Old bugger vs complicated dashboard controls
Discussion
I was about to start a new thread when I found this one. The loss of tactile & visual information from the position of the controls seems to be getting worse. I first noticed it on indicator stalks (Vauxhall, BMW).
It really is so useful to know what the indicator bulb is doing from the position of the stalk; and when it self-cancels a moving stalk will alert you earlier than a non-moving one.
The same is now true for wiper controls, main-beam/dipswitch stalks, and even worse - gear levers, particularly hybrids, but also premium brand auto selectors in non-hybrids. Actually the dip-switch problem one has been around for several decades (e.g. the VW camper from 1969).
Are there any other examples?
Will the manufacturers take any notice?
It really is so useful to know what the indicator bulb is doing from the position of the stalk; and when it self-cancels a moving stalk will alert you earlier than a non-moving one.
The same is now true for wiper controls, main-beam/dipswitch stalks, and even worse - gear levers, particularly hybrids, but also premium brand auto selectors in non-hybrids. Actually the dip-switch problem one has been around for several decades (e.g. the VW camper from 1969).
Are there any other examples?
Will the manufacturers take any notice?
crankedup said:
No engine oil dipstick on my BMW, having to ponce around with a crap OBC just to check my engine oil level I find a complete pita. I much prefer to dip the engine oil see the level and state of the oil.
Yes, who thought that was a good idea? Neither of my current ones has a dip-stick.
The E46 I recently sold had a dip-stick and a low level warning light just in case - that has to be a better set-up.
M4cruiser said:
I'm with you on this. The tekkies who design these things don't understand ergonomics.
Same goes for stupid round knobs for automatic gear selectors, push (or pull) button handbrakes, and the worst "improvement" of them all - the centralising indicator stalk on the Astra (and other Vauxhalls).
They are all technical solutions where there wasn't a problem in the first place.
Believe it or not this is the feature I most miss from my old Vectra! Same goes for stupid round knobs for automatic gear selectors, push (or pull) button handbrakes, and the worst "improvement" of them all - the centralising indicator stalk on the Astra (and other Vauxhalls).
They are all technical solutions where there wasn't a problem in the first place.
M4cruiser said:
I was about to start a new thread when I found this one. The loss of tactile & visual information from the position of the controls seems to be getting worse. I first noticed it on indicator stalks (Vauxhall, BMW).
It really is so useful to know what the indicator bulb is doing from the position of the stalk; and when it self-cancels a moving stalk will alert you earlier than a non-moving one.
The same is now true for wiper controls, main-beam/dipswitch stalks, and even worse - gear levers, particularly hybrids, but also premium brand auto selectors in non-hybrids. Actually the dip-switch problem one has been around for several decades (e.g. the VW camper from 1969).
Are there any other examples?
Will the manufacturers take any notice?
BMW have actually gotten better. The 2014 2 series I rented in the US back in 2015 had a terrible indicator stalk that would always spring back to centre no matter what (BMW indicators have the 3 click setting before going on full). However in my 17 plate 2 series, if you go for the 3 flash setting it'll spring back but if you want it on full, it wont so you get the tactile feedback from that.It really is so useful to know what the indicator bulb is doing from the position of the stalk; and when it self-cancels a moving stalk will alert you earlier than a non-moving one.
The same is now true for wiper controls, main-beam/dipswitch stalks, and even worse - gear levers, particularly hybrids, but also premium brand auto selectors in non-hybrids. Actually the dip-switch problem one has been around for several decades (e.g. the VW camper from 1969).
Are there any other examples?
Will the manufacturers take any notice?
I think some manufacturers are getting it. However a few (*cough* Audi, Tesla *cough*) think that more toys == more advanced. Sadly the auto press and mouth breathing masses think that interiors that maintain tactile switches and controls are "dated" and the manufacturers are happy to cater to them. Certainly this word has been used to refer to the interior 2 series simply because they maintain a lot of actual dials and switches rather than shoving the headlight functions down some obscure Idrive menu.
I do agree about the lack of a dipstick in the B58. Some will argue it's not needed but I cant see what is to be lost by not including it. You can have the sensors as well as the dipstick.
A family friend and posh old duffer (no, not me,honest) fancied a new Honda Civic. Well, it’s an improvement on a Jazz. However, to get the plush level of trim and the seats he wanted, he had to go for the Civic R. Three weeks later, the courtesy call came from Honda Reading: are you happy with the car? The response “ It’s wonderful, but I can’t switch the radio on” .
If you drive a series of cars from the same manufacturer you can see the increasing complexity creeping in.
Alfa 156 - knob for temperature, knob for fan, knob for direction. Very, very easy, you can make the winsdcreen demist without your eyes leaving the road.
Alfa 159 - dual zone (what the hell is the point of dual zone?), loads of little buttons, you need to look at the bottom of the centre of the dash to change the fan speed
Giulia - tiny little obscured buttons with funny little arrows. You need to look at the bottom of the dash and put reading glasses on to see them.
Alfa 156 - knob for temperature, knob for fan, knob for direction. Very, very easy, you can make the winsdcreen demist without your eyes leaving the road.
Alfa 159 - dual zone (what the hell is the point of dual zone?), loads of little buttons, you need to look at the bottom of the centre of the dash to change the fan speed
Giulia - tiny little obscured buttons with funny little arrows. You need to look at the bottom of the dash and put reading glasses on to see them.
rxe said:
If you drive a series of cars from the same manufacturer you can see the increasing complexity creeping in.
Alfa 159 - dual zone (what the hell is the point of dual zone?), loads of little buttons, you need to look at the bottom of the centre of the dash to change the fan speed
Bonus points for putting the controls in just the right position to be blocked by the sodding gear stick as well.Alfa 159 - dual zone (what the hell is the point of dual zone?), loads of little buttons, you need to look at the bottom of the centre of the dash to change the fan speed
Mr Tidy said:
crankedup said:
No engine oil dipstick on my BMW, having to ponce around with a crap OBC just to check my engine oil level I find a complete pita. I much prefer to dip the engine oil see the level and state of the oil.
Yes, who thought that was a good idea? Neither of my current ones has a dip-stick.
The E46 I recently sold had a dip-stick and a low level warning light just in case - that has to be a better set-up.
I noticed this thread is from 2014, but WTH, I'll bite.
I much prefer the rotary controls for the HVAC on my Polo than the buttons on the Boxster - hard to use the latter on the move without looking at them. I'm the same with stereos. Knob for the volume and to change tracks / stations - none of this touchscreen nonsense please (My old cars don't have steering wheel controls).
I much prefer the rotary controls for the HVAC on my Polo than the buttons on the Boxster - hard to use the latter on the move without looking at them. I'm the same with stereos. Knob for the volume and to change tracks / stations - none of this touchscreen nonsense please (My old cars don't have steering wheel controls).
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