RE: RHD Ford Mustang begins testing
Discussion
PhantomPH said:
eliotrw said:
PhantomPH said:
Stick around - I expect these things will depreciate like a brick out of a first floor window. I would throw it in with the other fast Fords when it comes to depreciation - and they are not usually renowned for holding their value (trust me - I've had a couple!)
Looks at prices of:Puma FRS
Sierra Cosworth
Escort Cosworth
Ford RS200
Sierra RS500
Focus RS mk1
Focus RS mk2
Focus RS 500
Tell mre more about this Fast ford depreciation you speak of because I've never seen it.
I doubt these will bomb.
As it stands the price of a Focus RS MK1 and the Escort Cosworth is frankly RETARDED when placed next to the pricing of a R33 GTR Nismo or a Subaru Impreza P1 both far better and more special but also a lot cheaper.
Hardly comparing like-for-like, folks. The new Mustang is the same bracket of car as a Mondeo ST, Vectra VXR, Mazda MPS....the values will follow the same pattern.
Edited by PhantomPH on Tuesday 19th August 13:43
Anyway, I wonder what people who have never driven one yet contiune to slag them down will do now they can't moan about them being LHD.
Everyone moans about green cars and yet when ford and GM are willing to bring V8's to the UK they moan about them because they care more about what curtian twitchers and people they don't know think than buying a car and driving it.
So they get a 330D.
jamieduff1981 said:
PanzerCommander said:
J4CKO said:
"its the wrong badge" ?
Is it still the case that after all these years people still cant get enough of Audi's, BMW's and Mercs, i.e. "the right badge" ?
To be honest I think "Mustang" and "Ford" make quite a nice change after bloody years upon years of German dieselness, I don't think they are even that premium these days, resolutely mainstream nowadays. But I guess people will still choose a FWD 2 litre A5 for the same money, nice enough but, yawn.
Sadly I think so, it has probably gotten worse. Why else would people buy base spec Audi A3’s when you can have a top of the range Kia Cee'd with all the options for less money.Is it still the case that after all these years people still cant get enough of Audi's, BMW's and Mercs, i.e. "the right badge" ?
To be honest I think "Mustang" and "Ford" make quite a nice change after bloody years upon years of German dieselness, I don't think they are even that premium these days, resolutely mainstream nowadays. But I guess people will still choose a FWD 2 litre A5 for the same money, nice enough but, yawn.
Getting people out of frankly bland and boring looking “premium brands”. into Mustangs will be hard work because it has the wrong badge. People aren't educated enough about American cars; there are plenty of people that still think the Mustang I have has leaf springs on the rear and they are genuinely surprised when I tell them it has coil springs.
I can just see it on Top gear now:
“Yesssss the new mustang is very good, very good indeed. However, it isn’t a patch on the <insert generic £60k plus German super saloon here>, the Americans still haven’t caught up with the Europeans”
ks gets talked on PH about various attributes of cars which the posters claim to know a bit about that Joe Public has no chance frankly.I tend to pick up on Jaguar b
ks predominantely, because that's where a lot of my nerdiness lies at present but the number of PHers who think:The Jag V6 is the same as the Ford V6
The X-Type/S-Type are a Mondeo
The X-Type/S-Type are a Lincoln LS
There is no mid-size petrol XF available at the moment
There is no compact exec Jag planned to replace the X-Type
etc etc etc
is frankly depressing. If so-called car-enthusiasts can be so vocally ignorant then really how can anything without a German badge succeed? Even when PH is full of posts expressing disappointment in the latest BMW 3-series and how lack-lustre it is to drive, they'll still pre-judge anything non-German to be inferior and buy the German stuff anyway.
I got told my 944 had a van engine, and even better how I should watch the handling, what with the engine being in the back.
I got complimented on my "Nice Vectra" when I had a Saab 9-3.
I don't mind people being wrong if they aren't quoting it as gospel.
I suspect that if you see change out of £40k for the V8 you'll be bloody lucky. That being said doesn't bother me as I'm currently in the nay camp, it's not ugly but IMO it just looks too generic - a follower and not a leader. Happy to stick with my 'poor quality', typically st LHD V8 (though I'd be happy to have the upgraded engine and interior in mine!!)
t LHD V8 (though I'd be happy to have the upgraded engine and interior in mine!!)A GT V8 Mustang in the US starts at $31,210 - thats about £18k. They are not considered an expensive car by any stretch. Even if you add on 20% for VAT/rip off mode in the UK thats still less than £22k. Just depends how greedy/ambitious Ford want to go (or any other BS charges we get stitched up with here)!
RichwiththeS2000 said:
A GT V8 Mustang in the US starts at $31,210 - thats about £18k. They are not considered an expensive car by any stretch. Even if you add on 20% for VAT/rip off mode in the UK thats still less than £22k. Just depends how greedy/ambitious Ford want to go (or any other BS charges we get stitched up with here)!
yes but the actual cost to a Yank given their wages, is the equivalent of £31k(ish) to us. That being said I still think the UK will be ripped a new one when it comes to pricingRichwiththeS2000 said:
A GT V8 Mustang in the US starts at $31,210 - thats about £18k. They are not considered an expensive car by any stretch. Even if you add on 20% for VAT/rip off mode in the UK thats still less than £22k. Just depends how greedy/ambitious Ford want to go (or any other BS charges we get stitched up with here)!
The base spec isn't nice, so once you've made it into a place you'd want to be the US price is around $38000. That's £23750 - however as with all imported goods, you have to pay duty and VAT - it's not a rip off, just a fact of life. Add on £2375 duty and £5225 VAT and you're at £31350. Now as an official import, that should include dealer margin and shipping costs. However, they're doing a RHD platform, just for us - it will not come in all spec levels, so expect RHD V8's to be higher trim level and you'll be looking at £35000 minimum I reckon, more realistically £40k.Any more than that and someone somewhere is taking the piss though.
AngryPartsBloke said:
PhantomPH said:
eliotrw said:
PhantomPH said:
Stick around - I expect these things will depreciate like a brick out of a first floor window. I would throw it in with the other fast Fords when it comes to depreciation - and they are not usually renowned for holding their value (trust me - I've had a couple!)
Looks at prices of:Puma FRS
Sierra Cosworth
Escort Cosworth
Ford RS200
Sierra RS500
Focus RS mk1
Focus RS mk2
Focus RS 500
Tell mre more about this Fast ford depreciation you speak of because I've never seen it.
I doubt these will bomb.
As it stands the price of a Focus RS MK1 and the Escort Cosworth is frankly RETARDED when placed next to the pricing of a R33 GTR Nismo or a Subaru Impreza P1 both far better and more special but also a lot cheaper.
Hardly comparing like-for-like, folks. The new Mustang is the same bracket of car as a Mondeo ST, Vectra VXR, Mazda MPS....the values will follow the same pattern.
Edited by PhantomPH on Tuesday 19th August 13:43
Anyway, I wonder what people who have never driven one yet contiune to slag them down will do now they can't moan about them being LHD.
Everyone moans about green cars and yet when ford and GM are willing to bring V8's to the UK they moan about them because they care more about what curtian twitchers and people they don't know think than buying a car and driving it.
So they get a 330D.
The sad truth of the matter is that (especially the V8) will drop like a stone after a couple of years because of the nature of the beast. Their inherent value might creep up once they get a bit older, but if you imagine for one second that you are somehow buying a depreciation-proof future classic, a fool and his money will be quickly parted.
nicfaz said:
An interesting dilemma for Ford on the pricing. If it were me, I'd price as keenly as I was able - no sense in having a halo model if you only see one at the Ford dealer where he's (very reluctantly) had to take one into stock because of orders from on high.
Current prices in the US for the ecoboost coupe start at $25,170 and the V8 starts at $32,100. Using today's exchange rate, that works out as £15,071 and £19,221. Add on recovering the R&D of the right hand drive conversion, shipping, exchange rate hedging and any taxation consequences and what do you get?
If they could possibly keep it to £26,000 for the ecoboost and £32,000 for the V8 I think they'd sell many more than if they price at £30k and £36k. Here's hoping!
Add 20% for VAT.Current prices in the US for the ecoboost coupe start at $25,170 and the V8 starts at $32,100. Using today's exchange rate, that works out as £15,071 and £19,221. Add on recovering the R&D of the right hand drive conversion, shipping, exchange rate hedging and any taxation consequences and what do you get?
If they could possibly keep it to £26,000 for the ecoboost and £32,000 for the V8 I think they'd sell many more than if they price at £30k and £36k. Here's hoping!
I just don't get it I'm afraid.
In the US, at US prices, it would appeal to me.
Over here, the previous model just looked huge in the flesh. Not so much the actual dimensions, but the fact that it looked like a coupe enlarged by 150% in a photocopier - massively tall and bulky. And the budget US interior/spec at inflated UK prices doesn't look like value for money. Unless the new one is more compact and better quality, I can't see the appeal.
Finally, I'm not exactly image conscious but I'd cringe a little bit inside every time I had to admit to owning a Mustang. They just seem a but chest-wig in the UK.
In the US, at US prices, it would appeal to me.
Over here, the previous model just looked huge in the flesh. Not so much the actual dimensions, but the fact that it looked like a coupe enlarged by 150% in a photocopier - massively tall and bulky. And the budget US interior/spec at inflated UK prices doesn't look like value for money. Unless the new one is more compact and better quality, I can't see the appeal.
Finally, I'm not exactly image conscious but I'd cringe a little bit inside every time I had to admit to owning a Mustang. They just seem a but chest-wig in the UK.
I hope all the people dribbling over this Mustang have a good explanation for why they haven't already bought a £38,000 V8 Camaro....
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/chevrolet/camaro/8478...
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/chevrolet/camaro/8478...
DaveyBoyDave said:
They just seem a but chest-wig in the UK.
If it was the 70s/80s then I could see your point. Nowadays ? its just a car.Go to the states, you see young guys, 40s businessmen/women, old grannies driving mustangs. Its like a focus here.
All the "its only a $20k car in the USA" stuff is meaningless - its a different economy, in any case buying cars is relatively rare, most lease.
£35k+ is a lot of money, but might just get a V8 car. C63 ? 50k+ how much is a M4 or whatever BMW is on the shelves these days ? Lets come down a bit - Golf R ? specced M135?
I only hope the biggest effect the UK Mustangs have is to kick start the European manufacturers in to doing more interesting things because personally I think the current new car market is pretty dire.
The GT premium, the one you want, has a $36,100 starting price before options, fancy wheels and colours. The equivalent BMW in the US (price for price) a 328i at $1300 more, the premium V8 has more kit as standard, its quicker than an M3 for less money than a 328i.
The Eco boost premium with 300hp comes in at a starting price $29170 with the same level of kit as the GT. The base 2 series (228i) is $32100, or a 320i at $32750.
When you compare US prices to US prices you can see how much better value the Mustang is.
I got a car that I would want, GT Spec, Competition orange, 18" wheels (I hate big wheels) black leather, base stereo (It has one of the best sound systems in the world - its called a V8) 6 speed automatic transmission, all weather floor mats and it came out at $38,215, unfortunately it failed to give me the option for 3.73 gears (that are listed in the options). I just cannot see why if you were looking at this level of performance you would pay (by the time it gets to the UK) £20,000+ more for a heavier, less fuel efficient, slightly slower, more expensive to run European car.
The Eco boost premium with 300hp comes in at a starting price $29170 with the same level of kit as the GT. The base 2 series (228i) is $32100, or a 320i at $32750.
When you compare US prices to US prices you can see how much better value the Mustang is.
I got a car that I would want, GT Spec, Competition orange, 18" wheels (I hate big wheels) black leather, base stereo (It has one of the best sound systems in the world - its called a V8) 6 speed automatic transmission, all weather floor mats and it came out at $38,215, unfortunately it failed to give me the option for 3.73 gears (that are listed in the options). I just cannot see why if you were looking at this level of performance you would pay (by the time it gets to the UK) £20,000+ more for a heavier, less fuel efficient, slightly slower, more expensive to run European car.
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