RE: Pay per view: PH Blog
Discussion
Watcha said:
I will probably subscribe, but will be annoyed if they don't do all they can to protect the media, it sure will grate if you can watch it elsewhere for free a few weeks later.
The problem is a much bigger one, episodes aired on NBC Sports (and thus promptly pirated) will be available one week BEFORE people with the paid youtube subscription service can see them.ogrimwood said:
I will be subscribing as I absolute love Monkey's work, but I can't help feel that he'd be better branching off and doing it himself because especially across this side of the pond, the majority of /Drive subscriptions are for his work only and not the American muscle drivel. That way Monkey could lower prices, gain more followers and make his work more financially viable than being connected with the /Drive network.
seconded. I'd say 75% of all subs will come from him alone, who in his right mind would pay money to see Spinelli on camera. (no offense but think about it)Edited by swimd on Wednesday 30th July 13:56
I'm in the "in-favour" camp- it's perfectly reasonable to want a long-term project to at least fund itself, regardless of your personal circumstances. Tricky situation though...
It would be interesting to know exactly how much further beyond the PistonHeads community Drive actually goes now, to gauge where it can go in the future. I'd imagine Dave has enough people clamouring for them to fund their TV shows without "yet another car programme", as they'll be seeing it. So unless there's a concrete plan for national exposure to rival their other earners I'm sure they won't pay any attention, no matter how much of an improvement we think it would be.
Could additional investment be sought for private advertising within the shows? Sounds like it's already been looked but I'd imagine it would be difficult to put a business plan in place that would satisfy potential investors at this stage- too many unknowns at this point.
So then in the short term it comes back to crowd funding in one way or another, and probably to state the obvious, the responses so far reflect reality- a handful of people will happily pay the subscription regardless; more would pay if the cost was a little less, and another handful only want free stuff. For me right now I have a lot of outgoings, value for money for me would be relative to a car magazine- in those you get a whole load of articles on different topics from everyday mundanity to hypercar excellence... I'd expect a Drive subscription to reflect a similar breadth x depth for the money (i.e. narrower breadth needs greater depth).
It would be interesting to know exactly how much further beyond the PistonHeads community Drive actually goes now, to gauge where it can go in the future. I'd imagine Dave has enough people clamouring for them to fund their TV shows without "yet another car programme", as they'll be seeing it. So unless there's a concrete plan for national exposure to rival their other earners I'm sure they won't pay any attention, no matter how much of an improvement we think it would be.
Could additional investment be sought for private advertising within the shows? Sounds like it's already been looked but I'd imagine it would be difficult to put a business plan in place that would satisfy potential investors at this stage- too many unknowns at this point.
So then in the short term it comes back to crowd funding in one way or another, and probably to state the obvious, the responses so far reflect reality- a handful of people will happily pay the subscription regardless; more would pay if the cost was a little less, and another handful only want free stuff. For me right now I have a lot of outgoings, value for money for me would be relative to a car magazine- in those you get a whole load of articles on different topics from everyday mundanity to hypercar excellence... I'd expect a Drive subscription to reflect a similar breadth x depth for the money (i.e. narrower breadth needs greater depth).
TheAntics said:
steve_n said:
£24.99 a year is too much based on the numbers outlined. All of a sudden this has the opportunity to turn into a multi-million pound pocket liner when all it would take to support the costs of these shoots is say £1 per person per year.
This is a shame as I really like Chris's work, there's nothing else quite like it as most other journos who try to do the same thing are simply too annoying to listen to!
I disagree....after a very quick look Drive channel produces c.8 videos per month (it varies but looks about right on average) this is across the various program formats, not just Harris videos.This is a shame as I really like Chris's work, there's nothing else quite like it as most other journos who try to do the same thing are simply too annoying to listen to!
Using the only info we have let's use £9k costs as an average cost per program. As described £9k only just covers costs for Chris so it seems fair.
That's £72k per month or £864,000 per year. Let's call the subscription £25 for the sake of argument.
Drive needs 34,560 subscribers to make this work. The current viewing figures do not represent future subscribers numbers as it is currently free content. I'd be interested to know what proportion of viewers they expect to convert to subscribers. If I was looking at it my guess would be 34K would be exceptionally difficult to gain.
One positive thing about monetising the channel would mean that each video would need to earn it's keep. I personally rarely enjoy the other content and mainly only view harris on cars. If Harris videos prove to be more popular generally then you would expect more of them to be made at the expense of the other poorly viewed content.
I'd love to see the graph of "Subscription cost vs Subscriber numbers". There must be a maximal point on that graph, but boy oh boy that point is difficult to guess!
(ie, make it £2 a month, get 10k subscribers, make is £1 a month and get 20k subscribers, the income is the same, but you have a wider subscriber base......)
(ie, make it £2 a month, get 10k subscribers, make is £1 a month and get 20k subscribers, the income is the same, but you have a wider subscriber base......)
Completely the right decision Mr H.
The quality of Drive videos is way above that of anything else on YT. Just look at views for the P1 vid versus Autocar/Evo..
Almost all decent content on the web is now protected by paywall, the Economist, FT, Spectator, Times, etc.. My Times subscription is circa £30 per month - £25 per year is a bargain (especially when one considers the BBC tax is £145!).
You can't expect Drive to produce content as an act of charity to the world, and with the the frequency & quality of Chris' videos (and the others) £25 for a year seems very much worth it.
The quality of Drive videos is way above that of anything else on YT. Just look at views for the P1 vid versus Autocar/Evo..
Almost all decent content on the web is now protected by paywall, the Economist, FT, Spectator, Times, etc.. My Times subscription is circa £30 per month - £25 per year is a bargain (especially when one considers the BBC tax is £145!).
You can't expect Drive to produce content as an act of charity to the world, and with the the frequency & quality of Chris' videos (and the others) £25 for a year seems very much worth it.
Edited by commandprompt on Wednesday 30th July 13:59
If people are prepared to pay to watch good programming, why the hell shouldn't they charge? Even more so if the thing is running at a loss at the moment.
Personally, I hope that you make pots of money from this venture and spend it all on lots of silly car-based fun and games for me to live vicariously through.
I find it strange and sad that in certain industries it is considered "dirty" to make money from what you do (artists, journalists, musicians to a lesser degree). People at the top of the game should be allowed to make money from it without being considered a sell out.
Personally, I hope that you make pots of money from this venture and spend it all on lots of silly car-based fun and games for me to live vicariously through.
I find it strange and sad that in certain industries it is considered "dirty" to make money from what you do (artists, journalists, musicians to a lesser degree). People at the top of the game should be allowed to make money from it without being considered a sell out.
I was an Evo print subscriber for years but didn't bother to renew a few months ago as I found I was just flicking through it most months. I've got a Netflix sub that costs me £5.99/mth that I rarely watch anything on, even though I keep saying I'll catch up with all the series I've missed. So, time to cancel that, ask for some box sets for Christmas and and sign up to Drive+. For the cost of half a pint of "premium" lager (in a London pub) per month. Seems reasonable to me.
Edited by cwinterb on Wednesday 30th July 13:59
cwinterb said:
I was an Evo print subscriber for years but didn't bother to renew a few months ago as I found I was just flicking through it most months. I've got a Netflix sub that costs me £5.99/mth that I rarely watch anything on, even though I keep saying I'll catch up with all the series I've missed. So, time to cancel that, ask for some box sets for Christmas and and sign up to Drive+. For the cost of half a pint of "premium" lager (in A London pub) per month. Seems reasonable to me.
In a perfect world /Drive would be hosted and paid for by Netflix... 
V8 FOU said:
Ooh, FFS! £24.99 a YEAR. That is F all. Pay per view? Oh dear.
For such a piffling ammount I would happily pay that for 5 videos per year......
You all need to MTFU. If you want to see Chris's excellent videos, then the amount asked is very little. If you think it is too expensive, then carry on watching the endless dire TG repeats on Dave etc.
Exactly my thoughts. For such a piffling ammount I would happily pay that for 5 videos per year......
You all need to MTFU. If you want to see Chris's excellent videos, then the amount asked is very little. If you think it is too expensive, then carry on watching the endless dire TG repeats on Dave etc.
robbieduncan said:
Is there some guarantee of the amount of new content that will be added each month?
That's the key thing for me - I always waited on a Weds for Chris's skidz, which is great - but I'd want more out of it than just that.Some of the other stuff was cool, love Spinelli, and Michelle's OK.
A couple of 7 min vids per week is pretty marginal.
Be great to have 60 mins per week. I have no problem with paying - but I want to pay for something relatively substantial.
It doesn't all have to be on location - some studio Q&A's, interviews, etc. - presumably much cheaper to produce.
ogrimwood said:
I will be subscribing as I absolute love Monkey's work, but I can't help feel that he'd be better branching off and doing it himself because especially across this side of the pond, the majority of /Drive subscriptions are for his work only and not the American muscle drivel. That way Monkey could lower prices, gain more followers and make his work more financially viable than being connected with the /Drive network.
But the viewing population in the US is far, far bigger.allgonepetetong said:
I'll admit I know very little about advertising but 2m hits generates £9.6k and 3.6m hits generates 18.4k in advertising revenue.
I'd say you need a new sales manager as this seems pathetically low income from such a high number of hits.
They only get paid if you don't skip the advert, skipping before the end means no charge is made to the advertiser, so they don't get their revenue either. Don't skip the ad, then they get about 20p!I'd say you need a new sales manager as this seems pathetically low income from such a high number of hits.
I can understand Chris' predicament, there needs to be some sort of revenue stream. However, I, for one (and there may well be others out there) are not prepared to pay £25, even if its for 8 vids a month. I just don't have the time usually to watch them and I do select what I find interesting.
What I would be more than happy to pay, though is, say, 50p for each video. £50p is nothing. OK, I may well end up paying more in a typical year but at least I have the flexibility to make that decision myself. I don't think twice for a 69p app, but one that is £10+? I'll usually just pass it by.
Ideally, I guess, one would have the ability to do both - choose a yearly subscription, or a pay per vid.
What I would be more than happy to pay, though is, say, 50p for each video. £50p is nothing. OK, I may well end up paying more in a typical year but at least I have the flexibility to make that decision myself. I don't think twice for a 69p app, but one that is £10+? I'll usually just pass it by.
Ideally, I guess, one would have the ability to do both - choose a yearly subscription, or a pay per vid.
cwinterb said:
I was an Evo print subscriber for years but didn't bother to renew a few months ago as I found I was just flicking through it most months. I've got a Netflix sub that costs me £5.99/mth that I rarely watch anything on, even though I keep saying I'll catch up with all the series I've missed. So, time to cancel that, ask for some box sets for Christmas and and sign up to Drive+. For the cost of half a pint of "premium" lager (in A London pub) per month. Seems reasonable to me.
I too have subscribed to Evo in print for years but the staff quality has fluctuated heavily, albeit increased again more recently. Mike Duff is well...duff but Catchpole is great.Perhaps I should follow suit and quit to spend on Drive+. I really want to watch Chris's content but I don't want to pay for the other crud (Shakedown is absolutely dire). It's not a big price to pay but I would be a lot happier paying for it if it was less.
£2.49 may not be much, but it is getting on for 20% of licence fee and the BBC produces a lot of product.
Asking people to pay puts a very different perspective on how you judge value.
I enjoy CH videos more than any other motoring content on the internet and think he is an excellent presenter. However, the drfting can sometimes be a bit one dimensional and before I would part with even this very modest amount each month, I would want to feel comfortable I am going to get value for money.
Asking people to pay puts a very different perspective on how you judge value.
I enjoy CH videos more than any other motoring content on the internet and think he is an excellent presenter. However, the drfting can sometimes be a bit one dimensional and before I would part with even this very modest amount each month, I would want to feel comfortable I am going to get value for money.
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