HOT HATCHES are amazing now. But.
Discussion
Pixelpeep7r said:
Was the ride in the A45 as bad as all the reports are saying?
I've driven three of those four plus a M135i and a S3, haven't driven a M235i so can't offer any opinion on it. Personally I'd wouldn't regard the A45 suspension as being overly hard, I do however have one on order so am biased 
. Subjectively I felt the S3 with standard springs had a harder ride at all speeds. The Megane is the best overall compromise in terms of comfort vs handling.
The Golf with adaptive dampers in normal is an impressively refined ride without really loosing composure, comfort still suffers from what I'd best describe as a "jelly wobble" effect over badly uneven surfaces and Sport/Race is plain hard without adding anything to the party in terms of dynamics.
M135i doesn't have the refinement of Golf or the ultimate dynamics of the Megane, softer than a A45 at normal speeds but less composed when pressing on.
Five different ways of satisfying the same basic market. I'd actually wager that they'd all be faster point to point than a Integrale. The improvement in modern hatches really isn't appreciated.
For me best older hot hatch would also be a mk2 Golf GTI perfectly fun for hoon yet still suitable for kids, dog, shopping, wife which is really what a hot hatch should be, everyday practicality with a side order of fun.
kambites said:
Tuvra said:
blprice1 said:
ging84 said:
are you talking about the best performance outright, or best performance for the money, there are a generation of 300hp+ hot hatches now which sort of make comparisons to anything else fairly pointless.
But at £30k+ the cars themselves seem fair pointless as part of the appeal of a hot hatch in the past has been the affordability.
When the original Golf GTI was launched in the late seventies, the relative cost of that car was circa £30k....But at £30k+ the cars themselves seem fair pointless as part of the appeal of a hot hatch in the past has been the affordability.
It's amazing the number of people who don't seem to get the concept of inflation. I've had:
AX GT500
Saxo VTR Supercharged
Civic Type R EP3
Clio 182 Cup
Megane R26 F1
Very hard to pick a winner, a 205 GTI 1.9 is on my bucket list to own, but I have driven one and loved it.
Someone mentioned earlier about no cages or polycarbonate windows which I agree with. A hot hatch is an every day car that can put its hand down your trousers when needs to.
The best all rounder for me? The R26 (not the R26 R for reasons above, it's more a track car).
Best engine? EP3
Best handling? My lowered Saxo VTR, but stock the 182 Cup. However, the 182 Cup has a stupidly high seat for a tall chap like myself. I can fit in a Saxo, Elise, S2000 etc but the Clio was daft, which is a shame, but anyone should fit in a hot hatch IMO.
My AX GT500 was amazing and such fun. Just always felt it lacked grunt, even with a re jetted carb and race cam
Golf GTI's have always left me cold.
The R26 was just a perfect balance of everything, great power, handled sublimely, looked good (i thought), cost me £15k new, sold it a year later for £15k having not replaced a thing. I only sold it for an Elise when I didn't need to pay for an every day car anymore.
AX GT500
Saxo VTR Supercharged
Civic Type R EP3
Clio 182 Cup
Megane R26 F1
Very hard to pick a winner, a 205 GTI 1.9 is on my bucket list to own, but I have driven one and loved it.
Someone mentioned earlier about no cages or polycarbonate windows which I agree with. A hot hatch is an every day car that can put its hand down your trousers when needs to.
The best all rounder for me? The R26 (not the R26 R for reasons above, it's more a track car).
Best engine? EP3
Best handling? My lowered Saxo VTR, but stock the 182 Cup. However, the 182 Cup has a stupidly high seat for a tall chap like myself. I can fit in a Saxo, Elise, S2000 etc but the Clio was daft, which is a shame, but anyone should fit in a hot hatch IMO.
My AX GT500 was amazing and such fun. Just always felt it lacked grunt, even with a re jetted carb and race cam
Golf GTI's have always left me cold.
The R26 was just a perfect balance of everything, great power, handled sublimely, looked good (i thought), cost me £15k new, sold it a year later for £15k having not replaced a thing. I only sold it for an Elise when I didn't need to pay for an every day car anymore.
paultownsend said:
But it's not what a hot hatch is meant to be. I can't fit my Labrador in that!
Yes you could either in the back or on the passenger seat. I put all kinds of things in mine... Anyway a hatch back is merely a car with a hatch at the back.I vote for any clio 1X2 for best hatch. They are all pretty good with the trophy just ever so slightly king of the pile.
vtecyo said:
A 98 Spec JDM DC2 Integra Type R.
/thread.
ETA: In phoenix yellow if you're offering.
It's a COUPE /thread.
ETA: In phoenix yellow if you're offering.
The Integra, like the Corrado is a tough one to pigeon hole on the basis that they are both different shapes to the hatchbacks they are based on but unlike a traditional coupe which has a separate luggage area from the interior space both cars have boots which open up allowing access to the interior.
I think Toyota coined the term liftback for the AE86 which was coupe profile with a hatchback.
aka_kerrly said:
Good video … Playing devils advocate you will still find that someone will pipe up that even though they were slower the S2000 drivers were having more fun or some sort of rubbish.
Of course, this is PH after all. I also found the video even more enjoyable because the cars aren't being driven by a bunch of face-tweet-gen. IT dweebs-turned-journos ranting about understeer.scherzkeks said:
aka_kerrly said:
Good video … Playing devils advocate you will still find that someone will pipe up that even though they were slower the S2000 drivers were having more fun or some sort of rubbish.
Of course, this is PH after all. I also found the video even more enjoyable because the cars aren't being driven by a bunch of face-tweet-gen. IT dweebs-turned-journos ranting about understeer.
Dam right. I also enjoy the Japanese touge race videos where they compare a variety of cars and run time trials with each driver driving each car.
Sutton said:
The best all rounder for me? The R26 (not the R26 R for reasons above, it's more a track car).
The R26 was just a perfect balance of everything, great power, handled sublimely, looked good (i thought), cost me £15k new, sold it a year later for £15k having not replaced a thing. I only sold it for an Elise when I didn't need to pay for an every day car anymore.
Agreed! Although I am slightly biased, what colour/year was your R26?The R26 was just a perfect balance of everything, great power, handled sublimely, looked good (i thought), cost me £15k new, sold it a year later for £15k having not replaced a thing. I only sold it for an Elise when I didn't need to pay for an every day car anymore.
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