Autocar M3 vs D3

[unpc]

I don't normally read Clarkson but in his review of the M4, he suggested that BMW only had their "B" team working on this as the best blokes were on other projects. bks of course but all the reviews seem to have damned this car with faint praise. Not their best effort it would seem.

[Guvernator]

In previous times I'd have said there is no way on earth you could compare any diesel to an M car. Yes there may have been instances where a tuned diesel ( mapped 335d ) could be almost as quick but in every other way that counts, they were nowhere near as enjoyable.

However with a move to what is essentially a breathed on 335i engine and an altogether softer, quieter M car, it appears this is now no longer the case. I guess this it what happens when you allow the marketing men to dumb down the M3.

[nottyash]

I drove an m4 and actually liked the noise.
Certainly on my list of cars to own.
That d3 is impressive though

[ORD]

To my mind, these tests tell us that the D3 is not miles worse in speed and stopping. I agree that the stop test isn't particularly illuminating given that a very minor difference in starting pressure, road surface, etc will make more than a few metres difference.

However, the M3 looked much much flatter and more neutral in the corners (until it oversteered, which is what the driver was trying to make it do) than the D3, which looked a bit wallowy in comparison. I can tell just by watching which would be the most enjoyable to drive, and it aint the D3.

The sound of the M3 is average (because it is tc), but the sound of the D3 is woeful.

Still not a hard choice.

[B3MX5]

mike-r said:

Can you imagine having to defend your M3 by saying 'it was in the wrong mode' or 'I have more fuel than you', seems pretty gay.

Don't understand how the similarities between two cars can be compared to being gay, unless we're in a playground in the 1980's.

This video has been discussed extensively elsewhere, and it's fair to say that it's not the truest or most unbiased of tests. As someone who's a fan (and owner) of Alpina, and also an M fan, it is swayed favourably towards the D3. It doesn't change some undeniable things though:

The D3 is very quick
We all know the M3 is ultimately quicker (ignoring speed-limiters)
This M3 does sound ste when extended
A comparison with a B3 would have been more relevant than the D3, or had all three together

I still think the relationship between Alpina and M is significant. They're maybe closer than ever on an engineering perspective, but M still are the more raw, driver focused experience, perfect at 10/10's, whist Alpina excel at up to 9/10's driving which possibly suits more people.

[ORD]

B3MX5 said:

mike-r said:

Can you imagine having to defend your M3 by saying 'it was in the wrong mode' or 'I have more fuel than you', seems pretty gay.

Don't understand how the similarities between two cars can be compared to being gay, unless we're in a playground in the 1980's.

This video has been discussed extensively elsewhere, and it's fair to say that it's not the truest or most unbiased of tests. As someone who's a fan (and owner) of Alpina, and also an M fan, it is swayed favourably towards the D3. It doesn't change some undeniable things though:

The D3 is very quick
We all know the M3 is ultimately quicker (ignoring speed-limiters)
This M3 does sound ste when extended
A comparison with a B3 would have been more relevant than the D3, or had all three together

I still think the relationship between Alpina and M is significant. They're maybe closer than ever on an engineering perspective, but M still are the more raw, driver focused experience, perfect at 10/10's, whist Alpina excel at up to 9/10's driving which possibly suits more people.

Not sure about 9/10ths. 7/10ths at most. It will understeer and roll at fairly moderate speeds and will sound pretty dull at 3/4 throttle.

[Daniel1]

B3MX5 said:

mike-r said:

Can you imagine having to defend your M3 by saying 'it was in the wrong mode' or 'I have more fuel than you', seems pretty gay.

Don't understand how the similarities between two cars can be compared to being gay, unless we're in a playground in the 1980's.

gay is modern slang for rubbish.

[Soupie69uk]

I was quite surprised at how well the new D3 performed against the M3. The M3 looks better to me but I do think the Alpina's have a nice appeal. I imagine day to day the Alpina will be the better car as it is not as compromised. I also imagine that the majority of people considering an M3 will not know what an Alpina is or even consider one. Maybe Alipna are edging back closer to BMW M's as they did a few generations ago. I do not mind the sound of the new M3 but compared with ones of old it does not sound that special.

Would be interesting to see what BMW make of all the reviews. Will be interesting when the new C class AMG comes up against it.

I could believe that some engineers were moved across to the i8 as this is an important car for the brand where as the M3 is well established and will be popular whatever as a lot of people will never take them past 8/10ths anyway. So long as it looks good and is fast they will be quite content.

[Harji]

Not a fan of either, but what's missing is there are probably more auxiliary components to the diesel to make it perform they way it does than the M3.

[anonymous-user]

All this tells you really is that the "gap" between normal cars and "sports saloons" is now pretty small.

Back in the day, a sports model had much stiffer suspension, wider tyres, was lower, probably had at least 100bhp more and was lighter. These days, the "cooking" models all have that already, and hence, the cars are now very similar. Having said that, if you compare say an old E46 330i and M3, i bet in a non objective test there would be surprisingly little in it, except in straight line pace where the non turbo cars needed expensive mods to make significantly more power. Now that everything is Turbo'd the cooking cars have plenty of power and torque, even the Dervs!

Today, i'd suggest that you need to move into a proper "sports car" like a 911 for example to leverage significant fundamental architectural improvements to see any measurable improvement in dynamics/performance.