Driverless cars in the UK

[defblade]

2 problems here for me:

1) I can't help but remember Volvo's demonstration of their automatic braking system

2) My 13 year old car has a series of problems with its electrics, and it's not alone. There are plenty of tales, just on here even, of new cars with technology faults. Are these cars really going to be working properly (ie, safely) in 13 years time? 10 years? 8? 5? Will there be an expiry date on them, beyond which the manufacturers won't guarantee them working correctly?

[Finlandia]

kambites said:

Finlandia said:

But their roundabouts go the other way around

It'd he quite odd if they didn't!

OT

When I worked at Gatwick, there was a strike amongst the baggage handlers of one company, so US airliners brought their own handlers on the flights to offload and load the aircrafts, I bet you can see where this is heading?

Half the baggage trucks drove on the right and half on the left, half of them went clockwise in roundabouts the other half anticlockwise.

[Negative Creep]

Hoofy said:

defblade said:

Hoofy said:

Can't wait. Obviously, pointless for a trackday but my regular dull commutes, I'd rather do something more interesting.

Commute by motorbike

... and not risk death by drivers who consider cars appliances.

Until motorbikes get banned from the roads

[Crafty_]

kambites said:

Crafty_ said:

In that case joe public are even less likely to accept it imho and I'd be amazed if such a car comes to mass production with no overrides.

They're going into (very limited) production for the US market later this year, I believe. I think mass production will come quite quickly because it will mean people don't need to learn to drive.

Still can't see it happening here, I can't see the EU allowing for completely automated cars with no override and the human will be deemed as in charge of the vehicle so there is someone to blame in case of accident and you'll need a licence to be "in charge" of the vehicle.

Aside from that I think manufacturers will want to offer a vehicle that can drive itself but also be manually controlled.

I still don't see the benefit personally..

[TTmonkey]

This technology offers a greater threat to the driver of cars than the likes of the speed campaigners and saftey camera brigade.

By definition, even if you have a 'mnual override' fitted to these cars allowing you to take over, what it also gives the government is all the infrastructure and reporting/controlling technologies that they need to stop all kinds of 'fun' driving.

These automated cars will have sensors and reporting systems that will tell exactly where the car is, has been, what speed its driven at, how its driven etc. This will be used by the insurance companies to price 'dangerous' drivers off the road. Any law infringements will be automatically monitored and reported and you'll recive your ban imidiatly.

Eventually the only way to travel will be to allow the car full control, and you'll be nothing but a passenger unable to interact with the car, and you'll go everywhere by the most direct and efficient route, at the most efficiant speed.

Drving as we know it will eventually be a thing of the past. Old non automated cars will be forced off the road by taxes and law changes, as they will be dirty, dangerous and damaging.

Its inevitable.

[kambites]

Crafty_ said:

Still can't see it happening here, I can't see the EU allowing for completely automated cars with no override and the human will be deemed as in charge of the vehicle so there is someone to blame in case of accident and you'll need a licence to be "in charge" of the vehicle.

Aside from that I think manufacturers will want to offer a vehicle that can drive itself but also be manually controlled.

I still don't see the benefit personally..

I'm fairly confident that you're wrong, but it remains to be seen.

[Hoofy]

Negative Creep said:

Hoofy said:

defblade said:

Hoofy said:

Can't wait. Obviously, pointless for a trackday but my regular dull commutes, I'd rather do something more interesting.

Commute by motorbike

... and not risk death by drivers who consider cars appliances.

Until motorbikes get banned from the roads

I have a business idea... RIDERLESS MOTORBIKES! Gonna patent it before Google think of it.

[thinkofaname]

Rick Cutler said:

I personally don't like this idea, Give it 10 years and we won't be able to drive our own cars any-more, Slowly there will be driver-less cars only permitted on the roads Monday to Friday, then Sunday will be added, eventually the joy of driving will be all gone.

I'm sure some people will keep Ferrari barchettas, possibly red, hidden in barns somewhere, and sneak out at weekends for an illegal spin.

[Dbest92]

I wonder how these driverless cars would get on in say:
- single tracks country lanes, can't imagine them pulling right into a hedge/reversing
- adverse weather? Snow/floods etc
- also say on private land? No satnav/gps for routes, how would it know where to go etc?

[kambites]

Dbest92 said:

I wonder how these driverless cars would get on in say:
- single tracks country lanes, can't imagine them pulling right into a hedge/reversing
- adverse weather? Snow/floods etc
- also say on private land? No satnav/gps for routes, how would it know where to go etc?

The same way a human driver would in all three cases I'd imagine. Navigation is via GPS but actual situational awareness is visual.

[Crafty_]

kambites said:

I'm fairly confident that you're wrong, but it remains to be seen.

Indeed it does, if you are correct presumably anyone will be allowed to drive? 5 year olds going to school for example ?

Who insures the car ? who is liable in an accident ? what happens with the GPS maps are out of date or not compliant (e.g. a contraflow in operation) or a road is closed temporarily ?

The idea that the car becomes a completely autonomous thing and no interaction is needed is a nice idea, but in reality I think a human will always be needed - for example, it'd be easy to completely automate our train network, but we still have a guy hanging on to dead mans handle..

[Mr Will]

Rick Cutler said:

I personally don't like this idea, Give it 10 years and we won't be able to drive our own cars any-more, Slowly there will be driver-less cars only permitted on the roads Monday to Friday, then Sunday will be added, eventually the joy of driving will be all gone.

Name one form of transport that has happened to in the past.

[AA999]

I'm interested in how the law is going to change to allow these robots on to the road and mix with 'normal' driving.

At the moment the law states that one should be in full control of the vehicle and drive to an acceptable standard at all times.
If you are not in 'control', ie. no hands on the wheel and no feet on the brakes, making full attentive decisions based on conditions ahead, then the law change is going to have some interesting wording to accommodate computer driven cars which remove the human decision elements.

Also with computer driven cars, when it comes to computer/programming error or viruses, who would be to blame if a mother and child were to get run over at a pedestrian crossing? (can this event be totally 'solved' through software/hardware?)

Would there have to be a 'get out clause' in the law to force the person in the 'driving seat' to start driving if they notice something going wrong? - putting the liability on to the person in the 'driving seat'? - or would the company who issued the software/hardware be at fault?


I think it is going to go down the line that once the technology is up to a certain standard that all human drivers will be banned, and only fully robotic cars will be given license to use public roads.

The future is bleak.

[CTrickle]

This could be excellent. Can I drive to the pub in one. Drink freely then get it to drive me home?

WIN WIN!

[Rick Cutler]

Mr Will said:

Name one form of transport that has happened to in the past.

People who want to ride horses and tow a cart are still allowed. We haven't banned them! Driving standards are soo bad now I think this is to stop us driving all together.

[y2blade]

Hoofy said:

Can't wait. Obviously, pointless for a trackday but my regular dull commutes, I'd rather do something more interesting.

+1 I've said it for years, I'd love to be able to push a button and let the car do some of the driving for me.


bring it on

[Mr Will]

Crafty_ said:

But I don't really see the point. I can't see average joe saying "Yep, I'll have one of those, it can drive me to work in the morning". Why ? its not saving any time. I bet that laws will say that the human "driver" must sit and monitor the system and be ready to jump in and take over in cases of emergency.. in which case you might as well drive anyway?

I'd love one. My commute (if I drive) consists of 45 minutes of sitting in stop-start traffic. I'd much rather let the car deal with it while I sit back and read a book/watch a movie/whatever.

Even better if the law reaches a point where I can send it home again by itself once I get there to avoid paying for parking and so that SWMBO can use it during the day.

Better again if I can then summon it to the pub later to take me home after I've had a skinful.

All of these are legal issues rather than technical ones, but they will come with time.

[Hatchoo]

kambites said:

Crafty_ said:

Still can't see it happening here, I can't see the EU allowing for completely automated cars with no override and the human will be deemed as in charge of the vehicle so there is someone to blame in case of accident and you'll need a licence to be "in charge" of the vehicle.

Aside from that I think manufacturers will want to offer a vehicle that can drive itself but also be manually controlled.

I still don't see the benefit personally..

I'm fairly confident that you're wrong, but it remains to be seen.

I'm fairly confident that governments would prefer the general populace not to be in charge of cars. CO2 emissions, congestion and road deaths would all be reduced as a consequence.

I like the idea of the driverless trackday special that laps far more quickly than you could, leaving you free to lie back and browse Pistonheads or walk to a nearby pub perhaps.

[TTmonkey]

CTrickle said:

This could be excellent. Can I drive to the pub in one. Drink freely then get it to drive me home?

WIN WIN!

The current law says no. You will still be in charge of a motor vehicle, therefore the police will be able to stop the car and force you to do a breath test, which you will fail, and then you will be banned. You wont be allowed to use your driverless car, as to use one you will still need a full valid drivers license.

Those that beleive this is a free taxi ride home for piss heads from the pub are rather silly.

[IanCress]

Hatchoo said:

I like the idea of the driverless trackday special that laps far more quickly than you could, leaving you free to lie back and browse Pistonheads or walk to a nearby pub perhaps.

Who on earth would do that!? It would be like going to a gig, and instead of watching it, filming it on your ipad to watch later. Nobody does th.... oh, hang on