is car sales one of the most overrated jobs around ?

is car sales one of the most overrated jobs around ?

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Discussion

itcaptainslow

3,694 posts

135 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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HumbleJim said:
Now it's a much more controlled team approach. Layers of management (too often hiding behind the scenes) talking about process and procedure, while controlling the margins/deals and shuffling two many pieces of paper
Could certainly agree with that-one of the many reasons I got out of the franchised dealer game.

Sheepshanks

32,530 posts

118 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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okgo said:
Why is it anyone's problem on here that you can't figure out how a business works?
Fair point, but car sales-people have been saying how tough the business is, and terrifying us about awful life would be without them.

In reality, like BA hostesses, they've had a good run for many years and don't want to let it go.

lamboman100

1,445 posts

120 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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HumbleJim said:
The UK main fanchise dealers have been down-skilling over the last few yrs.

It used to be that you were given a desk & phone & target and had to "get on with it" not a lot of support. The good guys quickly earned well the others fell by the wayside.

Now it's a much more controlled team approach. Layers of management (too often hiding behind the scenes) talking about process and procedure, while controlling the margins/deals and shuffling two many pieces of paper.

They have lost any entrepreneurial spirit & personal approach the fun has gone and the salesmen now a lower calibre are also lower paid.

The good guys have either, been promoted, set up on their own, left the industry or gone to work for specialist/indis.
That's the same in any industry.

As it gets bigger, it will get more bureaucratized, more controlled and more process-driven.

The tricky part is deciding when there are too many processes and too many management layers (as there usually are in British businesses, because everyone wants a title to impress Hyacinth Bucket next door).

micawrx

280 posts

159 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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A high percentage of PH buyers would know what they want and how much to pay before going into a dealer and that must make a car salesmans job very easy or very hard.

The real sales work starts when, like my neighbour in his sixties, doesn't have a clue what he wants...
I have not time for the wkers who try to rip people off for personal gain.
(VW trying to sell him a diesel golf when he does 6000 mpa... tosspot)

So, to a PH'er, the salesman won't be trying to win a sale, but not lose it.. and in IMHO, when cards are on the table, and you wade through all the bull.. most are OK.

The Ford Dealer in Newcastle who advertises in Auto Trader and has a grand more on the window ('the dealer price is the Auto Trader price with the scratches taken out, bald tyre replaced etc') can burn in hell though..
..but in fairness.. a minority.

yzrh

171 posts

121 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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unrepentant said:
Show me where I said I was No 1?

My income is my business and none of yours plus I'm in North America so it's hardly relevant. Suffice to say that it's pretty comfortable and doesn't bear any relation to any figures you quote. FYI most of my colleagues here are graduates and many have had successful careers in other industries.
Have to say, in the U.S. and Canada I've received better customer service than anywhere else I've travelled to in my life. Not in any one industry but just generally. smile

Buff Mchugelarge

3,316 posts

149 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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I work for a small ford indy.
I know I earn a fair bit more than the younger/ lower selling sales guys did at the main dealers I've worked in ( I clean cars btw).
I know our sales man is paid very well because he's very good at what he does and no body's going to argue with that.


I reckon many experienced mechanics are on more than a lot of salesman, in real life after you take into account hours etc.

tdm34

7,365 posts

209 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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Sheepshanks said:
Ari said:
tdm34 said:
I think you might find it £10-20 cheaper, but most people would take ours because of the convenience factor, that and the fact that we're a long established business with a fantastic recommendation/repeat customer ratio, because we really don't hassle our customers.

Last week we sold 116 cars with a GAP take up of over 50%, at the price we sell it I genuinely can never understand why people wont have it!
To be fair, that is a reasonable price. Most dealers are charging £300 for a product you can buy for £100 on line.
He said earlier he works in a car supermarket so the cost will be related the average sales value and likely cost of claim, which is going to be typically pretty small.

GAP is one of things that you'll be immensely grateful for if you ever have to claim, but the premium (the open-market premium, not what dealers charge) tells you that the likelihood of making a claim is pretty small.
Well, you'd think because it's a Car Supermarket we'd only sell cheap'n'cheerful stuff, our cars range from £3,000 to £30,000, with over 60% of the cars that we sell still under manufacturers warranty.

tdm34

7,365 posts

209 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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Sheepshanks said:
bugmenot said:
That's not even true. And if you think otherwise can you point me towards these regulations?
It's a bit worrying that even salesmen on PH seem to believe it's true.

Little wonder the FCA is going to ban dealers from selling GAP at the point of sale.
Not exactly correct, the FCA are trying to stamp out bad practice, I've asked for some clarification regarding the regulations that surround the selling of GAP etc, and hopefully i'll have that tomorrow, but I firmly believe in the product but it seems to have bad press because of the sharp practice of some of the trade.

CarlT

3,423 posts

246 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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Sheepshanks said:
There's just got to be more money in new cars than many people are letting on or I can't for the life of me see how many dealers survive.
More money to be made in Used cars at a franchised dealer. A fair majority are pretty weak at used cars and therefore struggle.

unrepentant

21,212 posts

255 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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CarlT said:
More money to be made in Used cars at a franchised dealer. A fair majority are pretty weak at used cars and therefore struggle.
Depends what you sell............ wink

GroundEffect

13,819 posts

155 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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When you're as good at designing cars as I am, you don't need no sales team.

Fast Bug

11,597 posts

160 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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Sheepshanks said:
That was used though, wasn't it?

Many dealers, presumably forced by the manufactures, aren’t helping themselves by having no interest in off-franchise vehicles so if you've got a fairly ordinary car you can sell it to WBAC for pretty well the same as the dealer offers.

As more and more WBAC type operations get going that should provide a bit of competition to offer higher prices.

My reticence to buying a car on line is that I want someone handy I can jump all over if there's a problem. Too easy to fob someone off if they're 150 miles away.
Jamjar sold new cars, not used did they not? Tesco attempted to sell used cars.

More competition for the We Buy Any Car style operations won't push the prices up for the consumer though. A car has a set value depending on miles/condition. You can obviously pay more then that for it, but then you're losing money. Now being a salesman, and not having a degree in rocket science, means that I'm not sure if that's a good business model or not. Maybe you can help me with that one?

Sheepshanks

32,530 posts

118 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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Fast Bug said:
A car has a set value depending on miles/condition. You can obviously pay more then that for it, but then you're losing money. Now being a salesman, and not having a degree in rocket science, means that I'm not sure if that's a good business model or not. Maybe you can help me with that one?
I don't know, obviously, but "we'll be sending that to the auction" seems an unimaginative way of dealing with decent p/x's and it's not providing the customer any benefit compared to selling to WBAC and buying online.

Fast Bug

11,597 posts

160 months

Tuesday 22nd July 2014
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WBAC send cars to auction though? In fact, are they not owned by an auction house?

Sheepshanks

32,530 posts

118 months

Wednesday 23rd July 2014
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Fast Bug said:
WBAC send cars to auction though? In fact, are they not owned by an auction house?
That's the point - if the dealer is doing exactly the same as WBAC they're not adding any value to the process.

JimmyConwayNW

3,056 posts

124 months

Wednesday 23rd July 2014
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Convenience is being offered as you don't then need to take your car to wbac to get the same amount of money.


Fairly simple.

Sheepshanks

32,530 posts

118 months

Wednesday 23rd July 2014
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Apparently people will drive miles to save £50 when buying a car.

Grandfondo

12,241 posts

205 months

Wednesday 23rd July 2014
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WBAC will now come and view and collect from your home!

HumbleJim

26,957 posts

182 months

Wednesday 23rd July 2014
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Sheepshanks said:
Apparently people will drive miles to save £50 when buying a car.
Some people will. A lot of people like the convenience of drive in and drive out with the next car, finance settled/arranged etc.
Where the dealers could make things better is by keeping the customers life simple, rather than pissing them off making them jump through hoops.

Fast Bug

11,597 posts

160 months

Wednesday 23rd July 2014
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Sheepshanks said:
That's the point - if the dealer is doing exactly the same as WBAC they're not adding any value to the process.
I'm sorry you've lost me. What would you like the dealership to do with part exchanges to add value?