Advanced cycle stop lines, good idea?

Advanced cycle stop lines, good idea?

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Discussion

scorcher

3,986 posts

234 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Negative Creep said:
Generally seen as motorbike stop boxes arund these parts
Quite handy this time of year when in full leathers and its red hot. Means you haven't got to sit through 3 or 4 light changes. Filter to front and away.......... well as long as PC plod don't catch you.

Atmospheric

5,305 posts

208 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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I think I need to do a multiple whoosh parrot order for some posters here

4lf4-155

700 posts

243 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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When on a bike, If there is an advanced stop line I'll use it.

If there isn't one then I'll stop behind the vehicle which is first in the queue so if they turn left without indicating I don't get splatted.

If they get removed cyclists will still try and get to the front, some being sensible and doing what I do, many not and the argument that says removing them will reduce overtakes doesn't really work becuase cyclist will always 're-take' stationary traffic queues on approach to lights.

On balance I think they work well.

fangio

988 posts

234 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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All I can say is - Thank God for the Yorkshire moors!hehe

Dammit

3,790 posts

208 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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gavsdavs said:
The visible thing makes sense - I hadn't considered that.
Unfortunately they do end up being used by bicycles who want to get to the front and to block cars getting past them (probably for their own safety considerations), but cars accelerate faster than bicycles from a standstill.

I'm sure it's not being done to favour the bicycle over the car, but that's what the net effect is. Cars are forced to travel at the speed of the bicycle until they all get out of the main lane. When there are 5-6 of them abreast in front of you, that takes a while.

I would put bigger left hand lanes in wherever possible, even by sacrificing a car lane if that's possible - permit bikes to get to the front by their passage to it being free, but I do object to a bicycle coming down my left, then swinging out to being slap bang in front of me because there is a slower cyclist on the left they want to pass.

A single car lane (without parked cars or cyclists in it) with a bike lane beside it - will move better than a tight, dual lane road in the same space. Safer for cyclists. Keeps cars and bikes more separated. No jostling in and out of lanes by people wanting to game the inside lane to lights.
With regards to the speed thing- I travel from Forest Hill to Marylebone and back each day, at rush hour, at an average speed of around 15mph.

That's significantly faster than a car could do it - which means that in general I'm passing cars for most of my commute (bar drag strip sections like some of Brixton Road).

Therefore the net effect of cars following bikes would probably be to increase the cars average speed, as it'd reduce the peaks and increase the flow of traffic.

ch108

1,127 posts

133 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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7mike said:
HertsBiker said:
One of the joys of cycling is when I can wave a car past, when I can see round a corner that they can't. Makes me feel good to help the traffic flow. I have nothing to gain from misleading them, yet all benefit.
Just another pov; I'm 100% responsible for my actions therefore I'll hang back until I decide it's safe to overtake. No offence to the cyclist (or horse rider) who means well but tbh, I don't know you or what you can see ahead & I'll make my own decisions thanks.
Agreed. I don't like when cyclists try to wave me by. I'd rather make that decision myself. I was in a queue behind a group of 10 cyclists riding 2 abreast (which they are entitled to do). The cyclist at the rear on the outside was resorting to shouting at traffic that wouldn't pass on his command. This was on a 30mph road which had a fair bit of oncoming traffic, centre mounted keep left bollards and side road junctions. When it was my turn to pass this guy was red with rage. I ignored his shouting and frantic arm waving and passed when I decided it was safe to do so.

Martin4x4

6,506 posts

132 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Good idea or bad idea depends on perspective.

They are designed to reduce traffic flow, slow down and delay traffic to act as a discouragement to motorists. They are another form of traffic 'gate'. For none road tax paying cyclist they are good. Therefore as motorists they are bad, they also increase road pollution so are bad for residents.

saaby93

32,038 posts

178 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Martin4x4 said:
For none road tax paying cyclist they are good.
Well snuck in but I think we all know by now that no-one pays road tax, cyclist or otherwise
Now where are those squawky things

Mr Gear

9,416 posts

190 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Martin4x4 said:
Good idea or bad idea depends on perspective.

They are designed to reduce traffic flow, slow down and delay traffic to act as a discouragement to motorists. They are another form of traffic 'gate'. For none road tax paying cyclist they are good. Therefore as motorists they are bad, they also increase road pollution so are bad for residents.
Don't be an idiot.

jimbop1

2,441 posts

204 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Excellent idea!

Line all the cyclists up in front of all the cars at every traffic light.

It wouldn't work if cyclists couldn't get away quicker than cars though... They would block the road up.


Mr Gear

9,416 posts

190 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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In case you hadn't noticed, it's actually cars that cause traffic jams.

Urban Sports

11,321 posts

203 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Mr Gear said:
In case you hadn't noticed, it's actually cars that cause traffic jams.
Excellent, I must remember that next time I'm in a jam full of trucks rofl

Phatboy317

801 posts

118 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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They're so cyclists can be overtaken by the same cars twice - once before the lights, and once afterwards.
And if there's two sets of lights, that becomes three times.

Mr Gear

9,416 posts

190 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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If you're overtaking a cyclist and then getting stopped at a set of lights, what was the point in overtaking in the first place?

Urban Sports

11,321 posts

203 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Mr Gear said:
If you're overtaking a cyclist and then getting stopped at a set of lights, what was the point in overtaking in the first place?
To feel the thrill of acceleration.

Phatboy317

801 posts

118 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Mr Gear said:
If you're overtaking a cyclist and then getting stopped at a set of lights, what was the point in overtaking in the first place?
er, perhaps because they're going a good deal slower?
You don't always know if the next lights are going to stop you, do you?
Or perhaps they do always stop you - but then in that case isn't that the very problem?

Edited by Phatboy317 on Saturday 26th July 22:51

gavsdavs

1,203 posts

126 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Dammit said:
With regards to the speed thing- I travel from Forest Hill to Marylebone and back each day, at rush hour, at an average speed of around 15mph.

That's significantly faster than a car could do it - which means that in general I'm passing cars for most of my commute (bar drag strip sections like some of Brixton Road).

Therefore the net effect of cars following bikes would probably be to increase the cars average speed, as it'd reduce the peaks and increase the flow of traffic.
Firstly, you are very brave smile

Secondly - this kind of suggests we agree. We are not talking about 'average speed', though. Cars can accelerate to 30mph much quicker than a bike. Bikes can benefit from getting through smaller gaps which cars cannot use to hold a higher average speed. Any car turning right to cross a lane of traffic impacts a car waitig to go straight on, but not a bike.

I would rather they allocate better, wider lanes to bikes and fewer, better lanes to cars so the two don't have to mix. This isn't so cars can go faster, but because it's safer for bikes and less frustrating for cars to have bikes in their way.

Huff

3,155 posts

191 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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I've no problem with the cycle stop zones for the reasons they are designed to meet (as a car driver and cyclist etc)

The trouble is, in Bristol at least, an education issue. The zones at a red seem to fill instantly with 49cc scooters who are nowhere near as brisk as the fartcan exhausts suggest, who proceed to do cyclists no favours - and (one-foot-out, fast stylee) then hold up the rest of the traffic to the next stop, having weaved and bounced between the streams to get to the front.

(Must add, I've no problem with bikers filtering - I would - and happily move left in advance to support them do so)

jimbop1

2,441 posts

204 months

Saturday 26th July 2014
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Mr Gear said:
If you're overtaking a cyclist and then getting stopped at a set of lights, what was the point in overtaking in the first place?
So that traffic can flow?

Mr Gear

9,416 posts

190 months

Sunday 27th July 2014
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No.