Flemke - Is this your McLaren? (Vol 5)

[flemke]

Peloton25 said:

bobo79 said:

Talking of which I'm looking forward to seeing the final 720S with the proper headlights and not the joke ones on there at the moment...

If that's not sarcasm, the design is finalized and deliveries will begin fairly shortly.

>8^)
ER

Yes, that does seem to be the case....

[Mikeeb]

Hello Flemke

As ever a very complete response.

I have to admit I did not realise the LM's wheels were only 18's. I completely agree that going to 19's was a far more sensible decision going forwards. Both for tyres and brake improvements.

I fully agree with you that the trend for wheel/tyre combinations that give such little side wall are visually unappealing, as well as being horrible to drive on on 'normal' roads.

Thanks again

Mike

[flemke]

TA14 said:

Thank you for taking the time to reply with this summary. How did your suspension changes/updates work out?

Pretty well, actually (and I should hope so!). Handling more predictable, no lurching at the rear, put your foot down and the car feels fairly planted.
Suspension is too stiff for UK roads. I had an ongoing joke with Olaf Manthey. He wanted the suspension stiffer than I did. He kept saying, rhetorically, "I thought you wanted a sports car, not a saloon car!" Matt Prior of Autocar drove my car last autumn and agreed that it's probably too stiff for UK roads (whereas Olaf would say that it is not stiff enough). I have loads of adjustability in the dampers, and will tinker with them further when I get the time.
It took a lot of time and work, but I have no doubt that, for at least those of us who don't have the car control skills of Mika Hakkinen, the car is better now than it was as standard.

[dave1409]

flemke said:

After many months of delays, Momo said that they could do it, although they didn't really want to do it, and that the cost would be IRO £85,000, which seemed a trifle high.

That would be a very large trifle

[shirt]

Rich_W said:

Peloton25 said:

Rich_W said:

what IS a low temp rad and why does it need extra air?

On a modern McLaren the low temp radiators in the nose cycle fluid for the chargecoolers.

The high temp radiators are side-mounted by the engine and cycle engine coolant.

>8^)
ER

So it's Ronspeak for water cooled intercooler

So why not put them in the bigger scoops at the bottom of the bumper? Split the internal ducting, so half goes to the coolers and half goes to the brakes job jobbed and looks neater and also means you keep coherence to the existing/previous McLarens

LT and HT circuits are common parlance with engines. Granted not car engines but it's hardly ronspeak.

Lots to like in this car but I do think mclaren need to sort out their design identity, it's all over the shop.

[skidskid]

shirt said:

Rich_W said:

Peloton25 said:

Rich_W said:

what IS a low temp rad and why does it need extra air?

On a modern McLaren the low temp radiators in the nose cycle fluid for the chargecoolers.

The high temp radiators are side-mounted by the engine and cycle engine coolant.

>8^)
ER

So it's Ronspeak for water cooled intercooler

So why not put them in the bigger scoops at the bottom of the bumper? Split the internal ducting, so half goes to the coolers and half goes to the brakes job jobbed and looks neater and also means you keep coherence to the existing/previous McLarens

LT and HT circuits are common parlance with engines. Granted not car engines but it's hardly ronspeak.

Beat me to it! Its industry standard terminology, its just not something you read on PH very often because cars dont generally have them.

[Rich_W]

Peloton25 said:

The air-to-water intercoolers are located in the engine bay closely coupled to the turbochargers and intake manifold. The low temp radiators that cycle their coolant are located in the nose. You can see the tops of the intercoolers in this early factory photo of the 12C:

I was thinking about that today. It's the rads for the water that goes to the chargecoolers which are of course the "rads" for the intake charge. Funny how they didn't do that for the P1 which presumably generated slightly more heat for it's 900+HP.

Rich_W said:

So why not put them in the bigger scoops at the bottom of the bumper? Split the internal ducting, so half goes to the coolers and half goes to the brakes job jobbed and looks neater and also means you keep coherence to the existing/previous McLarens

Peloton25 said:

Because apparently it works better this way. They have done what you suggest on prior models but have indicated 15% better cooling efficiency with this new car's design versus the 650S it replaces.

>8^)
ER

The trade off is a car that is 115% more ugly that it needs to be...

flemke said:

Wow it looks good there. Can't beat a Army green Landie

flemke said:

You believe that the 720S has not been styled, and that its design is the result of pure aerodynamic functionality? I don't think so!

This is closer to being purely functional:



There is a shed-load of subjective, arbitrary styling in the 720S. The problem is that some of it doesn't look good.

I agree. There's a hundred different, more resolved ways to cool those rads. From better ducting or cooling fans or different locations or whatever. I'm sure McLaren CAN come up with better options. But they made a conscious decision to CHOOSE this solution.

But then with having seen the car for a few days now (in media) I'm going towards dogs dinner currently!

[Peloton25]

Rich_W said:

I was thinking about that today. It's the rads for the water that goes to the chargecoolers which are of course the "rads" for the intake charge. Funny how they didn't do that for the P1 which presumably generated slightly more heat for it's 900+HP.

Not sure what you are talking about again. There are at least three additional radiators in the P1 in addition to those found on the Super Series models - one large one that is centrally located at the front of the car, and two others at the rear behind each rear wheel, with visible fans to pull air through them.





>8^)
ER

[Storer]

Over the last 100 years we have become accustomed to the headlights of a car dominating the front of a car. With the advent of LED this no longer needs to be the case.

Manufacturers will be looking at how they can use the space in the 'face' of a car that has been freed up. Cooling, aerodynamics and pure design aesthetics will figure on the drawing board (computer these days!).

It will be up to the consumers what is considered to be a success.

I like the rest of the 720 but the front is not quite to my taste at present. It may be the way of the future, and will grow on us with time and familiarity.

Time will tell.

[McAndy]

A good point, well made. See also Tesla removing radiator grilles on more "run-of-the-mill" vehicular classes.

[Rich_W]

Peloton25 said:

Not sure what you are talking about again. There are at least three additional radiators in the P1 in addition to those found on the Super Series models - one large one that is centrally located at the front of the car, and two others at the rear behind each rear wheel, with visible fans to pull air through them.

I meant that they made P1 look sensible! Not fitting it with daft eye sockets to ram air at radiators

[flemke]

Storer said:

I like the rest of the 720 but the front is not quite to my taste at present. It may be the way of the future, and will grow on us with time and familiarity.

A bit like a fungus?

[Police State]

dave1409 said:

flemke said:

After many months of delays, Momo said that they could do it, although they didn't really want to do it, and that the cost would be IRO £85,000, which seemed a trifle high.

That would be a very large trifle

Flemke, your comment about the Momo wheel made me smile by reminding me of a recent conversation I was having with my wife. She has a Legacy Outback (2003-2009). And after many years of faultless service, she has decided to get something smaller. As usual, I asked her what car she had in mind as a replacement; she said, I have one or two in mind, but if you can find one with a Momo steering wheel, then I think I would be happy with that. Her Outback is a great car with many good qualities, but the exceptional steering wheel is the very best part of it. I'm not sure if it is too small or large for what you had in mind. But it may be worth looking into. There would be a certain design/styling continuity in choosing a steering wheel from that model too; but you probably know that already.

Here’s a pic

Edited by Police State on Friday 10th March 14:52

[flemke]

Police State said:

dave1409 said:

flemke said:

After many months of delays, Momo said that they could do it, although they didn't really want to do it, and that the cost would be IRO £85,000, which seemed a trifle high.

That would be a very large trifle

Flemke, your comment about the Momo wheel made me smile by reminding me of a recent conversation I was having with my wife. She has a Legacy Outback (2003-2009). And after many years of faultless service, she has decided to get something smaller. As usual, I asked her what car she had in mind as a replacement; she said, I have one or two in mind, but if you can find one with a Momo steering wheel, then I think I would be happy with that. Her Outback is a great car with many good qualities, but the exceptional steering wheel is the very best part of it. I'm not sure if it is too small or large for what you had in mind. But it may be worth looking into. There would be a certain design/styling continuity in choosing a steering wheel from that model too; but you probably know that already.

Here’s a pic

My mistake - I should have said Nardi. Duuuh.

Thank you for your suggestion, but I have dealt with the issue.

First I had a larger version/replica of the original Nardi wheel made up (not by Nardi!). Then after further changes to the set-up, by which we took out a lot of caster, I decided that I needed a wheel that was a bit larger in diameter than the original, but not as big as the one that I had had made up.
As I reflected on the situation, I realised that about the best wheel that I had ever used was what came in the 993RS Clubsport, and that happened to be the diameter that I wanted as well.
I got a new one of those, reshaped the central Y-section to make it a better design, had it retrimmed, and that's what has been on the car for several years now.
To finish the job properly, I should find a carbon-fibre shop that can make a replica boss with an electroformed logo: "F1/V12".

[Chebble]

Post-pub musings on a Sunday evening, so forgive me for asking a trivial question, but my curiosity is getting the better of me:

In the nearside luggage bin, there are what appears to be three buttons - what purpose do they serve?

Here is a picture for those that haven't seen them:



Secondly, in the door jamb, there are what looks like two black switches, one marked 'L', the other 'R', presumably for left and right - what do they do? If I had to take a guess, I'd say that they to open the storage compartments, but I'm probably wrong.



I'd be grateful if anyone could satisfy my curiosity.

[flemke]

Chebble said:

Post-pub musings on a Sunday evening, so forgive me for asking a trivial question, but my curiosity is getting the better of me:

In the nearside luggage bin, there are what appears to be three buttons - what purpose do they serve?

Here is a picture for those that haven't seen them:



Secondly, in the door jamb, there are what looks like two black switches, one marked 'L', the other 'R', presumably for left and right - what do they do? If I had to take a guess, I'd say that they to open the storage compartments, but I'm probably wrong.



I'd be grateful if anyone could satisfy my curiosity.

I think this image shows both areas:



Of the three buttons, the middle one is a cap that covers the modem port, the red one on the left activates the modem, and the right one is a cap that covers the trickle charger port.

Of the two levers, the one marked "E" unlatches the engine cover, and the one marked "L" unlatches the luggage locker cover on that side.

[AOK]

flemke said:

I think this image shows both areas:



Of the three buttons, the middle one is a cap that covers the modem port, the red one on the left activates the modem, and the right one is a cap that covers the trickle charger port.

Of the two levers, the one marked "E" unlatches the engine cover, and the one marked "L" unlatches the luggage locker cover on that side.

Sorry, off topic - can anyone work out what 1:24 model car is in that compartment? Would be fitting for it to be a McLaren F1 but having zoomed in I'm not so sure?

[Chebble]

flemke said:

I think this image shows both areas:



Of the three buttons, the middle one is a cap that covers the modem port, the red one on the left activates the modem, and the right one is a cap that covers the trickle charger port.

Of the two levers, the one marked "E" unlatches the engine cover, and the one marked "L" unlatches the luggage locker cover on that side.

Thank you. Having looked at a few more pictures, I can see the same two switches on the opposite door: as the F1 has two rear hatches, I assume that you can open them independently of each other, depending on which switch you pull?

It's an elegant design, and typical of the F1, to have them mounted somewhere that is so random, yet it just works.

[flemke]

Chebble said:

flemke said:

I think this image shows both areas:



Of the three buttons, the middle one is a cap that covers the modem port, the red one on the left activates the modem, and the right one is a cap that covers the trickle charger port.

Of the two levers, the one marked "E" unlatches the engine cover, and the one marked "L" unlatches the luggage locker cover on that side.

Thank you. Having looked at a few more pictures, I can see the same two switches on the opposite door: as the F1 has two rear hatches, I assume that you can open them independently of each other, depending on which switch you pull?

It's an elegant design, and typical of the F1, to have them mounted somewhere that is so random, yet it just works.

Not quite.

At the back, the main (forward) cover (with glass inserts) is above the engine, whilst the secondary (rearward) cover (with black aluminium slats) is above the cats/silencer system.

The "E" lever on both sides releases the main, engine cover. The design is such that main cover must be lifted before the rearward cover can be lifted. In effect, the release for the rear cover is to lift the main cover.

[shirt]

AOK said:

flemke said:

I think this image shows both areas:



Of the three buttons, the middle one is a cap that covers the modem port, the red one on the left activates the modem, and the right one is a cap that covers the trickle charger port.

Of the two levers, the one marked "E" unlatches the engine cover, and the one marked "L" unlatches the luggage locker cover on that side.

Sorry, off topic - can anyone work out what 1:24 model car is in that compartment? Would be fitting for it to be a McLaren F1 but having zoomed in I'm not so sure?

I'm guessing xjr15. The lower box appears to be a mini rc rx7