Keep left on the motorway?
Discussion
said:
This managed motorway idiocy will surely have to end when there are fatalities caused by breakdowns with no nearby refuge, or when the engineers "calculations were slightly out" and the hard shoulder starts to break up. It's folly, especially so when clips like that one from calibrax prove without doubt that the vast majority of drivers out there have nothing but contempt for the law and their fellow drivers. Round the feckin lot of them up and cull them, FFS. Idiots.
To be fair I am a big fan of managed motorways. The M6 is still s
t, but it's miles better than it was. Even a breakdown is dealt with with relatively minimal fuss as they inform you miles in advance.Edited by xxChrisxx on Saturday 2nd August 11:27
It's not really more complicated than it looks, it's simply that in this country the culture seems to be to avoid lane 1 and just switch off. On the continent it can happen but a quick flash of the headlights sees the culprit move over with no personal offence taken. In this country a flash of headlights is often taken as an act of aggression or makes the person who was flashed even less likely to move over and admit a mistake.
I undertake all the time these days, quite often with my hand on the horn.
I undertake all the time these days, quite often with my hand on the horn.
On my way home from work as the A3 southbound goes over the M25, the A3 becomes 2 lanes for a short while until the sliproad from the M25 to the A3 joins the A3 and this sliproad becomes lane 1 thus making the A3 a 3 lane road again
Frequently people on the sliproad; which becomes lane 1, will and usually without indicating just pull straight into lane 2 of the A3 and stay there, even if lane 1 is completely empty, it's very odd.
Frequently people on the sliproad; which becomes lane 1, will and usually without indicating just pull straight into lane 2 of the A3 and stay there, even if lane 1 is completely empty, it's very odd.
Isn't it purely because it does actually take a few brain cells to activate to drive correctly using Lane 1 whenever possible, then using 2 or 3 to overtake:
You need to be vigilant to watch for slower traffic ahead
You need to use your mirrors to assess the traffic in lane 2 or 3
Adjust your speed if necessary.
Indictae and safely make the manouvre.
Assess if lane 1 is clear to return to, make the judgement call if you can see a slower moving vehicle ahead to stay in lane 2 or 3 until that vehicle is passed as well.
Repeat hundreds of times per motorway journey, with the added pressure of deciding how to deal with the middle lane hoggers - undertake, and risk a side swipe, attempt to drive correctly but realistically you end up tied to lane 2 or 3 yourself.
Or sit in lane 2 or 3:
Follow the car in front.
Adjust speed where necessary.
Try and block in "that dick undertaking you"
Wake from your slumber to take your exit.
It's no wonder 90% of drivers choose the latter.
Driving using lane 1 wherever possible on a busy motorway is a pain in the arse as those that do are largely in the minority and it is added stress and alertness. I always do the best I can but on some stretches you may as well just stick to lane 3, then move across when the traffic clears a bit.
You need to be vigilant to watch for slower traffic ahead
You need to use your mirrors to assess the traffic in lane 2 or 3
Adjust your speed if necessary.
Indictae and safely make the manouvre.
Assess if lane 1 is clear to return to, make the judgement call if you can see a slower moving vehicle ahead to stay in lane 2 or 3 until that vehicle is passed as well.
Repeat hundreds of times per motorway journey, with the added pressure of deciding how to deal with the middle lane hoggers - undertake, and risk a side swipe, attempt to drive correctly but realistically you end up tied to lane 2 or 3 yourself.
Or sit in lane 2 or 3:
Follow the car in front.
Adjust speed where necessary.
Try and block in "that dick undertaking you"
Wake from your slumber to take your exit.
It's no wonder 90% of drivers choose the latter.
Driving using lane 1 wherever possible on a busy motorway is a pain in the arse as those that do are largely in the minority and it is added stress and alertness. I always do the best I can but on some stretches you may as well just stick to lane 3, then move across when the traffic clears a bit.
While once more stating that I fully support what the OP is saying, it is perhaps interesting to note that, in his video, he is keeping pace with a car in Lane 3 and has therefore made no better progress at the end of the clip than he would have done by being (part of the problem?!) in Lane 3.
(The advantage of easier access to his eventual exit from M23 is a factor here, though, I admit).
I have noticed this happen on several occasions during some of my perambulations along Lane 1 . . .
I concur, an opinion from any of the resident traffic police would be interesting.
Even though the middle lane hoggers are in the wrong, the OP was actually keeping a consistent pace with that Merc in lane 3, so arguably could have made the same progress using Lane 3 to "correctly" overtake the queue of morons in lane 2 and been at less risk of a sideswipe.
What if it had been a dual carriageway? Would the police expect you to just tag on to the back of the queue?
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
Edit: Cliftonite beat me to the same point above!
Even though the middle lane hoggers are in the wrong, the OP was actually keeping a consistent pace with that Merc in lane 3, so arguably could have made the same progress using Lane 3 to "correctly" overtake the queue of morons in lane 2 and been at less risk of a sideswipe.
What if it had been a dual carriageway? Would the police expect you to just tag on to the back of the queue?
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
Edit: Cliftonite beat me to the same point above!
If any of those cars on the video HAD pulled into lane one you'd have had a crash that any insurance company would regard as YOUR fault.
If I was in the middle lane and saw someone going much faster than me in lane 1 I'd stay put and AVOID the above.
Some of those cars are arguably in the correct lane, at junctions it makes sense to leave lane 1 to those exiting or joining the motorway. I usually move into lane 2 at junctions for this reason and often wish other people would to.
If I was in the middle lane and saw someone going much faster than me in lane 1 I'd stay put and AVOID the above.
Some of those cars are arguably in the correct lane, at junctions it makes sense to leave lane 1 to those exiting or joining the motorway. I usually move into lane 2 at junctions for this reason and often wish other people would to.
This really annoys me too, however I would say that up here (Central Scotland) the issue is nowhere near as bad.
I regularly travel the length of the M8, and while most is only 2-lane motorway, I think the standards are much better than they are in the south, speeds are generally much lower too. Only when its really busy can you benefit from staying in lane 1 as lane 2/3 concertinas.
I regularly travel the length of the M8, and while most is only 2-lane motorway, I think the standards are much better than they are in the south, speeds are generally much lower too. Only when its really busy can you benefit from staying in lane 1 as lane 2/3 concertinas.
If you stay in the outside lane on that stretch and intend to turn off at Gatwick as I did, you often find there is a queue on the slip road and out onto the carriageway, and so you would find it difficult to get into the left hand lane as people block you because they think you are "pushing in". So it makes sense to keep left early on.
Mind you, I suppose the chance of there being a queue could also be a reason for people sitting in the middle lane if they aren't coming off at that junction, because they won't want to end up stuck at the back of that queue.
Mind you, I suppose the chance of there being a queue could also be a reason for people sitting in the middle lane if they aren't coming off at that junction, because they won't want to end up stuck at the back of that queue.
vrsmxtb said:
< snip >
What if it had been a dual carriageway? Would the police expect you to just tag on to the back of the queue?
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
< snip >
So, if one is cruising along the dual-carriageway A1 at 70 mph in Lane 1, with the intention of making progress, and just over the brow of a hill, you see the result of some sort of elephant race.What if it had been a dual carriageway? Would the police expect you to just tag on to the back of the queue?
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
< snip >
There is a queue of vehicles in Lane 2, doing 50mph, awaiting their turn to amble past the vehicle some way ahead in Lane 1 that is doing 48 mph.
What do you do? Join the queue in Lane 2? Stay in Lane 1 just behind the car in Lane 2? Keep cruising along in Lane 1?
Does your answer differ if the queue in Lane 2 is 5 cars long? Or 10? 20? 50? Half a mile?
If your choice is to keep cruising along in Lane 1, then you will be looking to merge into Lane 2 nearer the (moving) blockage? ( "Queue jumping" and cue lots of "Road Rage"? ) If this is not the case, why do it? Remember, you are looking to "make progress".
This is a genuine query - it is the only motoring conundrum that after all these years I cannot get my head around!
What I want to know is this :
That video seems to me to be quite clear .
The number plates are easily legible .
Why would the police not view this video and then be able to send out 3 points and a fine to all the mlms in the film ??
Why do you need a police officer to actually stop and issue a ticket to every mlm.
I was once told that every inch of our motorway network was covered by a camera .
Why is the footage not reviewed and points/fines sent in the post ??
Not just for mlms but other offences as well .
Just think of the reduction in congestion if these people were actually forced to drive properly or get forced off the road .
That video seems to me to be quite clear .
The number plates are easily legible .
Why would the police not view this video and then be able to send out 3 points and a fine to all the mlms in the film ??
Why do you need a police officer to actually stop and issue a ticket to every mlm.
I was once told that every inch of our motorway network was covered by a camera .
Why is the footage not reviewed and points/fines sent in the post ??
Not just for mlms but other offences as well .
Just think of the reduction in congestion if these people were actually forced to drive properly or get forced off the road .
Cliftonite said:
vrsmxtb said:
< snip >
What if it had been a dual carriageway? Would the police expect you to just tag on to the back of the queue?
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
< snip >
So, if one is cruising along the dual-carriageway A1 at 70 mph in Lane 1, with the intention of making progress, and just over the brow of a hill, you see the result of some sort of elephant race.What if it had been a dual carriageway? Would the police expect you to just tag on to the back of the queue?
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
< snip >
There is a queue of vehicles in Lane 2, doing 50mph, awaiting their turn to amble past the vehicle some way ahead in Lane 1 that is doing 48 mph.
What do you do? Join the queue in Lane 2? Stay in Lane 1 just behind the car in Lane 2? Keep cruising along in Lane 1?
Does your answer differ if the queue in Lane 2 is 5 cars long? Or 10? 20? 50? Half a mile?
If your choice is to keep cruising along in Lane 1, then you will be looking to merge into Lane 2 nearer the (moving) blockage? ( "Queue jumping" and cue lots of "Road Rage"? ) If this is not the case, why do it? Remember, you are looking to "make progress".
This is a genuine query - it is the only motoring conundrum that after all these years I cannot get my head around!
Generally speaking if it's a long queue I will probably stay in L1 creep past the queue in L2 until I'm reasonably near the slower vehicle in L1. If there is a sensible gap in the traffic I'll clearly indicate and move out. If the traffic is bunched up, I'll probably just cruise behind the slower vehicle until there is a suitable gap.
If it is only a short queue bunched up "elephant racing" and it'll pass the slower vehicle fairly soon I'll probably just tag on to the end, even if this leaves L1 empty and clear for a short distance ahead.
Frustrating, but actually driving "correctly" these days often results in making slower progress than the morons.
vrsmxtb said:
I think the definition of undertaking needs some expansion in the highway code to account for today's busy motorway conditions and poor driving standards.
No it doesn't. there is no such thing as "undertaking" - except where dead people / funerals are concerned.I think you mean "overtaking on the left" and again it doesn't need expansion, it's quite clear:- Rule 268:
"Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right. "
Was the OP overtaking on the left? - Yes.
Was he in a lane of traffic in congested conditions, with his lane moving at a similar speed to lane 2? - debateable but I'd say No.
Was he "keeping up" with the traffic in his lane? Debateable, but I'd say No, because it was so far ahead of him.
calibrax said:
Look how effective it was giving police those new powers! 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh3pTwGNPMQ
As an example, let's focus on the white Fiesta in the middle lane - what exactly, specifically, did you expect the driver to do, calibrax?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh3pTwGNPMQ
It's a cultural thing, a culture of fking stupidity. I try and avoid undertaking where possible, I have been caught in positions where the traffic flow on the outside lane is 80+ and I can't build up the speed to join the lane safely (because unlike most I don't like to just shove my car into a lane and disrupt the flow of traffic) and I'll be caught behind someone in the middle with an empty inside lane. A couple of times I've lost patience and only when I've started to move to the inside the car in front will move over at the same time just to be a cock or I'll flash the lights and have some demented middle aged balding ahole with anger issues chase me up the M1 for example.
It really gets on my nerves that we have to endure months of agonising traffic so extra lanes can but put in so no bd uses them. Example is the 4/5 lane bit of the M1 as you go past watford to Luton. 5 lanes of tts driving at 65-70.
king stupidity. I try and avoid undertaking where possible, I have been caught in positions where the traffic flow on the outside lane is 80+ and I can't build up the speed to join the lane safely (because unlike most I don't like to just shove my car into a lane and disrupt the flow of traffic) and I'll be caught behind someone in the middle with an empty inside lane. A couple of times I've lost patience and only when I've started to move to the inside the car in front will move over at the same time just to be a cock or I'll flash the lights and have some demented middle aged balding ahole with anger issues chase me up the M1 for example.It really gets on my nerves that we have to endure months of agonising traffic so extra lanes can but put in so no b
d uses them. Example is the 4/5 lane bit of the M1 as you go past watford to Luton. 5 lanes of tts driving at 65-70.
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