car was driven.

However, I am not sure dropping the car to only 500hp will have the desired effect in this case!

RichardParker90

30 posts

133 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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thatdude said:
I quite like this

Second key though? a bit of further elaboration on that?

Sounds like with the usual ignition key, you fire it up and theres your 707 bhp. If you then later decide you are a pussy (say it with a thick american accent ya'll) then you can limit it to a girls power level of 500 bhp...right?
Not sure if this has been answered. What I've gathered, is that there will be two keys, much like the Veyron--a red key and a black key. The red one gives you the full beans; the black key is a valet key that limits a number of performance and accessibility parameters. Most notably, it limits power to 500hp.

mikEsprit

827 posts

185 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
quotequote all
bobberz said:
LuS1fer said:
The downside with these cars is the American propensity for dealers to be able to charge around $20000 premium for the first cars. always happens and mnaufacturers can't stop them, under the system they have over there.
The first Challengers and GT500s had these ludicrous "scabbing" premiums attached, until demand evened out and there was no longer a queue.
^^This.

Back in 2007 when the first Shelby GT500s came out, I thought, "fantastic; 500bhp for only $40 grand". Unlike certain German car companies, American high-performance cars don't typically have long and expensive options lists, so the "as-tested" price in most of the magazines was pretty close to the $40K base price.

Then I saw one at a local dealership for the first time. Sure enough, the total MSRP was less than $45,000. However, scrawled by the dealership on a piece of paper tacked under the window sticker said "adjusted market value" or some such nonsense of, whaddya know, exactly $40,000. So, what the magazines were hailing as "the performance bargain of the century" turned out to be over $80,000!

BTW, they still do it, even though the GT500 is now an outgoing model. However, at least now the markup is only a few grand.

It's not like you should expect the car dealers to sit back and let others arbitrage the situation.

LuS1fer

41,086 posts

244 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
quotequote all
RichardParker90 said:
thatdude said:
I quite like this

Second key though? a bit of further elaboration on that?

Sounds like with the usual ignition key, you fire it up and theres your 707 bhp. If you then later decide you are a pussy (say it with a thick american accent ya'll) then you can limit it to a girls power level of 500 bhp...right?
Not sure if this has been answered. What I've gathered, is that there will be two keys, much like the Veyron--a red key and a black key. The red one gives you the full beans; the black key is a valet key that limits a number of performance and accessibility parameters. Most notably, it limits power to 500hp.
Corvette ZR1 had this way back in the 1993. The valet key turned of 8 of the 16 injectors to limit power from the full 405hp - seems laughable now...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stm_0nx_9Ec

aeropilot

34,299 posts

226 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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bobberz said:
Meteor Madness said:
godzilla84 said:
sooooo..... from the factory it produces 707bhp.....which means that to make the engine reliable it must be a reasonable distance from its actual tolerances. That means that there is a tuning company somewhere that can and probably will put it up to 1000+bhp??
I think you will find people have been tuning the Chrysler Hemi well over 1000bhp since the 1960s. Witness the 7000bhp+ behemoths that Top Fuel drag racers use.
Well, the current Top Fuel and Funny Car Hemis are pretty far removed from the 426 of the '60s, AFAIK. That said, period Top Fuel dragsters were pushing up to 2000 bhp, so your argument is not invalid.
Indeed, not to mention the fact that the Hemi in the Hellcat is a 'modern' Hemi engine that bears no connection (other than re-introducing the name) with either the original 1950's Hemi engine or the later fabled 426 Hemi engine of the 1960's.


Matt..

3,586 posts

188 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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I do so want a Challenger. Even an R/T would do! It would be terrible for the on street parking i have to do now though!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU2d3YpJVYk <- the Hellcat makes special noises biggrin

LuS1fer

41,086 posts

244 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
quotequote all
aeropilot said:
Indeed, not to mention the fact that the Hemi in the Hellcat is a 'modern' Hemi engine that bears no connection (other than re-introducing the name) with either the original 1950's Hemi engine or the later fabled 426 Hemi engine of the 1960's.
I recall reading that the modern hemi isn't really a true hemi at all but can't find it now. However, one thing I did find is that these engines use 16 spark plugs - 2 per cylinder - 8 coil packs, each coil pack feeding another plug on the opposite bank by a normal plug lead.
All for emissions but hell, 16 plugs!

aeropilot

34,299 posts

226 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
quotequote all
LuS1fer said:
aeropilot said:
Indeed, not to mention the fact that the Hemi in the Hellcat is a 'modern' Hemi engine that bears no connection (other than re-introducing the name) with either the original 1950's Hemi engine or the later fabled 426 Hemi engine of the 1960's.
I recall reading that the modern hemi isn't really a true hemi at all but can't find it now. However, one thing I did find is that these engines use 16 spark plugs - 2 per cylinder - 8 coil packs, each coil pack feeding another plug on the opposite bank by a normal plug lead.
All for emissions but hell, 16 plugs!
Yep, more of a semi-hemi or shotgun-hemi (like Ford's BOSS 429 engine)

Twin-plug heads - pah - old hat ;-)

Here's a 1940's era ELCO twin-plug ally head conversion of the Ford flathead V8 - note the 16 point dizzy!!



Matt UK

17,649 posts

199 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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thatdude said:
Second key though? a bit of further elaboration on that?
They should have gone further and made the wife's key only worth 140bhp...

(Joking before the PH ladies get upset!)

Killer2005

19,595 posts

227 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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I'll have one of these plus the 1000 bhp Mustang please

graemel

7,017 posts

216 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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Just spent a while trawling through the Dodge SRT site for the Hellcat. I think I need to put a letter of intent in but to who.
Good news it does not have bluejob stop start technology. It has old fashioned hydraulic steering. It does have launch control and a myriad of adjustable settings but thats ok. Just need to tweak those exhaust valves for straight through all the time.
I'm guessing this could be the last of the old school muscle cars that stayed true to the coke bottle shape
No plum crazy or hemi orange, will have to be black

Edited by graemel on Wednesday 2nd July 22:34

LasseV

1,754 posts

132 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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I don't like ongoing horsepower war, because i think that is one reason why modern cars are so boring. But jesus christ, i love this hellcat! I want one.

Mound Dawg

1,915 posts

173 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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No reflection on the car itself but "Hellcat"?

Really?

Are they marketing these things to twelve year old Death Metal fans?

Matt Harper

6,613 posts

200 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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"Hellcat" was the code-name for the drivetrain development program - and it looks like it's kind of stuck.
I have placed an order for one of these with my local CDJR dealer and the projected price is $58,000 +/- $2,000. No attempts at gouging me yet.

XJ Flyer

5,526 posts

129 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
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Mound Dawg said:
No reflection on the car itself but "Hellcat"?

Really?

Are they marketing these things to twelve year old Death Metal fans?
Maybe code for it eats ricers like the WW2 plane with the same name.

graemel

7,017 posts

216 months

Wednesday 2nd July 2014
quotequote all
Mound Dawg said:
No reflection on the car itself but "Hellcat"?

Really?

Are they marketing these things to twelve year old Death Metal fans?
No it is a tribute to the Grumman Hellcat which was the Navy's dominant fighter plane during WW2. Not some muppet band.

YankeePorker

4,763 posts

240 months

Thursday 3rd July 2014
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My wife drives a 2013 SRT8 Challenger. Its fun, makes nice noises but does not go round corners and loves going wrong. Even so, the idea of a 700 hp version is rather appealing......