RE: Pay per view: PH Blog
Discussion
EggsBenedict said:
1) It says something about the general malaise that this country finds itself in where people expect something for nothing.
2) It also says something when people aspire to earn a decent whack by using their talents to then buy the things that make them happy, and people resent them for that. Just feck off to North Korea if you want some sort of communist utopia.
3) It also says something when people who haven't the cojones to start their own enterprise take a pop from the sidelines.
4) You'll find out how much it's worth only be trying. Same thing with EVO. I don't think it's worth the money compared to other stuff, so I buy other stuff - opportunity cost.
Good for you, Chris - good luck in your enterprise, and I hope you make a success of it. We need more entrepreneurs, not fewer.
Here here. Subscribed to 12 months. Done. I'd pay £25 a year just to have ITV removed from my TV.2) It also says something when people aspire to earn a decent whack by using their talents to then buy the things that make them happy, and people resent them for that. Just feck off to North Korea if you want some sort of communist utopia.
3) It also says something when people who haven't the cojones to start their own enterprise take a pop from the sidelines.
4) You'll find out how much it's worth only be trying. Same thing with EVO. I don't think it's worth the money compared to other stuff, so I buy other stuff - opportunity cost.
Good for you, Chris - good luck in your enterprise, and I hope you make a success of it. We need more entrepreneurs, not fewer.
Edited by justboxsters on Thursday 31st July 14:45
trickywoo said:
Check next year.RacerMike said:
EVO has a general theme of performance cars and generally follow their mantra of 'for the love of driving'. Buying a car magazine is generally about buying a general 'theme'. In other words, it's like buying 50 Chris Harris videos in one go for £3, not 1 Chris Harris video with 49 others about American Muscle Cars, Motorbikes, Tuner Cars, Racing News etc.
Just because you think the /Drive model is a good one, doesn't make my analogy rubbish. You don't have to agree with it, but I think it's pretty clear that the analogy I have used is indeed relevant to the situation we have. Most people's negative comments are directed towards the fact they're paying for a couple of Chris Harris videos and a lot of stuff they're not interested in. If you take it to the individual magazine level, would you buy GQ just to read a car review by Jason Barlow?
I have bought magazines because there was one article I had a particular interest in on quite a few occasions. If I could have bought one article from those Magazines it would have been more convenient and it’s possible my overall spending on printed media would increase if that was an option. That does not change the fact that that is not the way the magazine model currently works. Just because you think the /Drive model is a good one, doesn't make my analogy rubbish. You don't have to agree with it, but I think it's pretty clear that the analogy I have used is indeed relevant to the situation we have. Most people's negative comments are directed towards the fact they're paying for a couple of Chris Harris videos and a lot of stuff they're not interested in. If you take it to the individual magazine level, would you buy GQ just to read a car review by Jason Barlow?
/Drive has a theme of performance cars with an emphasis on American and modified cars, this may not be a theme you like but it is a theme. It sounds like it's a Magazine you wouldn't buy.
It is true that I think the /Drive model is a good one and you are entirely correct in saying that doesn't make your analogy rubbish. I think your analogy is rubbish because the magazine model is so far removed from the pay per article model you suggest in the end of your post and so closely related to the Drive+ model.
Whether the magazine model is the best one for Drive+ is a separate issue.
RacerMike said:
Unlike the usual PH thread revolving around the kind of comment 'I hate that Range Rover, I'd never buy it, I'm happy with my MX5', for once, all the people making the comments are actual potential customers....
Very well put 
. Starting a discussion here before committing to the YT sub model would also have made their choice more transparent / and perhaps that would have created less bickering than we have now? Not sure.What I do know: I'd pay. But I'd want to know how much goes into YT's pockets. And YT would have to let me. On top of paying for the content I can't be arxxed to look for a decent VPN provider just to get around the geo-IP kack.
Kolbenkopp said:
On top of paying for the content I can't be arxxed to look for a decent VPN provider just to get around the geo-IP kack.
That wouldn’t help anyway because Youtube’s payment system blocks credit card numbers (and Paypal accounts!) from any of the "unsupported" countries. All the touted VPN solutions and browser extensions still won’t let you sign up. Evidently the people suggesting those solutions haven’t tried them.
A few things:
1) Advertising clients do not want to pay for "viral potential". They want to KNOW they have eyeballs, and how many. Not that they might have some and little definite idea of how many.
2) Youtube, in fact online in general, is a notoriously INEFFECTIVE marketing channel for PAID for advertising. Blank ads have a measurably greater click through. And as display advertising, it's crummy low rent stuff that does not warrant any serious investment. Nobody had more views than Facebook and they didn't get it right until their ads were consistently interruptive. ie…like TV. And yes, everyone knows of a success story or two, but nobody can remember the tens of thousands of failures that happen every month.
3) In the US the internet is losing ground to TV. Yup…good old conventional TV. Viewing is now at its highest point in recorded history. And advertisers are seeing reliable data between TV viewing and effectiveness.
4) Subscription is the only long term solution, if it's a solution at all, that anyone can currently foresee. Second-screening, interactivity etc…etc…has proved to be so much hokum. Nice in theory….but in practice nobody can be bothered.
Personally, I'll be watching in rapt fascination. If subscription works for Drive+, it'll be one of the few success stories for online publishing, and worthy of high praise.
The very best of luck.
1) Advertising clients do not want to pay for "viral potential". They want to KNOW they have eyeballs, and how many. Not that they might have some and little definite idea of how many.
2) Youtube, in fact online in general, is a notoriously INEFFECTIVE marketing channel for PAID for advertising. Blank ads have a measurably greater click through. And as display advertising, it's crummy low rent stuff that does not warrant any serious investment. Nobody had more views than Facebook and they didn't get it right until their ads were consistently interruptive. ie…like TV. And yes, everyone knows of a success story or two, but nobody can remember the tens of thousands of failures that happen every month.
3) In the US the internet is losing ground to TV. Yup…good old conventional TV. Viewing is now at its highest point in recorded history. And advertisers are seeing reliable data between TV viewing and effectiveness.
4) Subscription is the only long term solution, if it's a solution at all, that anyone can currently foresee. Second-screening, interactivity etc…etc…has proved to be so much hokum. Nice in theory….but in practice nobody can be bothered.
Personally, I'll be watching in rapt fascination. If subscription works for Drive+, it'll be one of the few success stories for online publishing, and worthy of high praise.
The very best of luck.
Beefmeister said:
Yep. Petrolicious is almost certainly going PPV. Smoking Tyre wouldn't be surprising.
I doubt Autocar will though, unless they get rid of that awful pseudo-rock intro to their vids, then maybe.
You know - I've pitched some stuff at them. It was all going rather swimmingly and we had a number of tracks to be decided via Ed Keohane. But nobody stays in one place long enough to make a decision on anything at Haymarket. That's why the Godawful music is still there! I'll chase that up now - thanks for reminding me...I doubt Autocar will though, unless they get rid of that awful pseudo-rock intro to their vids, then maybe.
I wont be subscribing.
For three reasons:-
1) I feel its expensive. If I see some of the longer length videos during the free trial it might change my mind but compared to Netflix or magazines (Evo is great value for money) etc, it doesnt seem like content value to me.
2) I`d much rather pay per view on an individual video as I dont watch much other drive content.
3) I dont want to encourage subscription at these prices. If it works for drive, everyone will charge $25 a year. I agree $25 a year isnt much, but as someone already pointed out 25+25+25........ is a huge amount. An iTunes format would be better so you can dip in an out of various channels as you see fit. But YT doesnt work like that.
I feel for Drive. Its stuck between a rock and a hard place. But its not for me at the moment.
For three reasons:-
1) I feel its expensive. If I see some of the longer length videos during the free trial it might change my mind but compared to Netflix or magazines (Evo is great value for money) etc, it doesnt seem like content value to me.
2) I`d much rather pay per view on an individual video as I dont watch much other drive content.
3) I dont want to encourage subscription at these prices. If it works for drive, everyone will charge $25 a year. I agree $25 a year isnt much, but as someone already pointed out 25+25+25........ is a huge amount. An iTunes format would be better so you can dip in an out of various channels as you see fit. But YT doesnt work like that.
I feel for Drive. Its stuck between a rock and a hard place. But its not for me at the moment.
I've been watching the Drive videos since they first appeared and I was immediately drawn into the whole thing. I watch nearly all of the content as it comes along and found it is always interesting and well produced and has a slightly different angle and feel than the likes of Top Gear and I much prefer Drive to the other channels like Jay Leno (which I do like) or any of the car mag channels except Evo. Only Evo is up there with Drive and both are similar. I subscribe to Evo and am happy with that and I am more than happy to pay £2.49 a month for Drive as I enjoy it. No adverts and no sponsorship is the only way to go too. You can't produce credible content with an industry sponsor and I hate all adverts with a passion. When stuff is free, I get we need ads but given the choice I'd have no ads and a small charge for stuff I think is worth it.
I also believe that my £2.49 each month (and come on folks, no matter your income this is a tiny amount of money!) will enable Drive to grow and produce better content and more of it. A subscription like this should improve content I already enjoy and give them the chance to pay out for facilities, equipment and staff to really allow it to take off. I'd have paid for the content on Drive a long time ago to be frank. The Harris stuff is great, but Big Muscle and Tuned are different to what else I see out there and then you've got the likes of Inside Koenigsegg which was superb and incredibly interesting.
In short, I think it's more than worth the cost and that paying will give them more clout and improve future content by increasing budgets and also allow the people who put the work in to earn something they deserve from it.
If you don't want to subscribe, don't. But don't be throwing blame at them for trying to make it a viable, better structured business and also offer more to those viewers who want to see it. My subscription is in and I'm happy about it.
I also believe that my £2.49 each month (and come on folks, no matter your income this is a tiny amount of money!) will enable Drive to grow and produce better content and more of it. A subscription like this should improve content I already enjoy and give them the chance to pay out for facilities, equipment and staff to really allow it to take off. I'd have paid for the content on Drive a long time ago to be frank. The Harris stuff is great, but Big Muscle and Tuned are different to what else I see out there and then you've got the likes of Inside Koenigsegg which was superb and incredibly interesting.
In short, I think it's more than worth the cost and that paying will give them more clout and improve future content by increasing budgets and also allow the people who put the work in to earn something they deserve from it.
If you don't want to subscribe, don't. But don't be throwing blame at them for trying to make it a viable, better structured business and also offer more to those viewers who want to see it. My subscription is in and I'm happy about it.
Edited by andyp79 on Thursday 31st July 15:58
EricE said:
That wouldn’t help anyway because Youtube’s payment system blocks credit card numbers (and Paypal accounts!) from any of the "unsupported" countries.
All the touted VPN solutions and browser extensions still won’t let you sign up. Evidently the people suggesting those solutions haven’t tried them.
Presumably you'd just use your UK credit card if you were that keen? Or wait till someone else re-hosts it? In the case of ex-pats. I'm not that keen and obviously won't be paying given the fact it's a big big world out there with lots of other free content to consume. I wouldn't steal the content either- I live outside the UK and my interest in the BBC and it's content is now zero as I can't access it easily. I suspect the same will happen with 'drive'- that said my interest level in that was pretty low outside a couple of CH's videos.All the touted VPN solutions and browser extensions still won’t let you sign up. Evidently the people suggesting those solutions haven’t tried them.
jon- said:
As I have a youtube channel it won't let me subscribe, I have to switch back to my personal profile first.
This sounds easy, but given my PC, laptop, 2 x TV, phone, tablet etc are all signed into my channel account, as that's where I manage all my subscriptions, that's a ball ache.
I had this problem too. It was a total pain but it's google / YouTube issue I think. I was forced to have a gmail address and then ended up with my own channel / account and my website channel account. It is a ballache but I figured it out in the end. They (google) need to fix this as it makes no sense.This sounds easy, but given my PC, laptop, 2 x TV, phone, tablet etc are all signed into my channel account, as that's where I manage all my subscriptions, that's a ball ache.
I thought the entire point of free internet was that revenue was made from mining my data and shoving adverts down my neck.
So now they want me to pay AND mine my data, AND shove adverts down my neck?
It wouldn't be such a problem but there ARE good channels out there that are free and seem to manage by just using the conventional income sources for this type of media.
As per impartiality of being independent of advert revenue, surely eventually if you say honest things you just won't get given cars to begin with? It's hard to make videos if you can't get access to the cars to begin with?
Surely being impartial is almost impossible if you want early access to premium cars?
Thus why not just get advertising revenue off manufacturers?
Probably more complex than that... but I think going it totally alone is rather bonkers.
Or consumables sponsorship. Ie, Oils, tyres, tuning products etc... surely they'll pay more to have their adverts baked into the videos?
Dave
So now they want me to pay AND mine my data, AND shove adverts down my neck?
It wouldn't be such a problem but there ARE good channels out there that are free and seem to manage by just using the conventional income sources for this type of media.
As per impartiality of being independent of advert revenue, surely eventually if you say honest things you just won't get given cars to begin with? It's hard to make videos if you can't get access to the cars to begin with?
Surely being impartial is almost impossible if you want early access to premium cars?
Thus why not just get advertising revenue off manufacturers?
Probably more complex than that... but I think going it totally alone is rather bonkers.
Or consumables sponsorship. Ie, Oils, tyres, tuning products etc... surely they'll pay more to have their adverts baked into the videos?
Dave
Motorrad said:
Presumably you'd just use your UK credit card if you were that keen? Or wait till someone else re-hosts it? In the case of ex-pats.
Works for UK ex-pats. Not for Austrian ex-pats . Workaround could be a pre-paid CC from a supported country. Getting a bit complicated...Motorrad said:
I live outside the UK and my interest in the BBC and it's content is now zero as I can't access it easily. I suspect the same will happen with 'drive'- that said my interest level in that was pretty low outside a couple of CH's videos.
We'll I used to look forward to their stuff. Some of their previous pieces are (IMVHO) worth the 25 GBP alone. But I suppose it will be the same regarding my interest level. Would not want to be without BBC though, worth it just for the F1 (even if they only show half of it now which suxxors). In .NL and western .DE you just need a regular dish pointed at Astra 28.2E.
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