Regularly Travelling At 60 In A 30. No Remorse

[Pan Pan]

Mave said:

Pan Pan said:

This comes down to the old PC attitude, that if little johnny wants to be a driver/fighter pilot/brain surgeon/pop star etc, then he can be `because it is his right.

No, this comes down to roads being intended for the majority of road users, not restricted to driving enthusiasts who feel they have superior road skills and a right to travel at a speed that uses them,

The government set the limits low to allow the widest spectrum of road users to be able able to use the roads with a reasonable expectation of safety, Those who choose to drive at speeds much higher, or lower than the majority are the problem drivers on UK roads. But if people find they cannot drive to the low set limits, they must consider whether they should be driving a motorised vehicle at all.

[Mave]

Pan Pan said:

No. The `majority' of roads users tend to travel at, or slightly above the low set speed limits.
Not sure where you do your most of your driving, is it Bognor Regis?

The 85th percentile is the speed that 85 percent (ie the majority) of people travel at our below. That is a mathematical fact whether in bognor Regis or brands hatch.

[Mave]

Pan Pan said:

But if people find they cannot drive to the low set limits, they must consider whether they should be driving a motorised vehicle at all.

So you shouldn't have a problem driving at 30 in a 30 limit should you?

[speedking31]

This is now a 40, and steps up to 50 before the next set of junctions I am a conscientious objector.

[Pan Pan]

Mave said:

Pan Pan said:

But if people find they cannot drive to the low set limits, they must consider whether they should be driving a motorised vehicle at all.

So you shouldn't have a problem driving at 30 in a 30 limit should you?

I don't. but I do have a problem with a an un-observant, selfish, arrogant, low skill.driver, deciding they will arrogantly hold up all those behind them, who wish to travel at the legal limit, just because `they' don't want to travel at that limit.
If on a stretch of road, a driver has a large queue of vehicles (even buses and lorries) built up behind them, with no vehicles in sight in front of them. then `they' are the dangerous / problem driver for that stretch of road.

[Mave]

Pan Pan said:

I don't. but I do have a problem with a an un-observant, selfish, arrogant, low skill.driver, deciding they will arrogantly hold up all those behind them, who wish to travel at the legal limit, just because `they' don't want to travel at that limit.

That's fine (although I think you're being a bit paranoid if you think people are actively deciding to hold you up). I do also think that whilst you keep reciting the mantra that speed limits are set too low, there are occasions when that is not the case, and you should not expect people to travel at the legal limit.

[Mave]

Pan Pan said:

If on a stretch of road, a driver has a large queue of vehicles (even buses and lorries) built up behind them, with no vehicles in sight in front of them. then `they' are the dangerous / problem driver for that stretch of road.

How are they a dangerous driver in that scenario?

[Pan Pan]

Mave said:

Pan Pan said:

If on a stretch of road, a driver has a large queue of vehicles (even buses and lorries) built up behind them, with no vehicles in sight in front of them. then `they' are the dangerous / problem driver for that stretch of road.

How are they a dangerous driver in that scenario?

They are not specifically holding `me' up, but they do hold me, and large numbers of other motorists up when they choose to drive at a speed below the posted limit (when road conditions would safely and easily allow this)
But `some' drivers become so frustrated by a slow drivers arrogant, selfish behavior on some roads, to the extent they may carry out a dodgy overtake, which they would not do, or even have to, if the slow moving person at the front of a queue of frustrated motorists was travelling at an appropriate speed in relation to the road conditions / posted limit.
Very often this type of motorist bleats `I drive slowly, and have never had an accident' To which my response would be `yes, but how many have you caused?

[Mave]

Let's be clear about this, the frustrated driver carrying out a dodgy overtake is the dangerous one. No matter how inconsiderate, arrogant, doddery, slow, incompetent the other person is, there is only one person who makes the decision to overtake. No one "has to" overtake.

[Pan Pan]

Mave said:

Let's be clear about this, the frustrated driver carrying out a dodgy overtake is the dangerous one. No matter how inconsiderate, arrogant, doddery, slow, incompetent the other person is, there is only one person who makes the decision to overtake. No one "has to" overtake.

Yes they do `have' to overtake, when the driver in front is driving at speeds well below the posted limit, where conditions safely allow travel at the posted limit. If the driver in front was travelling at the posted limit there would be no need whatsoever to overtake. When they choose to drive at unreasonable speeds compared to those around
them (either much faster or much slower) They are the dangerous driver on that section of road, who is often the catalyst for any subsequent accident. If they cannot handle driving at the low set posted limits in good conditions, which most other `normal' drivers could be expected to do, they should NOT be on the road. the old saying applies if you cant stand the heat, stay OUT of the kitchen

[9mm]

Pan Pan said:

Mave said:

Let's be clear about this, the frustrated driver carrying out a dodgy overtake is the dangerous one. No matter how inconsiderate, arrogant, doddery, slow, incompetent the other person is, there is only one person who makes the decision to overtake. No one "has to" overtake.

Yes they do `have' to overtake, when the driver in front is driving at speeds well below the posted limit, where conditions safely allow travel at the posted limit. If the driver in front was travelling at the posted limit there would be no need whatsoever to overtake. When they choose to drive at unreasonable speeds compared to those around
them (either much faster or much slower) They are the dangerous driver on that section of road, who is often the catalyst for any subsequent accident. If they cannot handle driving at the low set posted limits in good conditions, which most other `normal' drivers could be expected to do, they should NOT be on the road. the old saying applies if you cant stand the heat, stay OUT of the kitchen

This is incredibly rare, even in Bognor Regis. A far more common scenario is someone driving at a sedate but reasonable pace but being harrassed by some utter cretin on a mission.

[0000]

There's nothing reasonable about your sedate pace if it holds up the traffic.

[Pan Pan]

9mm said:

Pan Pan said:

Mave said:

Let's be clear about this, the frustrated driver carrying out a dodgy overtake is the dangerous one. No matter how inconsiderate, arrogant, doddery, slow, incompetent the other person is, there is only one person who makes the decision to overtake. No one "has to" overtake.

Yes they do `have' to overtake, when the driver in front is driving at speeds well below the posted limit, where conditions safely allow travel at the posted limit. If the driver in front was travelling at the posted limit there would be no need whatsoever to overtake. When they choose to drive at unreasonable speeds compared to those around
them (either much faster or much slower) They are the dangerous driver on that section of road, who is often the catalyst for any subsequent accident. If they cannot handle driving at the low set posted limits in good conditions, which most other `normal' drivers could be expected to do, they should NOT be on the road. the old saying applies if you cant stand the heat, stay OUT of the kitchen

This is incredibly rare, even in Bognor Regis. A far more common scenario is someone driving at a sedate but reasonable pace but being harrassed by some utter cretin on a mission.

A person wishing to legally travel at the posted limit on a section of road, where road conditions allow is not an utter cretin. A driver dawdling at low speed without having regard of the effect they are having on road users and traffic around them is in fact the utter cretin.

[Rincewind209]

Of course not everyone's in a hurry. But if your view of anyone with 3 points is that they are one rung below rapists you really should read your copy of the Telegraph on the bus.

The OP was commenting on the irrational changing of road speed classification, this happens everywhere. We really shouldn't have to put up with it.

[Countdown]

9mm said:

This is incredibly rare, even in Bognor Regis. A far more common scenario is someone driving at a sedate but reasonable pace but being harrassed by some utter cretin on a mission.

Completely agree.

Pan Pan said:

A person wishing to legally travel at the posted limit on a section of road, where road conditions allow is not an utter cretin. A driver dawdling at low speed without having regard of the effect they are having on road users and traffic around them is in fact the utter cretin.

It isn't just "road conditions". You need to factor in car capabilities and driver capabilities. Try driving a 1 litre Yaris on a steep twisty road across the Pennines with 4 adults in the car. Soft suspension, skinny tyres, and average brakes mean that it's very hard to keep the car anywhere near the NSL AND drive safely. The inadequate nob in the 3-series behind doesn't always appreciate this and ends up either tailgating or doing a cock-overtake.

[Pan Pan]

Countdown said:

9mm said:

This is incredibly rare, even in Bognor Regis. A far more common scenario is someone driving at a sedate but reasonable pace but being harrassed by some utter cretin on a mission.

Completely agree.

Pan Pan said:

A person wishing to legally travel at the posted limit on a section of road, where road conditions allow is not an utter cretin. A driver dawdling at low speed without having regard of the effect they are having on road users and traffic around them is in fact the utter cretin.

It isn't just "road conditions". You need to factor in car capabilities and driver capabilities. Try driving a 1 litre Yaris on a steep twisty road across the Pennines with 4 adults in the car. Soft suspension, skinny tyres, and average brakes mean that it's very hard to keep the car anywhere near the NSL AND drive safely. The inadequate nob in the 3-series behind doesn't always appreciate this and ends up either tailgating or doing a cock-overtake.

Not everyone drives across the Pennines 4 up in a Yaris., So this a a bit of dubious what aboutery.
My recollection of driving a Yaris was that it was a competent, agile little car, with handling and brakes more than adequate to drive on `most' UK roads at the low set posted limits. if it wasn't, it would not be allowed to be sold in the UK, Power though, may be an issue when fully loaded, but no one expects a fully loaded Yaris to perform the same as an unloaded 3 series. I wouldn't have the slightest problem staying behind such a car if the driver was doing a reasonable job of at least trying to keep up a reasonable pace.

[anonymous-user]

Rincewind209 said:

Of course not everyone's in a hurry. But if your view of anyone with 3 points is that they are one rung below rapists you really should read your copy of the Telegraph on the bus.

The OP was commenting on the irrational changing of road speed classification, this happens everywhere. We really shouldn't have to put up with it.

OP said:

Do my best not to speed but have caught myself travelling at the old limit (and then some)

It doesn't really happen 'everywhere' and read what the OP said. It is more about the inability to stick a speed limit which is a bit worrying. Oh and it's the Daily Mail that you want to quote, not the Telegraph.

[Countdown]

Pan Pan said:

Not everyone drives across the Pennines 4 up in a Yaris., So this a a bit of dubious what aboutery.

Happened to me recently which is why it came to mind. It coincided with 2 of the worst incidences of cockery that I've ever encountered.

(i) I'm waiting behind an Audi A6 who is indicating to turn right. Bloke behind cant be bothered to wait so drives up onto the pavement, passes me and A6 on the left, and back onto the road.

(ii) A6 turns left and I set off. This was on the falt/level so i was up to 30mph fairly quickly. But not quickly enough for the bloke in the Matiz behind me who decides to overtake. By "overtake" I mean inch past me (speed differential must have been 3mph) as we approach a blind right-hand bend, with him on the inside. I notice a bus coming the other way and braked so he could get past but could not believe what a dickish manouevre it was.

Both the above made me wonder whether some drivers feel it an affront to their manhood to follow a smaller / less powerful car. It was just bonkers.

[anonymous-user]

Countdown said:

Happened to me recently which is why it came to mind. It coincided with 2 of the worst incidences of cockery that I've ever encountered.

(i) I'm waiting behind an Audi A6 who is indicating to turn right. Bloke behind cant be bothered to wait so drives up onto the pavement, passes me and A6 on the left, and back onto the road.

(ii) A6 turns left and I set off. This was on the falt/level so i was up to 30mph fairly quickly. But not quickly enough for the bloke in the Matiz behind me who decides to overtake. By "overtake" I mean inch past me (speed differential must have been 3mph) as we approach a blind right-hand bend, with him on the inside. I notice a bus coming the other way and braked so he could get past but could not believe what a dickish manouevre it was.

Both the above made me wonder whether some drivers feel it an affront to their manhood to follow a smaller / less powerful car. It was just bonkers.

What on earth were you driving where a "matiz" is the more powerful / faster car? Even the average John Deer Tractor can have one of those in a straight line these days.... ;-)

[Countdown]

Max_Torque said:

What on earth were you driving where a "matiz" is the more powerful / faster car? Even the average John Deer Tractor can have one of those in a straight line these days.... ;-)

I was in the Yaris (my daughter's). The matiz wasn't more powerful which is why i couldn't understand why the numpty went for an overtake.