RE: BAC Mono vs McLaren P1: Time For Tea?
Discussion
ks.mgbond said:
P1 deffo not trying but I was more shocked that the Mono overtook it on a bend , which is not track day etiquette?
Indeed. Broke pretty much every trackday rule TBH.These people have enough money, why not hire the circuit privately to do this instead of involving others who are only there to enjoy their car...
RocketRabbit said:
mgbond said:
P1 deffo not trying but I was more shocked that the Mono overtook it on a bend , which is not track day etiquette?
Indeed. Broke pretty much every trackday rule TBH.These people have enough money, why not hire the circuit privately to do this instead of involving others who are only there to enjoy their car...
Hitch78 said:
RocketRabbit said:
mgbond said:
P1 deffo not trying but I was more shocked that the Mono overtook it on a bend , which is not track day etiquette?
Indeed. Broke pretty much every trackday rule TBH.These people have enough money, why not hire the circuit privately to do this instead of involving others who are only there to enjoy their car...
RacerMike said:
Remember ultimately the P1 is a road car. Whilst it is undoubtedly very quick, the 600kg downforce and 2.5G cornering load are peak figures. Very impressive peak figures that are far greater than any other realistically practical road car, however, remember that even something as antiquated as a Caterham can pull 1.9G peak lateral G.
Whilst Mr Bailey probably was not in 'Race' mode or indeed trying as hard as he possibly could, the huge difference in corner speed is unlikely to be inverted. The Mono is an incredibly specialised trackday focused single seater, and I'd frankly be staggered if ANY genuine road car could out corner it on proper (read PZero's or Pilot Sport 3s etc.) road tyres.
This doesn't take anything away from the P1, but let's not get carried away in to thinking it can corner anywhere near as hard as any dedicated trackday or race car.
Whilst I do not disagree with most of that by all accounts the P1 in full track mode corners in ways that serious and seasoned road testers are blown away by and unlike any other Hypercar. It's so fast in track mode compared to "sport" that some have even cried "cheat" with regards to it's track performance. Whilst Mr Bailey probably was not in 'Race' mode or indeed trying as hard as he possibly could, the huge difference in corner speed is unlikely to be inverted. The Mono is an incredibly specialised trackday focused single seater, and I'd frankly be staggered if ANY genuine road car could out corner it on proper (read PZero's or Pilot Sport 3s etc.) road tyres.
This doesn't take anything away from the P1, but let's not get carried away in to thinking it can corner anywhere near as hard as any dedicated trackday or race car.
Corner speed of the Mono may be higher (adding lightness should never be underestimated) but at the end of the day it would not count for much at all had the P1 been in track and being driven hard by someone determined to get a good track time. First wiff of a straight (any straight it seems) and the gap that opened would IMHO not have been clawed back by the mono. No matter how hard it corners. Especially at a track like Silverstone.
In fact take the Acceleration differential evident in that video, add to that the full race mode maximum aero and 2.5g lateral grip and I would actually wonder how many laps it would take for the P1 to catch up again. Not taking away from the Mono (money no object it would be my only choice as track car.. I love the thing!!) but that P1 is just mental down the straights and if it's corner speed is anywhere near the Mono (which I think it would be with track mode enabled) and it's quite frankly game over.
Although obviously both would be kept honest by a track modified BMW 1 series
Civpilot said:
...
Corner speed of the Mono may be higher (adding lightness should never be underestimated) but at the end of the day it would not count for much at all had the P1 been in track and being driven hard by someone determined to get a good track time...
I feel you may still be underestimating what effect the lightness hasCorner speed of the Mono may be higher (adding lightness should never be underestimated) but at the end of the day it would not count for much at all had the P1 been in track and being driven hard by someone determined to get a good track time...
I mentioned before that an MP4-12C was only a second quicker than a 1 litre bike engined kitcar round Cadwell but actually I was wrong...it is considerably slower (about 7 seconds slower!). That's an MP4-12C vs a road legal 150ish bhp 7 style kitcar. I know an MP4 12c isn't a P1 but a basic BEC isn't a Mono either.
Silverstone is a fast track and might favour the P1 but I suspect at a track like Cadwell the Mono would be faster than the P1, track mode or not. That's not taking anything away from it, just that it isn't built for the sole purpose of being fast around a track.
T0MMY said:
I feel you may still be underestimating what effect the lightness has
And what effect is this? Physics tells us that a cars maximum centripetal acceleration is a function of it's effective mass(physical mass + downforce) divided by it's physical mass multiplied by a tyre constant and the ratio between it's CofG and mean wheel track.This doesn't suddenly change because a car is "Light" or "heavy"?
Max_Torque said:
And what effect is this? Physics tells us that a cars maximum centripetal acceleration is a function of it's effective mass(physical mass + downforce) divided by it's physical mass multiplied by a tyre constant and the ratio between it's CofG and mean wheel track.
This doesn't suddenly change because a car is "Light" or "heavy"?
I mean the overall effect on its laptimes. Braking, accelerating, direction changes etc. How else do you explain the laptime comparison I mentioned? It sure as hell isn't just down to power:weight ratio (which the MP4 wins on anyway I assume).This doesn't suddenly change because a car is "Light" or "heavy"?
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