Flemke - Is this your McLaren? (Vol 5)

[trackdemon]

Ford Focus RS: 1823mm
Ferrari 488: 1952mm
Porsche 911 C2L 1808mm
Vantage V8: 1865mm

Maths might be a bit off there. Still, what's 4 inches....?

[AlmostUseful]

I imagine a lot of it is down to perception, supercars are much lower than hatchbacks, both where ground clearance is concerned and also roof heights, so it's only natural that they look much wider when in fact the size difference is negligible.

[LaurasOtherHalf]

Not sure if it's been linked before in this thread but this just popped up in my YT feed;

McLaren at LeMans:Persuit of Perfection
https://youtu.be/n8qyI7LmYrA

A nice little documentary of the 24hrs win

[douglas111]

You're probably right about perception trackdemon and AlmostUseful.

It was only a regular Focus that it passed by.

[DeuxCentCinq]

trackdemon said:

Ford Focus RS: 1823mm
Ferrari 488: 1952mm
Porsche 911 C2L 1808mm
Vantage V8: 1865mm

Maths might be a bit off there. Still, what's 4 inches....?

Plus a Focus RS is obviously wider than the base model one.

[Rich_W]

Rob_R said:

Nice video here of McLaren's debut at Lemans here for those who haven't seen it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8qyI7LmYrA

It's posted the bottom of the last page!

Does no one EVER think "this might have been posted recently I'll check"

[McAndy]

Rich_W said:

It's posted the bottom of the last page!

Does no one EVER think "this might have been posted recently I'll check"

See something one likes.

Thinks, "I know, I'll post this somewhere that I think fellow enthusiasts may enjoy it."

In rush, so simply goes to thread to post, not to read.

Gets flamed for doing something nice because one DIDN'T READ THE INTERNET IN CASE SOMEBODY HAD ONCE POSTED IT.

*sigh*

[Rob_R]

Rich_W said:

It's posted the bottom of the last page!

Does no one EVER think "this might have been posted recently I'll check"

I did have a brief check through the last few pages to see if it had been posted but obviously missed it on the last page. I have deleted my post in the meantime anyway.

[epom]

As this is a thread about the F1 thought this video might interest a few on here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8qyI7LmYrA

[vincegail]

[douglas111]

epom said:

As this is a thread about the F1 thought this video might interest a few on here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8qyI7LmYrA

Thanks epom. Enjoyed that. Even watched it twice.

Surprised no one has mentioned it here before

I'm not very familiar with the 1997 attempt with the longtail. Was a second and third place that year equally impressive for a GT1 car? Looking at wiki it was only 1 lap behind after 360 or so laps. Perhaps less rain that year too?

Edited by douglas111 on Wednesday 8th February 09:50

[flemke]

douglas111 said:

epom said:

As this is a thread about the F1 thought this video might interest a few on here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8qyI7LmYrA

Thanks epom. Enjoyed that. Even watched it twice.

Surprised no one has mentioned it here before

I'm not very familiar with the 1997 attempt with the longtail. Was a second and third place that year equally impressive for a GT1 car? Looking at wiki it was only 1 lap behind after 360 or so laps. Perhaps less rain that year too?

I mean no disrespect to anyone, but the winning Joest Porsche was driven by Michele Alboreto, Stefan Johansson and Tom Kristensen, whilst the second-place McLaren which finished one lap down was driven by Jean-Marc Gounon, Pierre-Henri Raphanel and Anders Olofsson. QED

[flemke]

epom said:

As this is a thread about the F1 thought this video might interest a few on here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8qyI7LmYrA

Nice link, thanks.

In this race Mario Andretti finished second, which was the closest he ever came to adding Le Mans to his Indy 500 and Formula One titles (Graham Hill having been the only driver to achieve that).

Since then, Mario has said that the reason that he and his team didn't win is that their sponsor insisted that the car make an unnecessary pit stop near the end in order for the car's logos to be washed off and made visible.

[vincegail]

I've heard this before, but surely nobody can be that stupid? And it takes away a bit of the credit JJ Lehto deserves for his bloody fast rainy night stints as well.

[flemke]

vincegail said:

I've heard this before, but surely nobody can be that stupid? And it takes away a bit of the credit JJ Lehto deserves for his bloody fast rainy night stints as well.

Mario is on record as saying it:

Mario Andretti in Motorsport said:

1995

He may have retired from Indycars but Andretti had no intention of hanging up his helmet: Le Mans was a priority.

This new goal coincided with Porsche's return to top-line sportscar racing with the TWR-built WSC95. Andretti signed up to drive it at Daytona, Sebring and Le Mans, only for the firm to abandon the project after a late rule change.

Instead, a last minute deal put Mario in one of the Courage team's Porsche-engined cars alongside Bob Wollek and Eric Hélary. Le Mans 1995 will always be remembered for the McLaren F1's unlikely win, but Andretti maintains that Courage "lost that race five times over".

Andretti had shunted during the horrific conditions early in the race: "That was really stupid of me, but when I got back to the pits they weren't prepared at all."

The Courage may have dropped to 35th, but victory really was still in their grasp. The car was up to third by half distance, into second with less than two hours to go and on the lead lap in the final hour. "We were making up time on Sunday morning and I got on the radio telling them to send Wollek out on drys at the next stop. There was a definite dry line. Bob came back, and I have to say this verbatim: 'No f**king way. Andretti, you're crazy.' He did two laps before coming back for drys."

There was another incident that made Mario just as mad: "All the cars were caked in brake dust and Courage was very concerned about its sponsors. The car came in and sat there for two minutes while they washed it down. And how much did we lose the race by? A minute?"

http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/article/...

In fairness to Lehto, and to McLaren's achievement, the F1 was genuinely an adapted road car, whereas Andretti's car was a full prototype. Also, you will recall that four other F1s finished 3rd, 4th, 5th and 7th.


ETA: According to Wiki, and notwithstanding Mario's recollection, the F1's winning margin was actually 3 minutes, implying that even without the pit stop Andretti's Courage would have finished second.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1995_24_Hours_of_Le_...

Edited by flemke on Sunday 12th February 19:25

[Peloton25]

flemke said:

In fairness to Lehto, and to McLaren's achievement, the F1 was genuinely an adapted road car, whereas Andretti's car was a full prototype. Also, you will recall that four other F1s finished 3rd, 4th, 5th and 7th.

Slight mixing of the order - 05R, the final F1 GTR across the line, did finish 7th in the GT1 class, but was 13th overall.

The part I like most about that story was as an underfunded privateer team Hervé Poulain was quoted as saying they still felt like they had won. Better attitude than Andretti managed.

>8^)
ER

[flemke]

Peloton25 said:

flemke said:

In fairness to Lehto, and to McLaren's achievement, the F1 was genuinely an adapted road car, whereas Andretti's car was a full prototype. Also, you will recall that four other F1s finished 3rd, 4th, 5th and 7th.

Slight mixing of the order - 05R, the final F1 GTR across the line, did finish 7th in the GT1 class, but was 13th overall.

The part I like most about that story was as an underfunded privateer team Hervé Poulain was quoted as saying they still felt like they had won. Better attitude than Andretti managed.

>8^)
ER

Thanks for the correction.

Overall Mario has always struck me as being a fair-minded guy, although one can understand why his outlook might have been distorted by the frustration of his near-miss at Le Mans. He won Indy only once, in '69, notwithstanding that many would call him the best driver at Indianapolis for the two decades of the '70s and '80s.

My only other quibble with his attitude relates to his insistence that son Michael lost his Formula One ride with McLaren owing only to politics and money, rather than because some Finnish guy named Hakkinen might have had more potential.

[Steven_RW]

DeuxCentCinq said:

trackdemon said:

Ford Focus RS: 1823mm
Ferrari 488: 1952mm
Porsche 911 C2L 1808mm
Vantage V8: 1865mm

Maths might be a bit off there. Still, what's 4 inches....?

Plus a Focus RS is obviously wider than the base model one.

I thought that this gen focus RS was the same width as the regular production car. Something about Ford wanting the RS to come off the same production line so it had to have the same dimensions. iirc.

RW

[trackdemon]

Steven_RW said:

DeuxCentCinq said:

trackdemon said:

Ford Focus RS: 1823mm
Ferrari 488: 1952mm
Porsche 911 C2L 1808mm
Vantage V8: 1865mm

Maths might be a bit off there. Still, what's 4 inches....?

Plus a Focus RS is obviously wider than the base model one.

I thought that this gen focus RS was the same width as the regular production car. Something about Ford wanting the RS to come off the same production line so it had to have the same dimensions. iirc.

RW

Correct; maybe this has more impact :

Ford Focus Zetec 1.0t Ecoboost: 1823mm

[dobly]

Any update on the NSX-R going back to Takanezawa for a refresh?