RE: BAC Mono vs McLaren P1: Time For Tea?

[T0MMY]

That BAC Mono looks like a shedload of fun. I wouldn't really call it the David to the P1's Goliath though; given how specialised the Mono is for trackdays, I wouldn't be remotely surprised at it making a good effort to stay with a similarly well driven P1. In fact at most tracks (not F1 tracks) I'd genuinely be more impressed if the P1 could keep up with the Mono.

Edited by T0MMY on Friday 29th August 21:29

[mrdemon]

IF the BAC mono had 2 seats then I could go for one, but 1 seat and being the fastest on a track day seems a pointless car :-(

I love it but don't love it.

[Civpilot]

Love the Mono but as already pointed out the P1 isn't in 'track mode'. Apparently it's a totally different prospect when switched over and had he been trying, and in track mode I think this would have been a shorter video. The speed he left the mono standing on the straight, he was clearly backing right out in the corners.

I think it's pretty obvious that both of them were playing here specifically to get the video

And to answer another question about the P1's tyres.... McLaren only supply one set of tyres for the car, to be used on road or track. There is no track tyre option.

[Dave Hedgehog]

silvermog said:

Nice to see a P1 out on track, but this is Bailey mucking around, probably out with a passenger I'd guess giving them a taste of the acceleration. Play time.

He's a serious driver, but those lines aren't what he'd be choosing if serious around Silverstone, whilst the P1 isn't in track mode either, witness the lean, ride-height and spoiler position.

Nice video montage, great to see both being used and great promo for BAC (got a lots of viewers globally I'm sure), but don't try to make it what it isn't ...

I thought his was Reg was P4UL B?

[T0MMY]

mrdemon said:

IF the BAC mono had 2 seats then I could go for one, but 1 seat and being the fastest on a track day seems a pointless car :-(

I love it but don't love it.

That does seem like a major compromise, and perhaps not entirely necessary. One of the reasons I won't be getting one, along with not being even remotely near rich enough.

[T0MMY]

Civpilot said:

Love the Mono but as already pointed out the P1 isn't in 'track mode'. Apparently it's a totally different prospect when switched over and had he been trying, and in track mode I think this would have been a shorter video. The speed he left the mono standing on the straight, he was clearly backing right out in the corners.

I think it's pretty obvious that both of them were playing here specifically to get the video

And to answer another question about the P1's tyres.... McLaren only supply one set of tyres for the car, to be used on road or track. There is no track tyre option.

I would think even if he was trying the Mono would still be at least a little faster in the corners though surely?

[isaldiri]

Civpilot said:

And to answer another question about the P1's tyres.... McLaren only supply one set of tyres for the car, to be used on road or track. There is no track tyre option.

Not quite, standard tyres are some form of pirelli corsas but trofeos are now available and have been fitted by a few owners i believe.

[Civpilot]

T0MMY said:

I would think even if he was trying the Mono would still be at least a little faster in the corners though surely?

Actually I'm not so sure to be honest

Mono is obviously very light and extremely focused. This gives something around 520bhp/tonne. But it is also a very low down force car as the body only produces 80kg once into 3 figures. Yes mechanical grip is meant to be super high but is it really high enough to overcome the P1?

606 bhp/tonne (based on kerb weight) and a whopping 600kg down force, along with fully active aero and suspension. Stupidly high torque with the electric motor for drag out of the corners and road tyres specifically designed for the car by Pirelli to handle the high grip the aero creates.

Then compare the simple base line acceleration, both mid gear and from a standing start. Then the braking performance (The P1 will stop from 60mph in something like 30m, which is nuts?) Quick as the Mono is I would be very surprised if it could actually beat a P1 in full track mode being driven by a pro driver.

But good god do I want to see that fight!!!

[T4NG0]

T0MMY said:

mrdemon said:

IF the BAC mono had 2 seats then I could go for one, but 1 seat and being the fastest on a track day seems a pointless car :-(

I love it but don't love it.

That does seem like a major compromise, and perhaps not entirely necessary. One of the reasons I won't be getting one, along with not being even remotely near rich enough.

Personally disagree. After having owned a couple of caterhams, an Ariel Atom and Lotus 2-11 , I must have spent 99% of time with only myself in the car.....by choice, before Johnny no mates comments . You pay a fortune for these cars to have all weight removed, so why compromise by adding 50-100kgs ?

The Mono takes it a step further by ensuring the human weight is dead central. I attended the original launch and sat in the car. I was very tempted to buy one, but at £85k from a new start up it was a bit too much risk for me.

Stunning car though !

[Terminator X]

Had to laugh out loud at 2:30 as the P1 simply flies away!

TX.

[bozzy101]

Yep... It's a whole new thing.

Edited by bozzy101 on Friday 29th August 22:25

[thompson8]

I've actually been luckily enough to have been in this exact P1 with Mr Bailey around Donington. Mr Bailey is in fact a racing driver currently racing in the British GT championship in an Aston Martin funnily enough. He might not be the quickest driver on the grid but he knows his way around a race track quite competitively. Regarding tyres It was wearing Pirelli P Zero road tyres , Paul told me the only thing limiting the car around a circuit was the actual tyre.

P.S The thing is an absolute animal!

[braddo]

Terminator X said:

Had to laugh out loud at 2:30 as the P1 simply flies away!

TX.

That was the part that caught my attention the most! Literally, absolutely astonishing.

[405dogvan]

For all you have a P1 in road spec (and according to the guy in the Harris video is no 'slick' option/it wasn't part of the development program) likely carrying 2 people and a hardcore (and bloody expensive) trackday car there - the old "power to weight is king" thing takes a kicking I think.

The BAC has around 520bhp/ton - the P1 640ish so 20% more - but the difference in 'shove' looks a lot more than 20%, doesn't it?

Of course the P1's torque (not a) curve (but a bluff) is part of that too

I think the 'speed' thing is shown pretty well in this (otherwise dodgy driving central) video - see around 3:15 for 'ludicrous speed'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fLjjnU7REQ

[braddo]

The straights become a question of aerodynamic drag and power as well as power-to-weight. But still, the rate at which the P1 disappears is astonishing.

On a more real-world scale it's why a heavy GT3 911 can romp away from Elises and Caterhams on long straights even if the three cars are around the 300hp/ton mark - 100-150hp more power and a drag coefficient of only 0.29 for the 911. But under brakes and through tight corners, the lighter cars regain a big advantage.

[Schermerhorn]

Wow, that apex speed is incredible. So adjustable at the limit too.

Awesome.

[T0MMY]

Civpilot said:

Actually I'm not so sure to be honest
...

I just think the very light weight and uncompromised suspension/setup of the Mono would make the difference. I only say this because of a comparison that stuck in my head; that a road going MP4-12C is only a second quicker round Cadwell than a 150-odd bhp BEC so it must be losing a hell of a lot in the corners. Point being that an MP4-12C is probably closer to the performance of a P1 than a basic 1 litre BEC is to a BAC Mono if you see what I mean.

T4NG0 said:

Personally disagree. After having owned a couple of caterhams, an Ariel Atom and Lotus 2-11 , I must have spent 99% of time with only myself in the car...

To be fair, I do indeed very rarely take anyone else out but it is nice to have the option. I think if you own something a bit mad it's a shame to not be able to give your mates/missus a bit of a thrill from time to time and show off what it can do. If anything I take more passengers on trackdays than on the road actually as that is a real experience for anyone not into cars.

I took my dad out in my MNR recently which blew his mind as the fastest car he'd ever been in was his 2.0 tdi Audi (no joke). He actually started giggling.

Edited by T0MMY on Saturday 30th August 01:24

[danielj58]

That is absolutely staggering, there were a few moments through that video where I was truly agape at the sheer acceleration from the P1. The Mono looks like an absolute hoot too, particularly enjoyed the arm full of opposite lock towards the end, looks wonderfully compliant and balanced.

But the P1. Just wow. Makes you wonder how they'll top it in a decades time, perhaps some sort of crazy electroturbojet hybrid monster... It'll definitely take some out of the box thinking to make a leap as astonishing as that!

[Hitch78]

They're clearly just playing a little bit of tag in the corners as the P1's braking and lines are all over the place, both amazing cars though. Would love to experience the P1 Push of acceleration. Epic.

[coppice]

Before everybody dies in fits of excitement at the P1's go (which is sort of what you expect for a gazillion quid ) you do realise that a cheap as chips (relatively ) pre owned Formula Jedi, Formula Renault. let alone an old F3 Dallara would leave the P1 for dead around any circuit you care to name- except ones with extremely long straights and no corners to speak of ?